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Tordeck
12-06-2010, 15:30
Lords

Queek Headtaker
215

Lords - 215

Heroes

Warlock Engineer
Warpmusket
Warlock Optics
50

Chieftain
BSB
Storm Banner
Shield
122

Plague Priest
Dispel Scroll
Flail
Poisoned Attacks
144

Heroes - 316

Rare

Warp Lightning Cannon
90

Warp Lightning Cannon
90

Rare - 180

Special

Poison Wind Globadiers x 10
Poisoned Wind Mortar
165

Plague Monks x 29
Std
Musi
Dripping Death
248

Gutter Runners x 10
Slings
Poisoned Attacks
180

Special - 593

Core

Stormvermin x 29
Musi
Std
Under-Empire
Queek Unit Upgrade
Warpfire Thrower
429


Clan Rats x 44
Shield
Musi
Poisoned Wind Mortar
249

Slaves x 22
Musi
46

Slaves x 21
Musi
44

Giant Rats x 30
Packmasters x 6
Master Moulder
Electro-Whip
178
Core - 946

total
2250

Von Wibble
13-06-2010, 14:52
My thoughts

Characters - I think the warlock engineer is expensive for what he does - a small unit of jezzails is a better choice.

BSB - Surely a great weapon or shield?

Units - Overall I think you have too many units at too small a size each. Bearing in mind your units get stubborn with more ranks than the enemy I would be looking for at least 30 models per unit if not 35. I would drop 1 clanrat unit and boost the other 2 to 30 models each. I would drop the warlock and banner of clan superiority and add models to either the plague monks or stormvermin instead.

Spears on clanrats make them too expensive and aren't any better than hand weapon + shield. Save some points by dropping them. Tail weapon on the fasngleader is similarly an upgrade that isn't really going to achieve much - an extra clanrat is better.

Tordeck
13-06-2010, 18:19
updated list in 1st post taking so of Van Wibbles suggestions into account.

i dont want to get rid of the warlock till Ive had a couple opportunities to play with him as I am hooked on the concept of a sniper rat.

edit - fixed the point issue i was having

bluemage
14-06-2010, 06:15
I'd drop the sharp shooter from each unit and take one more jezzail. I'm too tired to say anything else of intelligence, but the list looks a little weak. I think you could use a few more points spent on shooting. You're gonna want a way to take out armies of elite, hard hitting, well armored units. Like chaos warriors or swordmasters (maybe). You'll have the leadership and numbers to tie them up in combat for a while, but against say warriors with mark of khorne, it looks like a flank charge would just be donating combat res. So take some more shooting and soften them up some first.

Tordeck
14-06-2010, 19:10
If I combine the two units into one and switch the catapult to a 2nd cannon I can fit in a 7th team. Is this a good idea?

Paraelix
15-06-2010, 11:40
I see no weapon teams... And you have far too many units. Your deployment is going to be ridiculous...

Tordeck
15-06-2010, 13:19
Is that really the best help you got to offer?

Bueno
15-06-2010, 14:07
Its not really very clan mors'ie, more standard skaven listy as it has aspects from all the greater clans. My suggestion would be to drop the slaves, and make your stormvermin 40 strong unit (39+queek) to get the best from this unit. Maybe even drop queek for a warlord on warlitter + warlock enhanced weapon + heavy armour + enchanted shield. not a big diffence in points.

Tordeck
15-06-2010, 14:23
That's an idea, would cut down the number of units and make it easier to build/deploy. Queek stays as he is what solidifies the list as clan mors.

Spinocus
15-06-2010, 20:46
Too many units?!? You do NOT have too many units! Skaven was designed as a horde army... Play like one! I don't see how Clan Mors are any less 'horde' oriented than the other clans, being that they use Slaves in abundance.

That sniper Warlock is your call but I'd give him a Doom Rocket too. Roll 4 dice for anything within 13-16 inches and you've got a great chance of hitting something (preferably a big block of infantry) with that 5" template. I never use the Warlock Optics but I think he can have both items at once, no?

Plague Censer for the Plague Priest. Again, your call but I don't like the idea of having 5 Monks take a PCB gas test every round of combat in a unit that's only 20 strong (even if they do pass on a 5 or less). Try to give your opponent as few CR points as possible. I'd sooner opt for a Flail and Poison Attacks from the Scavenge Pile. Maybe drop 35pts for the Blade of Corruption?

I'm a little shocked to only see two units of Slaves but am even more shocked to see two units of 30... with spears?!? I can see the urge to field fat Slave units but they suck at killing things so spears are kind of pointless, especially since you probably won't be able to use them on the charge (8th ed rule check?). Slaves are crap, gloriously cost effective crap but still crap... so treat them as such! If you must give them equipment I'd sooner give them shields so they can get that Parry Ward save and not die so badly that you can maximize their 'explosion' when they break or keep them alive for more than one round. Anyway I'd consider ditching the spears and dropping them down to 25 or the current favorite of 21 (20 + Musi), that way you can buy two more units for screening, flanking and baiting.

Those Jezzail units are dangerously small, one casualty and you're taking a panic check on Ld 5 (Ld 8 if Queek is nearby). Consider combining both units into one unit and deploy them on a hill in your rear or on a flank with help nearby to prevent them from being charged. I'd also consider ditching the Sharpshooters and buying one more normal Jezzail. Bonus option... Add 4 more Jezzails and you can form them into a 5 wide, two rank deep unit. Per the 8th ed rumors the rear ranks should be able to fire and this way you'll get an extra rank to use for Ld checks (Strength in Numbers rule) or for CR.

