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View Full Version : I learned to not underestimate Tau the hard way...



lubi125
21-06-2010, 03:00
Well I played my first tine against Tau today with my IG (even though I've been in the hobby for like 4 years)

First turn:
I start
- LM Vanquisher with Pask wrecks a devilfish
- Basilisk kills some Fire warrior (5 I think..)
- The other devilfish is shaken
Opponent turn
- LMBT and LM Demolisher (same squadron)get wrecked and blown up...
- A chimera is wrecked
0_0
I am really impressed and stunned by the turns of events... I use to really underestimate Tau.

Those markerlights combined with Hammerheads really DEVASTATING

So lesson of the day:
Imperial armour is not invincible and Tau doesn't suck

Lunatic Fringe
21-06-2010, 03:23
Its not that tau are totally weak it's just that they need some work to get the codex sorted out. Like point changes and that. A lot of it too is rules that need work or they don't fit well anymore. Wargear needs work and some ideas about the army have to be rethougt. They can still win but its not easy a lot of times.

Vox-Grill
21-06-2010, 04:05
I have three guys that I normally play with, and two of them play Tau. I underestimate them and normally do well. From my Chaos Space Marine point of view, only marker lights and Crysis Suits scare me. Lots of Ap 1 and 2 weapons to scare MEQ and TEQ. I don't know much about guard, but I normally pop Broadsides and Hammerheads with Obliterators and destroy Crysis suits with Berzerkers or Termies that launch from the Land Raider. Without marker lights or crysis suits, I really don't fear them too much. Railguns just look scary, but it takes a 5+ to pen my Land Raider, which I always run with demonic possesion. Cover saves on vehicles? Check! Jump shoot jump is the greatest tool in the Tau army from my point of view. Eleven railgun shots to my predator didn't even scratch my armor one game, and a Fish of Fury has never been successfully executed against me. Grant the Eldar player has been playing for 6 month, 1 Tau for about a year, another for 3 months, and me (Chaos) for just under four now. Maybe its just my group being noobs, as I haven't a clue to the Tau metagame.

tl;dr Stay away from marker lights, they turn Fire Warriors into killing machines. Stay away from Crysis Suits because they can mess your s*** up real fast. Railguns just look scary, FoF has never worked against me before

Vedar
21-06-2010, 05:00
Tau can be a good fight. I got tabled by Tau playing my Daemons. Of course I must say I lost going first, Lost my choice of Daemons to bring in and my reserve units trickled in and got shot up. I deep struck my blue scribes right behind his 2 hammerhead and rolled 1,1 and 2 for my bolts of change. It was still a good fight as he held 1 objective to my 0, barely.

Chaos Marines is a bit harder for Tau and Eldar... Forgetaboutit. Eldar serve Tau ass back to them on a silver platter.

Reflex
21-06-2010, 05:36
Tau are usually one of the harder armies for guard to fight. they usually have been because they are great with anti tank, and have alot of good guns that are generally better then guards. the tau weakness is close combat, something guard also suck at. one thing tau dont beat guard in, is numbers.

i hate playing tau as guard, because its usually the most challanging games ive had. they detroy my tanks, wreak havoc on my guard squads. but, the rule of three helps. three manticores are more then enough to deal with most tau problems.

Corporeal
21-06-2010, 06:23
I have three guys that I normally play with, and two of them play Tau. I underestimate them and normally do well. From my Chaos Space Marine point of view, only marker lights and Crysis Suits scare me. Lots of Ap 1 and 2 weapons to scare MEQ and TEQ. I don't know much about guard, but I normally pop Broadsides and Hammerheads with Obliterators and destroy Crysis suits with Berzerkers or Termies that launch from the Land Raider. Without marker lights or crysis suits, I really don't fear them too much. Railguns just look scary, but it takes a 5+ to pen my Land Raider, which I always run with demonic possesion. Cover saves on vehicles? Check! Jump shoot jump is the greatest tool in the Tau army from my point of view. Eleven railgun shots to my predator didn't even scratch my armor one game, and a Fish of Fury has never been successfully executed against me. Grant the Eldar player has been playing for 6 month, 1 Tau for about a year, another for 3 months, and me (Chaos) for just under four now. Maybe its just my group being noobs, as I haven't a clue to the Tau metagame.

