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View Full Version : Anything for Vampire Counts on the horizon?



New Cult King
24-05-2005, 08:07
The reason I ask is I am considering making a small Undead army, and don't want to if there is new stuff coming out in say 18 months time or sooner...

Jedi152
24-05-2005, 09:05
Unless you count zombie pirates, i wouldn't count on anything major until the entire army gets a re-vamp (ahahahaa!)

Which is annoying because much of the range (bat swarms, fell bats, those godawful black knights) is absoutely dire.

NetGuru
24-05-2005, 10:04
Unless you count zombie pirates, i wouldn't count on anything major until the entire army gets a re-vamp (ahahahaa!)

Which is annoying because much of the range (bat swarms, fell bats, those godawful black knights) is absoutely dire.

You forgot the 'dire' wolves. Never has a miniature had a more fitting name....

Griefbringer
24-05-2005, 10:40
I wouldn't really expect any current army book to get a re-vamp before late 2006 earliest.

rkunisch
24-05-2005, 11:12
Vampire Counts always looked like a balanced book to me. There are a lot of wonderful minis out there. If it were up to me to decide, I would say they are in no pressing need for new rules and/or minis.

There is still this vague rumour about a Nagash campaign. Nothing substantial, but may be there will be something. This would be an opportunity to release some new minis as well (apart from a new Nagash model of course).

Have fun,

Rolf.

6th and Final Champion
24-05-2005, 14:57
Id like to see either the new blood line or a blood dragon special character. Definately new Black Knight models. The current ones are so hard to look at...

Scythe
24-05-2005, 17:17
Why is everyone so fed up with black knights? Sure, they are not the best models done by gw, and they start to age, but I wouldn't call them really bad models. Why does everyone dislike them so much?

Furthermore, most models in an undead army can be converted in a lot of ways; hence the new releases will probably have to wait a little longer. Plus the basic 2 plastic sets are still very nice.

EvC
24-05-2005, 23:52
I'm guessing it's just the skeletal steeds they come with that people don't like. Otherwise they're not bad.

If you wanna make a small udnead army, don't worry about it getting new models- make a theme and convert your own! It's much more fun that way.

New Cult King
25-05-2005, 00:44
I'm considering converting one of the plastic Chaos Warriors to represent Krell...

I don't mind most of the range - the skellington horses are pretty poor, but the plastic Skellies and Zombies rule muchly.

This is good news... I will be assembling about 500pts worth, forthwith.

Question though, since I don't have the book - Can I lead the army with something other than a Vampire? None of the bloodlines appeal to me, except maybe the Necrarchs but their minis are ugly. I'd like to lead the army with a Necromancer, but I've heard they're pretty weak...

therisnosaurus
25-05-2005, 05:49
yup, you don't need to have vampires and an all necro army is pretty nasty- take a level 4 and 3 level 2's, a good hundred or so zombies and then lots of flanking wolves and wotnots. lots of fun.

Maxis Lithium
25-05-2005, 06:11
I find that I take the necro army more often then not.it's cheap and effective, points wise.

I heared that, besides the regiment or renown that the zombie pirates got (which was way over priced in the book, and poorly worded.) they will eventually have a full army list. in the next 2 WDs.

I like the VC list, but I would really like to see a re-work of the Necrarch, as they just don't seem the "master" necromancers they're supposed to be. you pay for alot of bulk you don't need, and they don't really have the punch to justify taking them over necros.

I did convert my own Black Nights,. but I do actually like the Black night models. They're interesting. I would really LOVE to use LoTR models for them, but of course, they're not legal (in a literal sense).

I'm waiting to see what the pirate list looks like, if it happens at all, before I invest further in my Vamps.

Scythe
25-05-2005, 08:14
I'm considering converting one of the plastic Chaos Warriors to represent Krell...

I don't mind most of the range - the skellington horses are pretty poor, but the plastic Skellies and Zombies rule muchly.

This is good news... I will be assembling about 500pts worth, forthwith.

Question though, since I don't have the book - Can I lead the army with something other than a Vampire? None of the bloodlines appeal to me, except maybe the Necrarchs but their minis are ugly. I'd like to lead the army with a Necromancer, but I've heard they're pretty weak...

Acctually, in games under 2000 pts, you're forced to lead your army with a necromacer (or poorly invest your pts in a necrach thrall). Even in 2000 pts and over, you can lead your army with a necromancer lord, like others pointed out, which can be quite effective. You lose the combat power of vampires, but usually have extreme magic power to make up for that. And you can still take some grave guard, black knights or even wight lords to bolster your combat power (tough obviously those are no match for a vampire, but then few things are).

Jedi152
25-05-2005, 08:32
I don't mind most of the range - the skellington horses are pretty poor, but the plastic Skellies and Zombies rule muchly.
The only major problem with the skellies is that the body comes in two parts, the ribcage and the legs. These have to be glued together by just the spine.

As you can imagine, the longest a skeleton stays together is about a few games, unless you pin the bodies together.

Very poor mini design, they could have so easily made the body one piece.

Griefbringer
25-05-2005, 09:00
I'm waiting to see what the pirate list looks like, if it happens at all, before I invest further in my Vamps.

I took yesterday a look at the latest UK/Northern Europe WD, and it contained the Zombie pirate list. Notice that it is not an add-on to VC lists, but a completely inpedendent list (you don't need VC army book to go with it).

Scythe
25-05-2005, 09:28
The only major problem with the skellies is that the body comes in two parts, the ribcage and the legs. These have to be glued together by just the spine.

As you can imagine, the longest a skeleton stays together is about a few games, unless you pin the bodies together.

Very poor mini design, they could have so easily made the body one piece.

Are you kidding me? I love that design. Unlike all those new models with fused torso/legs, the skeleton design makes sure the models can be posed in almost every way, which makes for very interesting and dynamic units, unlike sets like the new chaos warriors, beastmen or man at arms. And I've never had any problems with breaking those parts of; the spears on a lot of other models are way more a pain. Imho I concicer the skeleton box as one of the best (if not the best) fantasy plastic box out there.

Jedi152
25-05-2005, 09:37
Maybe its just me then.

I have the old style carrying case which is very unkind to my skeletons. I'm going to pin them all i think.

Scythe
25-05-2005, 11:05
Or maybe it's just that I'm comparing them to my Tyranids army, which is really difficult to transport with all those big monsters and large warriors (and ever saw those hormagaunts? The feet/base connection just askes to be broken...) ;)

Avian
25-05-2005, 12:17
Are you kidding me? I love that design. Unlike all those new models with fused torso/legs, the skeleton design makes sure the models can be posed in almost every way, which makes for very interesting and dynamic units, unlike sets like the new chaos warriors, beastmen or man at arms.
But unlike these other models, even if the skellies came with legs and torso in one piece, it would be no problem at all to slice through the spine so that you could rotate the torso if you wanted to. Works great with skellies, doesn't work at all with Chaos Warriors.

There is simply no reason not to make it in one piece instead of two, they'd still be just as easy to convert.

Scythe
25-05-2005, 12:47
True I guess. However changing what's essentially a good boxed set shouldn't be high on gws priority list. There are tons of models who need new versions way more than skeletons. The 2 part torso-legs works good enough, and I can live with it.

Lordmonkey
25-05-2005, 13:54
True I guess. However changing what's essentially a good boxed set shouldn't be high on gws priority list. There are tons of models who need new versions way more than skeletons. The 2 part torso-legs works good enough, and I can live with it.

Agreed. Also, if noone already noticed, since the spines are (by GW's design) joined using an "L" shaped join, and taking into consideration the lightweight of the miniatures (being skeletons) they are a lot more stable than a typical flat surface area.

Personally, my skeletons (and zombies) suffer from arm breakages more than anything else, and that was only with that crappy red foam i used to have in my GW case.

Math Mathonwy
25-05-2005, 20:11
The only major problem with the skellies is that the body comes in two parts, the ribcage and the legs. These have to be glued together by just the spine.

As you can imagine, the longest a skeleton stays together is about a few games, unless you pin the bodies together.

Very poor mini design, they could have so easily made the body one piece.
:confused:

I've used mine for ages now and had only one skeleton come apart from the spine. No pinning, just GW plastic glue. And my transportation box for skellies is a cardboard box without any foam or other padding - I just chuck them all in in a chaos. Being plastic the paint stays on fully - and I haven't even varnished them. Remarkably durable to my mind. So really, what on earth do you do with them? Throw them across the room :p?

m1s1n
25-05-2005, 21:05
I actually prefer the multi-part skeletons. Even if it would be extremely easy to cut a one-piece Skellie into multiple parts, I still like the variety given through choices. Additionally, I find that a lot of my Skellies are converted, and having them in small sectional pieces means that my conversions become less wastefull--keeping the leftovers on the sprue is far more organized than a jumbled box.

I personally think that the Vampire Counts are pretty low priority for any type of re-release. Maybe we will get some new vampire models--but I don't think we will see a new bloodline any time soon. In my eyes there really is no need, enough variety is provided by the already existing list.

EvC
25-05-2005, 23:20
Ar the zombie pirates supposed to take the place of the "new bloodline", anyway? I always wondered...

I actually glued my skellies with superglue, and I transport them in cruddy boxes with tissue support. And I've never had a single one split at the waist.

Lordmonkey
26-05-2005, 01:37
I re-read the "article" by Alessio Cavatore when they released the VC book (i say article, but its more like "please dont kill us - heres why"). At the end he talked about the new strigoi bloodline, and then also mentioned he'd chosen a new bloodline which they will release sometime in the "future". Whatever he means by that.

Just a thought :p

macbeth
26-05-2005, 07:43
As for the new Bloodline, maybe it is Harkon's? In the article with his army list, they say that he came from "an unknown bloodline". On top of that, in the past, they said that athe new bloodline they planned to release was about a vampire "who had drank the blood of something he should not have." In Harkon's story, he drank the blood of no one, but he tried to steal something he should not have, and thus lost all his powers...


I agree that the models of the VC are poor. And that is maybe the problem. Their rules are perfect, the models are the only problem, and I think that GW will privilege rule problems against mini problems as regards re-doing old armies... Plus, since there has been army books, the Undead have had four of them (Undead 4th edition, Vampire Counts 5th edition, Vampire Counts 6th edition, Tomb Kings 6th edition). When you compare, Empire, O&G, Dwarves or Skaven only had 2 of them...
I've always played Undeads (and then VC), and I would love to see a new book, just to shed some more light on them, but I doubt it will happen until a long time...

New Cult King
26-05-2005, 08:04
Skellingtons & Zombies = teh win. The Lahmian Vammiresses look pretty good, but the other bloodlines are rather dated-looking. The Fell Bats and Dire Wolves are pretty bad, and the Grave Guard, while very cool in concept, are starting to look old too...

Ah well, if I play a Necromancer army, I'm going to need lots of Skellingtons and Zombies, so that's okay... I can paint Skells really quickly, and Zombies look... interesting, to say the least ;)

Scythe
26-05-2005, 08:19
I agree that the models of the VC are poor. And that is maybe the problem. Their rules are perfect, the models are the only problem, and I think that GW will privilege rule problems against mini problems as regards re-doing old armies... Plus, since there has been army books, the Undead have had four of them (Undead 4th edition, Vampire Counts 5th edition, Vampire Counts 6th edition, Tomb Kings 6th edition). When you compare, Empire, O&G, Dwarves or Skaven only had 2 of them...
I've always played Undeads (and then VC), and I would love to see a new book, just to shed some more light on them, but I doubt it will happen until a long time...

Not really. GW makes moeny with selling models, not with selling rules. Wether an army book gets redone is more affected trough its models as trough its rules. If the model line needs a mayor revamp, you can put money on a new army book as well. It also works the oter way round; look at the new HE models; they were made cause HE are such a popular army, while the much groaned over HE army book stays the same. Money is the first priority of gw (logical; it should be for any company), and new models make money, new rules do not (or less).

Avian
26-05-2005, 09:44
As for the new Bloodline, maybe it is Harkon's? In the article with his army list, they say that he came from "an unknown bloodline".
It didn't say that, it said that they didn't know which bloodline it was. He has von Carstein stats as far as I can tell.
Not to mention that Harkon doesn't have a bloodline at all, having apparently sired no offspring since he came to the new world.


Regarding the missing bloodline, rumours have it that they did some work on it, but couldn't come up with something to make it distinct enough from the other bloodlines.

Griefbringer
26-05-2005, 10:31
Not to mention that Harkon doesn't have a bloodline at all, having apparently sired no offspring since he came to the new world.


Perhaps the choices available were not to his liking - though vampire pygmies would be rather interesting! :skull:

EvC
26-05-2005, 13:08
Vampire Amazons though, I know I'd hit it!

On VC rules, the only things I think that need a revamp (OHO I'M ON FIRE TODAY) in my opinion are combat resolution with characters (limit them to one lost wound per round they lose) and zombies, who need to be more hordey. Like getting to fight even after getting killed (Simialr to the Death Dealer spell, but automatically), or fighting in two ranks at all times (With some sort of negative, like any zombie that takes a hit can't fight back that round).

Avian
26-05-2005, 13:28
combat resolution with characters (limit them to one lost wound per round they lose)
If you are losing more than one wound to CR with an undead character you are doing it wrong and you deserve whatever you're getting. :p

EvC
26-05-2005, 16:50
Possibly correct. In one game recently, I charged my general on his nightmare into the flank of some knights who were tied up against some zombies. However, because the knights managed to slice up the zombies so effectively, I lost the combat resolution by about four and my general died on the spot! Whereas if the zombies hadn't been there two wounds on my side would have drawn the combat. That was clearly a rash decision on my part, but being punished so badly for making a bold move like that is a bit harsh, I think! Were I another race then the general would have had the opportunity to take a leadership test and even if he'd failed that he couldn't have died from it with the knights still engaged in combat.

Okay, that was clearly my fault, but it's not liked I charged a Bloodthirster or something really stupid like that ;)

Scythe
26-05-2005, 16:53
That's why an undead general should be always part of a unit, always. Learn from you mistakes I'd say ;)

Unless of course you have a count flying around on a winged nightmare.

Starvid
26-05-2005, 17:53
Godawful Black Knigts: Yes they do look awful. I use Empire Knights with Knight Errant heads, and paint them pale. Voila, vampire knights! (Or thrall knights, for those of you who know about the World of Darkness).

Lordmonkey
26-05-2005, 19:13
I quite like the BK models, although it sucks that you have to convert barding for them. The grave guard on the other hand SUCK ASS, which is why i converted my own.
VC don't need a new book, but I would like to see more done with the metal models...

As an afterthought, it would be cool to see a few official lists based on particular bloodlines (like ary of sylvania) since the ones in the back of the book aren't official

Just a thought :p

Griefbringer
26-05-2005, 19:15
Well, there already is an official list for Sylvania, in the SoC book.

Lordmonkey
26-05-2005, 19:18
i know dude, i meant for other bloodlines :p

Griefbringer
27-05-2005, 10:14
Well, we might be seeing more official variant army lists (ala SoC/Lustria) in future, as it is easier for the studio to work out those than full size army books, and they will still generate a good level of interest amongst people.

Quercia
28-05-2005, 18:11
Anything new eh? Maybe a new http://s11.invisionfree.com/Castle_Sylvania (website) ? Otherwise nothing new... Though those Zombie Pirates really appeal to me. Maybe some shooting is in place, with a cannon.... I haven't actually seen the army list of WD 306 nor pics of a cannon (only ZOmbie Pirates regiment in sneak peeks).


Question though, since I don't have the book - Can I lead the army with something other than a Vampire? None of the bloodlines appeal to me, except maybe the Necrarchs but their minis are ugly. I'd like to lead the army with a Necromancer, but I've heard they're pretty weak...

Many things can lead a horde of Undead other than Vampires. Things such as Necromancers, Wight Lords and Wraiths. But you'll lack the fighting power. Annways, nobody really likes to field the mightiest army you came up with, right? Then a fluffy list could be fun, with something different though, like a Necromancer, WIght Lord or Wraith.

Cheers,
-Q

Rabid Bunny 666
28-05-2005, 18:39
its cool, theres a wopping cannon called queen bess, banshee heroes, portable cannons and strength 6 handguns, i am sorely tempted

Karhedron
03-06-2005, 21:04
I may be in the minority but I like most of the VC range. The only models that look a bit dated to me are the spirit hosts which look like a Scoobeedoo ghost-in-a-sheet. ;) I think the LOTR barrow wights make much better spirit host models.

Quercia
04-06-2005, 12:05
:eek: S6 handgun...ss..s..? W0W that's a strong Handgun to me, mini-cannon-held-in-hand.

LOL Let me know if they are Zombies having those guns. hhahah that would be funny.

And don't tell me they are (because I know already, and they have them, but I don't wanna know that part)

Cheers,
-Q