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Vsurma
11-06-2010, 09:52
I just read the rumor about redirecting.

Apparently if a unit is charged and flees, the opponent can redirect to any valid target rather than having to pursue the fleeing unit.

This means that units that used to get in the way and flee from the enemy charge can no longer redirect.

What we need now are units that step into the enemies way and stay there, accepting the charge.

You can either have a unit strong enough to take the charge and win (not really a redirecting unit at this point)

A unit with enough ranks to get stubborn (say 2pt slaves) and a ld high enough for that stubborn to actually mean they don't run (so no 2pt slaves)

Though another rumor states you get to use the stubborn rule in conjunction with your generals ld, if this is true basically no unit within bsb range is ever really going to run.

OR if you don't want to use a very large multiple rank unit, you can use a swarm... or better yet 2 swarms in separate units.

The first will accept the charge and die, the 2nd will be in the way so if the enemy wants to over-run they can only do so to the 2nd swarm.

Swarms might be the cheapest way to slow down the enemies most powerful units. If the enemy rolls a very poor overrun you might be able to flee with the 2nd swarm if your not in the mood for fighting it out.

BramGaunt
11-06-2010, 10:18
I just read the rumor about redirecting.

Apparently if a unit is charged and flees, the opponent can redirect to any valid target rather than having to pursue the fleeing unit. Yes, once per turn after a passed morale check.

This means that units that used to get in the way and flee from the enemy charge can no longer redirect. Bingo.

What we need now are units that step into the enemies way and stay there, accepting the charge. Yarp. (This means yes, I rad a lot of a well know pirate manga recently and it's difficult not to get sucked in..)

You can either have a unit strong enough to take the charge and win (not really a redirecting unit at this point) obviously, if you kill them there's no need for redirection.

A unit with enough ranks to get stubborn (say 2pt slaves) and a ld high enough for that stubborn to actually mean they don't run (so no 2pt slaves)

Though another rumor states you get to use the stubborn rule in conjunction with your generals ld, if this is true basically no unit within bsb range is ever really going to run. This is true Welcome back 2 points slaves.

OR if you don't want to use a very large multiple rank unit, you can use a swarm... or better yet 2 swarms in separate units. Nasty tactics...

The first will accept the charge and die, the 2nd will be in the way so if the enemy wants to over-run they can only do so to the 2nd swarm. I think I'll need a dozen lizard swarms...

Swarms might be the cheapest way to slow down the enemies most powerful units. If the enemy rolls a very poor overrun you might be able to flee with the 2nd swarm if your not in the mood for fighting it out. Good thoughts.

Thats the first time I see strange things happen in 8th. Until now i really thought the time of ridicculous tactics was over...

Vsurma
11-06-2010, 10:33
Oh noes! pandoras box is open..... the swarms are leaving the jungle and taking to the battlefield.

ghostline
11-06-2010, 10:49
That's the way swarms worked until 8th edition, then swarms started losing wounds like undead did. Which made them poor at what there job is (slowing down a unit). instead of being a speedbump, there more like a bump now..

now that people can redirect charges doesnt change this at all....If i charge a unit of spearmen and you flee, and i have the option of A) running down the spearmen or B) fighting swarms.. im just going to run down the spearmen.. even if your swarm's flank me i would still beat the crap out of them from combat res alone.

Vsurma
11-06-2010, 10:56
I think you missed the point, the way to use them is to run them up 1" from the enemy, the enemy now has a choice, move backwards or sideways but do not charge anyone, OR charge the swarm.

Iirc lizardment swards have a M6, so they can get very close to the enemy fairly easily. With a swarm in the middle of your units front, you will have a very hard time charging anything but the swarm....which will hold in place when you attack it.

Another swarm will stop your over run move after you kill the first one.

Idle Scholar
11-06-2010, 12:08
Yeah 8th doesn't look like it will remove bait and flee tactics. The potential 'problems' are that elite units get better so you're flank charge is much more likely to bounce, and the chance to reform after winning a combat means you'll have to double flank a unit before you're guaranteed of a flank charge.

Still more rat packs and single swarms all round I think.

macdaddy
11-06-2010, 19:59
Swarms might be the cheapest way to slow down the enemies most powerful units. If the enemy rolls a very poor overrun you might be able to flee with the 2nd swarm if your not in the mood for fighting it out.

umm swarms cant flee. they are unbreakable, other than snotlings, which are stubborn on a 4, of course.

Vsurma
11-06-2010, 20:54
Fair enough.

You might need 2 swarms then, against weaker ones if you go on their flank you might survive with 1 but I imagine it's rare, 2 would be the way to go.

decker_cky
11-06-2010, 21:11
Actually....not swarms, but from what I've read, hounds will become even better at redirecting in 8th since they no longer have to worry about auto fleeing from fear. Protect them from panic and they'll do you proud with redirection.