tl;dr Stay away from marker lights, they turn Fire Warriors into killing machines. Stay away from Crysis Suits because they can mess your s*** up real fast. Railguns just look scary, FoF has never worked against me before

If I was playing you, I'd run tx42 piranhas (effective bs of 4 with twinlinked fusion among other things) AND hammerhead railguns against your LR, and some other TX42's with missiles to take care of your oblits. Not to mention a lot of heavy gun drones with markerlights to light up your LR to push your coversave to 7 to just make it hurt that much more.

your pred would be lunch if I got a few tx42's far enough behind it to give it a missile enema.


Part of the metagame I've found is when you have skimmers, you can play the vertical game. Hiding behind a barrier and trying to claim a coversave? not when i'm staring straight down at you from four stories up. If a CC oriented army can't make the D6 roll to jump up to a second level or they're using a lot of calvary, they can't get up to that second level. their movement and part of their strategy is simply nullified.

Zweischneid
21-06-2010, 09:14
I think Tau do well against Guard, Hordes and other shooty armies. Tau can shoot, and they can shoot tanks.

Tau struggle quite abit more against Assault-oriented MEQ armies. Since the latter are very, very popular, playing Tau can be a bit frustrating.

Tau have a hard time taking out large numbers of in-your-face MEQ infantry (not to mention if they come with FNP) unless the whole army-list is geared towards doing mainly just that at the expense of any semblence of being an "all-comers" list.

Simo429
21-06-2010, 09:42
Tau are like the vast majority of armies that are described as broken on the internet by some

On any day with a bit of luck and a competent player they can give any army a game

Its only generally the people on here who have their wins and losses in their sig and they all read won 45 drew 1 lost 0 2010 that will go on how easy they are to beat

Kirby
21-06-2010, 11:33
I think Tau do well against Guard, Hordes and other shooty armies. Tau can shoot, and they can shoot tanks.

Tau struggle quite abit more against Assault-oriented MEQ armies. Since the latter are very, very popular, playing Tau can be a bit frustrating.

Tau have a hard time taking out large numbers of in-your-face MEQ infantry (not to mention if they come with FNP) unless the whole army-list is geared towards doing mainly just that at the expense of any semblence of being an "all-comers" list.

Not really, your standard run of the mill Hybrid Tau lols at assault armies with blocking Piranhas and bubble-wrapping Drones/Kroot. 3-4 layers minimum to get through means Tau get to use their very effective torrent for a long time.

Zweischneid
21-06-2010, 11:56
Not really, your standard run of the mill Hybrid Tau lols at assault armies with blocking Piranhas and bubble-wrapping Drones/Kroot. 3-4 layers minimum to get through means Tau get to use their very effective torrent for a long time.

All fine.

The problem is that there "effective torrent" isn't that effective.

FW/Kroot shooting is too low on AP to make deep inrows into hordes of Zerkers, Grey Hunters or Death Company coming down at you. Weapons on the Suits/Fishes are too few inbetween and generally overpriced for taking out 15 to 20 pts models.

I am not saying it is impossible to win against MEQ with Tau (!), but Guard with a mix of Infantry vulnerable to FW/Kroot shooting and Heavy tanks offering targets for the big guns and suits is more in the "sweet zone" of what Tau shooting is designed to do.

MegaPope
21-06-2010, 13:05
The best way to fight Tau with Guard is to go for the extremes. The mid-range infantry/armour mix is what they're designed to take on.

So, you flood the table with infantry and take Hellhounds and concealable artillery as your armour - this will simply overwhelm the Tau anti-personnel firepower and leave next to no juicy targets for the Railguns. Artillery can be hidden from direct fire weaponry and hellhounds can make fast dashes out of cover and still be effective. Then you do a Bunker Hill on them and advance en masse. This is a very painful thing if massed casualties hit a nerve, but since Tau are one of the few things Guard can get away with assaulting, it isn't as suicidal as it would be with other opponents (those power weapon-armed Veteran Sergeants will have a field day...). This is also where our units capable of ouflanking come into their own, particularly Heavy Flamer-armed Sentinels and Storm Troopers - STs get saves against most of multishot Tau guns and their Hellguns can drill through basic Crisis Suits.

The other thing you can do is flood the table with tanks - when it comes to effective long-range AT firepower, Tau only really have Railguns. Granted, these are VERY effective, but outside of the missile pods at S7, their capacity to take on massed Armour 12 is a bit ropey, while we should have more than enough Multilasers and Autocannons to nail their transports. Again, outflankers (especially Stormtroopers) are invaluable.

As far as individual Tau units go, there are three that you should make a priority of nailing:

1) the suits, especially Broadsides - these will absorb a hell of a lot of firepower and are the main Tau anti-tank machines (Crisis Suits have to get a bit close for comfort) - tbh I've found the best way of dealing with them is still to enlist the services of a Callidus Assassin - she can appear next to them and will wipe the floor with them in close combat. Don't worry about doing anything else with her - if she even stops them firing for a couple of turns it'll make a difference. If she actually kills them off, the effectiveness of the Tau firepower suddenly drops dramatically.
For infantry forces, its the stealthers you have to watch out for - all those burst cannons hurt a lot. The MSM mechanic has become rather less of a threat with TLOS, but you may be either forced to swarm them or use indirect fire to get at them if they've got a large piece of opaque scenery to use for cover.

Interestingly, on the subject of Assassins - to allow one in your force, you have to include an Inquisitor of some kind, almost certainly a Lord due to the 1-1 rule for allied =I= HQ/Elites. I find the Witchhunter Lord comes into his own here, preferably with three Acolytes or Warriors to keep him resilient but cheap, since the Tau can't counter psychic powers and have the same trouble with morale as we do. I've had one of these dudes scare away Battlesuit units with Divine Pronouncement - one Crisis unit ran straight into open ground after losing a model to a henchman's Meltagun and then testing on Ld3 - they were subsequently blown to bits by massed heavy weapons that couldn't previously see them.

2) Gun-skimmers: Hammerheads are a threat to any target in a Guard army, but are themselves vulnerable to anything from autocannons upwards. Blast them until you knock out the turret - that neuters them at a stroke. However, they're pretty nippy and can Tank Shock you off an objective, so try your hardest to immobilise them at least if this is a threat.
Also, Pirhanas - Guard armies traditionally don't like anything that moves fast, and melta-armed fast skimmers are no exception - multilasers will settle their hash, although if you can get a Hellhound to vomit at them, hilarity ensues. The other thing that's annoying about them (and basic Devilfish) are the gun drones they carry - I've had these things slip through my lines to harrass command squads that I thought were safe.

3) Pathfinders - the greatest concentration of Markerlights in a single unit in the Tau army, and also the source of one of their few medium to long range mid-strength armour-piercing weapons in Railrifles. However, it's the Markerlights and scouting that make them so annoying. Drop shells on these buggers until they all fall over - Griffons and Mortars are good for countering them, since Pathfinders are optimum targets for them, and every time they get pinned, that's a lot of firepower boosts they Tau player won't have for a turn. Again, these little sods don't like Hellhounds: they aren't that well-equipped to tackle them on their own, and may well be far enough forward for a turn 1 or turn 2 toasting - well worth the cost of the Hellhound if it subsequently goes pop, IMO.

Bunnahabhain
21-06-2010, 13:21
If you think jump-shoot-jump is dead, try a cities of death type board, vs All infantry Guard.

When difficult terrain means you can't actually get advance faster than they're causing casualties on you, and the outflankers decide they like turn 5, then you have a slight problem.....

If you want fun however, try Creed, outflanking a unit of rough riders. Those broadsides don't like it up 'em. They like cold steel backed by explosive shaped charges even less...Win, consolidate to mainly out of LOS, look not too threatening, so not wiped out by firepower, then manage to pull a 23" charge, and neutralise the path-finders as well!

in general, you need to be good with your target priority vs Tau, and they just fall apart.

Wrath
21-06-2010, 13:34
Railguns just look scary, but it takes a 5+ to pen my Land Raider, which I always run with demonic possesion.

yea, but at AP1 they can kill you on a glancing hit.

MegaPope
21-06-2010, 13:41
If you think jump-shoot-jump is dead, try a cities of death type board, vs All infantry Guard. When difficult terrain means you can't actually get advance faster than they're causing casualties on you, and the outflankers decide they like turn 5, then you have a slight problem.....

Very true, but I'm afraid I didn't account for tournaments, and assume both players are interested in keeping remaining friends ;)

Although your artillery will still help, and those Astropaths had better be earning their keep...:D


If you want fun however, try Creed, outflanking a unit of rough riders. Those broadsides don't like it up 'em. They like cold steel backed by explosive shaped charges even less...Win, consolidate to mainly out of LOS, look not too threatening, so not wiped out by firepower, then manage to pull a 23" charge, and neutralise the path-finders as well!

CRRREEEEEEDD!!! Sorry, that had to be done. I also don't normally factor in Special Characters (though in retrospect I probably should). Outflanking Rough Riders would indeed be a gem.

Al'Rahem comes to mind here as well, come to think of it. A full platoon, you say? Blobbed up, you say? With FRFSRF, you say? And Special Weapon Squads with Demo Charges? On the flanks, you say? Oh my...

Keichi246
21-06-2010, 14:23
Yeah - currently the are fairly solidly in the middle of the pack in regards to effectiveness. A good build in the hands of a good general can win, but most of thetime, they are lagging behind the power curve against the top tier armies...

They can still hand out a HECK of a lot of hurt if they have a good army build and the dice are at all kind. I recently had a game with a Mechvet Guard where the Tau managed to rip the heart out of the army of the army by turn two with good use of Pathfinders, 2 squads of Broadsides, and deepstriking Crisis suits. The Crisis suits deepstruck pretty much next to the artillery park (guided by Pathfinderfish DS reroll) and raped the lot of them, the Broadsides were eliminating 4 AV12 units a turn, and the Pathfinders removed cover where needed. And footslogging vets toting meltaguns do NOT fare well against Fire Warriors.

Broadsides with shield drones in cover can be HARD to shift...

Of course - that is the exception - not the rule. Most of the time, I'm seeing the Tau fighting hard to get the draw - because right now they don't really have the crunch power to stop an "in-your face" army that can get charges on turn 2. (and for the love of god, DON'T take an infantry heavy Tau army versus the Space Wolf "Jaws of the World Wolf spam" army.... :cries:)

Kirby
21-06-2010, 23:51
All fine.

The problem is that there "effective torrent" isn't that effective.

FW/Kroot shooting is too low on AP to make deep inrows into hordes of Zerkers, Grey Hunters or Death Company coming down at you. Weapons on the Suits/Fishes are too few inbetween and generally overpriced for taking out 15 to 20 pts models.

I am not saying it is impossible to win against MEQ with Tau (!), but Guard with a mix of Infantry vulnerable to FW/Kroot shooting and Heavy tanks offering targets for the big guns and suits is more in the "sweet zone" of what Tau shooting is designed to do.

FW suck. Kroot are there to die anyway but 20-40 S4 shots aren't nothing. AP has nothing to do with torrent. Torrent is weight of fire. 20-40 S6+ from the crisis (half of that with AP benefits gained from MLs). 2 S6 5" blasts. 27-31 S5 (not including FW/PF). That sounds like a lot of torrent which is pumped into assault armies as long as their Piranhas/Drones/Kroot hold which can take quite some time.

TheMav80
22-06-2010, 03:02
The other day I won against an all meched up Marine army. I went second and in that one turn blew up or wrecked 5 Rhinos. His one Land Raider did manage to shrug off every rail round and piranha fusion blast I threw at it though.

Taipan
22-06-2010, 15:04
Tau still have plenty of advantages in 5th edition, which keeps us in the mid-tier;

Crisis suit teams: They're overpriced, but eh. On the plus side, mobile autocannon and plasma shots mean they can engage transports/light armour and deal with heavy infantry (which the massed S5 of the rest of the army plinks off).

Stealth Marker Team: Markerlights you say? