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View Full Version : Chaos Marauders - Best Equipment?



Fruhauf
29-03-2010, 13:47
Hey all, so I recently started collecting WoC and so far I have;

24 Warriors,
10 Knights,
10 Warhounds,
20 Marauders,
1 Wulfrik the Wanderer

I decided to get Wulfrik because I thought his special sounded quite cool (being able to appear at any board edge of the players choice after the game has begun WITH a unit of Marauders) and that brings me to my question...

My Marauders will be used behind enemy lines for high damage to mess up archers/artillery (I will mainly be playing against High Elves) yet I do not want them to be completely defenseless.

Do I go with Flail/Light Armour for +2 strength first round and 5+ save? (or would I lose a save point for taking a flail instead of HW?)

Or do I go defensive and take Light Armour and Shield for 4+ save?

And do I go overkill with the marks? E.G. Khorne if I get a flail, and Nurgle if I go defensive... or do I use the mark to counter my equipment? (Nurgle with Flail etc)

All comments and criticisms are appreciated... My aim isn't to be major competitive but I don't want to just mess around with my units, I LIKE to win :)

Bladelord
29-03-2010, 13:58
Go for great weapons over flails on your marauder infantry. I don't have time to help you with anything else right now but good luck:).

Fruhauf
29-03-2010, 14:03
Go for great weapons over flails on your marauder infantry. I don't have time to help you with anything else right now but good luck:).

Thanks, but I was worried that strike last and no HW/Shield combo for defense could leave them vulnerable...

GW + MoN?

Protection from mark and offense from equipment could work nicely.

Witchblade
29-03-2010, 14:04
Marauders with Wulfrik: 10-20 MoK, GW, possibly FC

BigbyWolf
29-03-2010, 14:05
Flail and Light Armour= 6+ save, you only get the parry bounus of a H/W if you using it in conjunction with a shield.

I often use larger units with H/W, L/Arm and a shield, 25 strong at least with Mark of Tzeentch as a good anvil. But if you're looking for something to go with Wulfrik I'd suggest Khorne with G/W.

Wyrmnax
29-03-2010, 14:09
Arent you supposed to be getting a 6+ from flail + light armour?

Anyway. They will be hitting the enemie's back units. Those units will usually have little support, unless you have some fliers on your own army. I would probably go for flails + armor or Great Weapons.

Armor + Shield Marauders are good for static combat resolution and little else. If you want them killing stuff you need better weapons and the knowledge that they will get killed whenever something reasonabily strong turns onto them.

Agnar the Howler
29-03-2010, 14:11
Because your marauders are a large unit, if they weren't geared for a Wulfrik Rear Invasion then i'd go with musician, standard bearer, light armour and shields. If they were smaller units (around 10 models, 15 maximum) then i'd give them GWs instead, and maybe just a musician, with shields and light armour added if you've got the points spare or if you feel you need better protection.

But since they are geared for going with Wulfrik, i'd give them GWs (GWs>Flails on foot marauders, there's nothing flails give them that GWs don't for a longer time period and the same points cost) and possibly shields and light armour thrown in if you're going to be seeing the sharp end of an arrow a lot of the time. It might also be worth investing in the MoN to reduce shooting damage even further, because in my opinion, it's not worth frenzying the unit for an extra attack, nor is the ward save extremely good (i'd prefer to be taking fewer hits rather than falling back on ward saves). Slaanesh is nice if you're going to be loosing large amounts of models and you want to avoid panicking, but apart from that there's not much that causes fear/terror that'll be staying behind with the archers.

Hojo
29-03-2010, 14:16
GW, MoK, and if you have the points musician+STD
10 or 15 strong is fine.

FictionalCharacter
29-03-2010, 14:20
But since they are geared for going with Wulfrik, i'd give them GWs (GWs>Flails on foot marauders, there's nothing flails give them that GWs don't for a longer time period and the same points cost) and possibly shields and light armour thrown in if you're going to be seeing the sharp end of an arrow a lot of the time.

well, they do give you the opportunity to strike first.

Fruhauf
29-03-2010, 14:25
well, they do give you the opportunity to strike first.

