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View Full Version : What happened to Combat Shields?



Project2501
30-04-2010, 03:09
EDIT: I you're just tuning in, this was/is a bit of a late night rant :(

Unless I'm losing it, even though combat shields are listed in the SM armory, absolutely noone can take them?:confused::wtf:

I'm not trying to debate their worth or that they'll probably make a huge comback whenever Black Templars get their new codex, but rather how little sense it makes to have an item in an armies arsenal that absolutely noone can use.
:shifty::eyebrows:


Edit: I'm losing it, assault sgt [EDIT: and company champion are the only ones] that can take one.:rolleyes:

Even still, I would have thought that they would be more prevelant than the (overpowered) storm shield.

The Marshel
30-04-2010, 03:19
the company champion gets them too. but frankly why would you want a combat shield? a 5+ inv isn't reliable enough to put ap3 shots onto in order to preserve numbers. all it really provides is a fall back for when you take more armor denying wounds then you have squad members, and even then its sucky

RedFlames
30-04-2010, 03:20
the company champion has one too... but i agree, given how much better [and accessible] storm shields are now they seem a little pointless...

Project2501
30-04-2010, 03:32
That's what I don't get, space marine equipment is either mass produced or antique (generally). Something as powerful as the storm shield (either old or new version when compared to old or new combat shield respectively) just seems over-the-top and in line with TDA or even Iron Halos more than everyone and their mother can get their hands on a storm shield.

Now a combat shield (6+ inv now btw) seems weak enough to be able to be mass produced and freely found to me at least.

ehlijen
30-04-2010, 03:36
In the BA codex (comparing Vanguard and Assault marines) the storm shield's save is 4 times as good at 4 times the cost. Seems pretty allright, and on top of that, it doesn't stop the second weapon from giving an extra attack. They are not actually bad.

The problem is in how similar they'd look. GW needed to clearly seperate them in terms of who can take them (ie let everyone only have access to one of the two) and that left the combat shield with little purpose apart from allowing wysiwyg for older models. In fact, I dare say if the command squad and assault squad boxes didn't come with them, they'd have been dropped alltogether.

Edit: Project2501:

Storm shield access is actually fairly limited. Only HQ characters, command squads and assault veterans (in TDA or without) can have them. Ie they are limited to the first company and higher in rank and even then only to those who have been placed in assault squads there. Ie, about 5% of the chapter has access to them, assuming an even split between stern and vanguard/termies and assault termies. Theoretically.

TitusAndronicus
30-04-2010, 03:36
they're a cheapo goodie you can throw on for modelling's sake if for no other reason. Remember, this is a hobby lol!

Project2501
30-04-2010, 03:54
I agree that you can always model it for the heck of it, that's actually where my dilema began. I was looking through old WD's and pics I have and came across the Sons of Sparta GD entry SM chapter, which of course, lead me to look for a way to 'borrow':angel: the idea and make it a legitimate playable army. Because of this my rose-colored-glasses of storm shield proliferation failed and I can't understand why they (combat shields) seem to have all but vanished but storm shields are stronger than ever given the general level of Imperial production. I mean even a chapter master doesn't have the option to take one.

I have yet to actually get off my rear and get the BA dex yet, but I'll ogle it again at the store and if they (combat shields) are more readily available in there, I'll pick it up.

ehlijen
30-04-2010, 04:45
BA don't get any more combat shields than Ultramarines (apart from access to 6 assault squads as opposed to 3, but that's the only difference).

The reason captains don't get them is that they wouldn't even benefit. They come with a 4+ invul, so why would you buy a 6+?

Project2501
30-04-2010, 05:03
I'm not trying to argue that combat shields are better than an iron halo, just that they seems so few and far between.

I normally like to at least try and model/play armies differently (I only seriously apply WYSIWYG to the army list itself and otherwise only if something is clearly modelled for advantage) and even though the BA don't have any more access to them (aside from aforementioned ability to simply take more assault squads) I guess/think I could use them to represent models with FnP.

That or hope/wait for a comeback whenever BT get a new dex.

Alessander
30-04-2010, 16:01
same reason people don't use Eldar Dark Reapers anymore - they are good, but there's much better stuff in the same category available.

David5th
30-04-2010, 16:20
Company champion and Assualt squad sergeants can have them.

SanguinaryDan
30-04-2010, 16:41
Honestly, I don't see the point in them. Other than having 5 points left over and everyone already has Melta Bombs or purely for modeling?

But modeling wise there's only one style and it's for the right arm. So that restricts what other weapons you'll have access to right there. I think it's in only one box? And a 6++ is not really worth the bother in game terms.

primarch16
30-04-2010, 17:48
My BT Marshal has one, iron halo is too expensive in 1500 points.

massey
30-04-2010, 18:22
Yeah, the problem with them is that you'd have to assign a wound to the guy holding it. That means you're hoping a 1 in 6 that he'll survive. At that point, if you're playing with wound allocation and assigning armor-ignoring hits to the sarge to try and save the squad, you're probably just better off with a cheaper sergeant and just let him die.

Project2501
30-04-2010, 19:10
I apolgize if I've confused anyone as I wrote all this late last night.:(

I want to have entire squads/units (hell chapter if I could get away with it) to have combat shields not just single models in squads. At the moment I'm thinking I'll put them on BA squads with FnP to represent the FnP (and justify using/modelling them for myself). That or wait for the new BT dex or even GK one depending one their options.

In addition to that, while looking for who/what can take them to begin with, I noticed that they have all but vanished in place of super storm shields, which got me sidetracked wondering how/why storm shields are so godly now, and combat shields a rarity based on Space marine equipment either being massed produced or antique.

I am under no impression that combat shields are in anyway better tthan storm shields or even an optimal gear choice.

Again, sorry for any confusion caused by late night ranting.:(