It suppose it's a matter of taste but I don't get the use of two 10 strong units of Night Runners. I assume you're going to use them exclusively for flanking? If so I'd ditch them and use those points to beef up your Giant Rat units, purchase some more Giant Rat units or buy two weapons teams for your Clanrat units. For the same price you can get two Warpfire Throwers, two Poison Wind Mortars with points for two champions for the Clanrat units or two Doom-Flayers with 30 points left over for whatever.

You're obviously aiming to use your Giant Rat units for flanking and rank negation but I strongly urge you to consider beefing up their numbers. Next to Slaves Giant Rats are the most cost effective units in our army. For a mere 95 points you can have 21 Giant rats w/4 Packmasters. Deployed 5 wide that unit will give you a whopping 19 attacks when attacking and defending! In 8th ed the first 2 ranks always get to attack, add +1 rank for the Giant Rats' special 'Wave of Rats' rule (think of it as a 'spears plus' type rule), + 1 rank for the four Packmasters' whip attacks (can be used over the first 3 ranks) = 19 attacks. Deployed 6 wide = 22 attacks, 7 wide = 25 attacks! Cast Bless with Filth or Death Frenzy on that unit and watch your opponent's eyes bulge out of his head when they slam into the flank of one of his units...

I'm worried about your 20 strong Stormvermin and Plague Monk units. Given 8th ed combat their numbers may be a little on the low side. Taking any kind of Stormvermin is a hotly debated topic among Skaven players. Most don't take them at all and those who do typically use them to take another magic banner or use them instead of Clanrats to push the Screaming Bell. That Queek rule just makes them crazy expensive. Anyway this is a Mors oriented list so I would opt to not upgrade the SV unit and take 5-10 more normal SV or divide the points you save between them and the Plague Monk unit or.... consider scavenging a rank's worth of rats from each of those Clanrat units.

No magic other than the lvl 1 Plague Priest? Pity.

Tordeck
15-06-2010, 21:26
Ty for your in depth review, I'm just not getting enough of those here. Your logic makes sense, and I intend to use it in conjunction with whatelse I've been told at the under empire.

Bauknefer
16-06-2010, 04:43
I really like the list but to me it seems to lack punch. I would try to include maybe another PCB unit or maybe rat ogers. just so that when your awesome combat res units get into combat it doesnt last so long as they can be tied up all game. I like a hammer and anvil strat myself so I use it all the time. I like having units that can pack a major punch on at least one round. str5 or better to break armor and get lots of active combat res mixed with the other units static res to win the combat by a large margin. I like your shooting it will help soften the tough stuff by the time it gets to you but str4 im not sure if thats enough to win combat. Just my opinion take it or leave it lol

Tordeck
16-06-2010, 13:32
Ok so I wanted to edit the first post but I can't from mydroid. Here is a revised list based on some suggestions I've gotten.

Lords

Queek Headtaker
215

Lords - 215

Heroes

Warlock Engineer
Warpmusket
Warlock Optics
50

Chieftain
BSB
Storm Banner
Shield
122

Plague Priest
Dispel Scroll
Flail
Poisoned Attacks
144

Heroes - 316

Rare

Warp Lightning Cannon
90

Warp Lightning Cannon
90

Doomwheel
150

Rare - 330

Special

Censor Bearers x 7
112

Plague Monks x 29
Std
Musi
Dripping Death
248

Special - 437

Core

Stormvermin x 29
Musi
Std
Under-Empire
Queek Unit Upgrade
359

Night Runners x 20
Warp Grinder
200

Clan Rats x 40
Shield
Musi
184

Slaves x 20
Shield
Musi
52

Slaves x 20
Shield
Musi
52

Giant Rats x 30
Packmasters x 6
Master Moulder
Electro-Whip
178
Core - 1025

total
2246

I dont want to get rid of the warlock till Ive had a couple opportunities to play with him as I am hooked on the concept of a sniper rat.

Queek stays as he is what solidifies the list as clan mors.

Apon further suggestion I may drop the night runners for
Gutter runners x 12
Slings
Poisioned attacks

Or whatever to make it fit points wise

Tordeck
21-06-2010, 12:30
Re-read the amrybook and decided to re-write the list to be more fluffy. I based this off the battle to take the City of Pillars

Lords

Queek Headtaker
215

Lords - 215

Heroes

Warlock Engineer
Warpmusket
Warlock Optics
50

Chieftain
BSB
Storm Banner
Shield
122

Plague Priest
Dispel Scroll
Flail
Poisoned Attacks
144

Heroes - 316

Rare

Warp Lightning Cannon
90

Warp Lightning Cannon
90

Rare - 180

Special

Poison Wind Globadiers x 10
Poisoned Wind Mortar
165

Plague Monks x 29
Std
Musi
Dripping Death
248

Gutter Runners x 10
Slings
Poisoned Attacks
180

Special - 593

Core

Stormvermin x 29
Musi
Std
Under-Empire
Queek Unit Upgrade
Warpfire Thrower
429


Clan Rats x 4
Shield
Musi
Poisoned Wind Mortar
249

Slaves x 22
Musi
46

Slaves x 21
Musi
44

Giant Rats x 30
Packmasters x 6
Master Moulder
Electro-Whip
178
Core - 946

total
2250

Tordeck
13-07-2010, 15:41
Updated 1st post to reflect newest incarnation of the list. Would really appreciate some feedback.

patchy
14-07-2010, 20:22
bump your giant rats up to 40(horde), i did that today and they saw off 15 kinghts of the realm mwuhahah. wasn't even lucky rolling just the static combat rez and sheer amount of dice i had to roll guaranteed murder