That is what I was thinking :)

FictionalCharacter
29-03-2010, 14:45
are marauders I5? it would be kind of a shame to waste it...

the more i think about it the more hand weapon, shield, light armor for 6 points seems like kind of a steal.

edit: actually the more i think about it i'm pretty sure they're I4.

Fruhauf
29-03-2010, 14:53
They are I4

Bladelord
29-03-2010, 15:09
6pts for marauders aren't a steal of pts... they're perfectly costed! Marauders will have 1 str3 atk each without great weapon so they won't do any serious damage if they strike first anyway.

BigbyWolf
29-03-2010, 15:21
well, they do give you the opportunity to strike first.

Only if you're charging, in which case you get to strike first with GW and Flail, but the next round of combat you are down to S3 with a flail or S5 with the GW.

If you are charged by the opponent you will more than likely strike last anyway, in which case it doesn't matter which one you are using, and should there be a second round of combat, you find yourself at S3 again.

I'd take striking last at S5 over going on I value and S3...

FictionalCharacter
29-03-2010, 15:23
i thought charging was trumped by always-strikes-last? no?

i still can't figure out a build for my marauders. mostly because i don't know what i want them to do. now i'm thinking maybe 2x10 as support units behind my line of warriors.

GWItheUltimate
29-03-2010, 15:31
I use them 25-30 strong fith LA+Shields, Full Command, MoS... It's a great place to put a BSB or an Exalted. You will have great Static CR plus some killing power with the Hero !

GWItheUltimate
29-03-2010, 15:32
Question: If you put a unmarker Exalted Hero on a squad of MoS marauders, do you loose the Immune to fear/panic/terror benefit ?

Same thing with MoK ? You're no longer Immune to Psy ?!?

snottlebocket
29-03-2010, 15:41
For main units of marauders take handweapon + shield. Their main purpose is surviving and providing static combat res.

For support units try flails or great weapons, their only goal is negating rank bonus if they can and killing stuff.

You'll probably get far more use out of the big blocks of handweapon / shield marauders. In any other role horsemen are much better suited than small units of infantry. Warshrine buffs can be quite usefull for main units.

Dalhara
29-03-2010, 15:49
...(I will mainly be playing against High Elves)...

considering this snippet of the OP I would definitely take great weapons, your going to be striking last no matter what with the elves ASF, may as well make those attacks back count.

in short, another vote for MoK + GW :D

BigbyWolf
29-03-2010, 15:53
i thought charging was trumped by always-strikes-last? no?

Not anymore, although as Dalhara has pointed out if you're facing High Elves where you strike doesn't really matter, as they always strike first. So GWs all the way and try to get your hands on a chariot or two and some trolls.

Agnar the Howler
29-03-2010, 18:02
I'm not bought on giving them MoK, remember, they're gunna be with Wulfrik and coming in near archers and bolt throwers, and i'm not sure an extra attack is worth the baiting. I personally think that Wulfrik + a couple of marauders are enough to take out archers and bolt throwers in combat without needing the extra attacks. They're all striking last, but they're also all killing them on 2s after hits. Even if one or two miss i'm sure Wulfrik and his 4 attacks can make up for it.

I'm tempted to go for Nurgle really, as they're going to get shot up as soon as they enter the battle. Khorne just doesn't hit me as necessary (although none of the marks really hit me as necessary, Nurgle is just nice, and Khorne is nice but possibly a little overkill.

Fruhauf
29-03-2010, 18:16
I think Slaanesh is a nice mark generally; it's cheap and it means you can have warhound screens without fear of having to take a panic test should they break.

I think you've just sold me Nurgle though for my marauders :)

So i'm looking at

GW/LA + MoN Thanks :)

TheDarkDaff
30-03-2010, 03:32
Always Strikes Last does trump charging and ASF but the only thing in the game that has it is a Wood Elf magic item. Great Weapons just give you "Strikes last" which is negated by the bearers charging or having the ASF rule.

The other issue with Khorne is that you have to pursue and overrun if you win combat which may put your unit into the fire zones of the rest of the High Elf shooting.

Sambojin
30-03-2010, 08:22
No matter what you give them as equipment, always give them a mark. If the frenzy of khorne doesn't strike you as a good thing (you may not like frenzy forcing you to charge from the table edge) then go slaneesh. There's no downside to it, its cheap for 10pts and is always worth taking if you're unsure. No panic, fear, anything to worry about again.

Go GW and either khorne or slaneesh. Nurgle is good, but not great against elves. Tzeentch is really only handy for HW+Shield. Remember, you can't be too killy, or too fearless.

Fruhauf
30-03-2010, 09:49
...Nurgle is good, but not great against elves...

surely -1 from enemy WS/BS is good v anything?

Bladelord
30-03-2010, 09:55
That -1 WS can be quite handy vs elven elite troops with WS5

Eta
30-03-2010, 10:07
I wouldn't go the Nurgle path as with the bad Ld and the prevalence of fear and terror causers you will run / not charge more often than not. Plus, the mark is much too expensive for marauders.

Greetings
Eta

Fruhauf
30-03-2010, 10:17
I wouldn't go the Nurgle path as with the bad Ld and the prevalence of fear and terror causers you will run / not charge more often than not...


I didn't think of it that way... Thanks for the eye opener! :)

Looks like Slaanesh Marauders with GW/LA then?

Thanks all for input btw (as you can tell i'm reasonably inexperienced... I've only played a handful of games and I haven't yet tested by Chaos army)

Agnar the Howler
30-03-2010, 10:30
I wouldn't go the Nurgle path as with the bad Ld and the prevalence of fear and terror causers you will run / not charge more often than not. Plus, the mark is much too expensive for marauders.

Greetings
Eta

You're looking at this like he's going to be charging them up from his deployment zone. The marauders are going with Wulfrik, which means they come in behind artillery/archers and take them out, and any fear/terror causers are gunna be halfway down the field dealing with his other troops, and if he pulls them back, all the better for you, since you're now free to march up without much stopping you.

Bladelord
30-03-2010, 11:39
If you're mostly up against High Elves there won't be many fear/terror causers. Yes they got plenty of dragon options but else they just got the Griffon & Phoenix Guard.

I say go unmarked and save pts for the rest of your army or go Tzeentch/Nurgle.

Tauren
30-03-2010, 14:18
You're looking at this like he's going to be charging them up from his deployment zone. The marauders are going with Wulfrik, which means they come in behind artillery/archers and take them out, and any fear/terror causers are gunna be halfway down the field dealing with his other troops, and if he pulls them back, all the better for you, since you're now free to march up without much stopping you.

Think so? And what if he keeps his dragon on the back-field to deal with the 300+ point wulfrik unit, then proceed to head upfield to deal with other threats?

Wyrmnax
30-03-2010, 14:22
Think so? And what if he keeps his dragon on the back-field to deal with the 300+ point wulfrik unit, then proceed to head upfield to deal with other threats?

Then you delayed his dragon for 2-3 turns, and that by itself is enough to be worth.

GWItheUltimate
30-03-2010, 15:00
Hey, if you put Wulfrix in a Slanesh regiment of Marauder, do they still have to test for fear/panic since Wulfrix isn't immune ?!?

Bladelord
30-03-2010, 15:30
No they won't need to test:). He's part of the unit.

GWItheUltimate
30-03-2010, 17:21
No they won't need to test:). He's part of the unit.

I thought that a non-immune to psy character that join an immune to psy unit made the whole unit non-immune to psy..

Maybe I missread...

Xzazzarai
30-03-2010, 19:30
Great Weapons and Mark of Khorne.

Or the defensive one: Shield, Light armour and Slaanesh

Both are very good builds!

Agnar the Howler
31-03-2010, 10:44
Think so? And what if he keeps his dragon on the back-field to deal with the 300+ point wulfrik unit, then proceed to head upfield to deal with other threats?

If i'm not mistaken, Wulfrik is a Hero choice, and the OP doesn't look to have enough models to make a good 2k list at the moment, and if i'm still not mistaken, you only get Dragons at 2k because they're all Lord choice mounts?

And when you factor in what Wyrmnax quite rightly said about delaying the appearance of the dragon, keeping a dragon back to deal with a single unit that is half its own points and also about half as deadly is worth it in it's own right, as you've now kept it out of your main army, which has now broken through your front lines and is ready to swarm your dragon with troops.

That leaves only Phoenix Guard and Griffons to fear in a HE army, but it's only fear, and they can use Wulfrik's leadership if he's the general, but still, leaving those units back on the off-chance that Wulfrik and his possy might stroll in from the back board edge means that the rest of the chaos army is left alone to march up.

danny-d-b
31-03-2010, 10:59
nope you can get the sun dragon at hero- but its not very good

I'd go with MON for a wolfric unit, either that or MOK

depends if you want to hit harded, or be harder to hit

Fruhauf
31-03-2010, 16:31
I think I will go MoN simply because I am not very experienced and I don't want to lose control of a unit through Frenzy.

I am still undecided with the equipment...

The way I see it is I get 2 points for either GW/LA and get +2 strength and 6+ save and the marauders strength (at Str 3) will mean against normal units I will have to roll 2 less on my roll to wound
OR 2 points for Shield/LA and get 4+ save, a 2 less on my roll for my save

So both ways coffer a 2 difference in my dice rolls.

My first thoughts are go for the offense, but simply on WYSIWYG... Marauders only come with flails and hand weapons. Hmm, I could use flails as GW's I guess.

Agnar the Howler
31-03-2010, 17:30
I think I will go MoN simply because I am not very experienced and I don't want to lose control of a unit through Frenzy.

I am still undecided with the equipment...

The way I see it is I get 2 points for either GW/LA and get +2 strength and 6+ save and the marauders strength (at Str 3) will mean against normal units I will have to roll 2 less on my roll to wound
OR 2 points for Shield/LA and get 4+ save, a 2 less on my roll for my save

So both ways coffer a 2 difference in my dice rolls.

My first thoughts are go for the offense, but simply on WYSIWYG... Marauders only come with flails and hand weapons. Hmm, I could use flails as GW's I guess.

If you have a hobby knife or other precise cutting tool, it's quite simple to chop the heads off the axes and swords you get and replace the flaily ends of the flails with the axe heads/sword blades etc. and there you have great weapons.

Alltaken
31-03-2010, 20:19
against HE you'll need armor since you strike last. That's my idea, go musician + banner 14 men o 17 for full frontage that givess you enough combat res

GWItheUltimate
31-03-2010, 20:22
I think I will go MoN simply because I am not very experienced and I don't want to lose control of a unit through Frenzy.

I am still undecided with the equipment...

The way I see it is I get 2 points for either GW/LA and get +2 strength and 6+ save and the marauders strength (at Str 3) will mean against normal units I will have to roll 2 less on my roll to wound
OR 2 points for Shield/LA and get 4+ save, a 2 less on my roll for my save

So both ways coffer a 2 difference in my dice rolls.

My first thoughts are go for the offense, but simply on WYSIWYG... Marauders only come with flails and hand weapons. Hmm, I could use flails as GW's I guess.


I suggest you go with MoS then... You won't loose the control... ever ! No Panic, no fear, no nothing (beside dying and breaking of course)

Agnar the Howler
31-03-2010, 21:23
I suggest you go with MoS then... You won't loose the control... ever ! No Panic, no fear, no nothing (beside dying and breaking of course)

You forgot the bit about Wulfrik leading them onto the board and then getting whatever bolt throwers/archers that happen to be sitting there at the time turning around and pelting them with pointy sticks. At least with MoN you get protection from it. Slaanesh, fine, you don't panic if loads die, but still, you're less effective, with Nurgle, you should've forced them to rack up enough modifiers to not even hit panic.

Plus with MoN you don't lose control, and all you've got to fear is the aforementioned rubbish Sun Dragon you've just pulled off the front lines.

Zaustus
01-04-2010, 01:40
I thought that a non-immune to psy character that join an immune to psy unit made the whole unit non-immune to psy..

Maybe I missread...

Re-read BRB p.78, especially the section titled "Immune to Psychology."

Technically MoS doesn't give ItP, but it seems sensible to apply the same principle laid out on p.78.

Taureus
01-04-2010, 02:26
Re-read BRB p.78, especially the section titled "Immune to Psychology."

Technically MoS doesn't give ItP, but it seems sensible to apply the same principle laid out on p.78.

Except that it's not ItP.

So it doesn't follow that rule.

Zaustus
01-04-2010, 04:04
Then how would you resolve that situation, pray tell? I don't see a better way to handle it, and I don't know of an FAQ that addresses it.

GWItheUltimate
01-04-2010, 16:38
You forgot the bit about Wulfrik leading them onto the board and then getting whatever bolt throwers/archers that happen to be sitting there at the time turning around and pelting them with pointy sticks. At least with MoN you get protection from it. Slaanesh, fine, you don't panic if loads die, but still, you're less effective, with Nurgle, you should've forced them to rack up enough modifiers to not even hit panic.

Plus with MoN you don't lose control, and all you've got to fear is the aforementioned rubbish Sun Dragon you've just pulled off the front lines.

I kinda disagree...

MoN, ok they have -1 to shoot you, but you do a panic check at the end of the turn and it doesn't work agains magic, which also can make you do another panic check... if you fail it, you're screw, you loose Wulfrix + the regiment. With slanesh, yes they will die more easily, but your opponent will have to kill ALL OF THEM to get rid of the treat.

So in the end, it really depends on what you intend to do with them... if you're planning on fighting a full squad of infantry with them, then you better be backed and maybe MoN would help you more (somtimes not) but if you just want do make a 15 big regiment with Wulfrix to scrap warmachine and peirce a gunline, go with slanesh... opponent will have 1 turn of shooting then they are in CC and it's all fine. Even if you still have like 5 of the left, it's well enough to beat weak stuff at the back.

That's just my opinion, I prefer MoS over MoN almost in every situation.

So in the end, it really depends

GWItheUltimate
01-04-2010, 16:40
Except that it's not ItP.

So it doesn't follow that rule.

Well try to find something about Immune to Fear....

It has been FAQed on GW official FAQ that it should be treated like ITP for this purpose.

But anyhow, an non-ITP character that joins a ITP unit becomes ITP, as per rulebook... sorry guys I was wrong !

Agnar the Howler
01-04-2010, 20:50
I kinda disagree...

MoN, ok they have -1 to shoot you, but you do a panic check at the end of the turn

Only if you took enough casualties from shooting, and IIRC the panic check is at the end of the phase and not the turn.

Bladelord
01-04-2010, 23:11
High Elves got a crazy Magic Phase so MoS could be the way to go. If you're not against a magic heavy army MoN's better. I still think that the unit should be unmarked to hold the unit as cheap as possible.

Deacon Bane
03-04-2010, 13:01
MON is expensive and if you come in from his edge, he will have only one round of shooting. Once you hit combat, it is not worth the points. 10 Mar w/GW and MOK is my prefered method, they can soak up alot of damage and stil have a couple left to charge with Wulfrik and destroy small units and Warmachines. MOS and 20 w/HW+shield can really mess up your foe's back field. Wulfrik should not be relied on as a gamebreaker though. Just when you need him, he will likely not come into play for a couple of turns. When he works, it is a nice bonus.
For the 10 points, it is worth not having to worry about panic, fear or terror. If this unit comes into play, I want to make sure they do something. If they show up and blow a panic test, they are too blose to the edge for my liking. I spend at least for the MOS, that way even if only Wulfrik and one survive the shooting and magic, at least Wulfrik will do something.

Taureus
03-04-2010, 20:21
Well try to find something about Immune to Fear....

It has been FAQed on GW official FAQ that it should be treated like ITP for this purpose.

But anyhow, an non-ITP character that joins a ITP unit becomes ITP, as per rulebook... sorry guys I was wrong !

Which FAQ, pray tell?

Because it's not in the WoC FAQ...And that's the only rule book that has the Mark of Slaanesh in its current evolution.

Deacon Bane
04-04-2010, 01:14
The unit takes the test, not the hero, since he is part of the unit. Thus even with a scardy-cat hero they are still immune to Fear, Terror and Panic. MOS is rock solid, it has no weakness and it is dirt cheap. On a tooled up 25 Marauder unit it cost less than half a point to nullify three of the biggest factors in the game. In some cases there are better Marks, but overall it is. imo, the best. I always have 2x units of 6 horsemen with it and th.axes, along with a 25x Marauder MOS unit with Lt.Armor and shields, this unit has never, in 2 years and many many games, been totally destroyed.

The reference to non-immune characters is in the 2nd WHFB FAQ, of the Rule book.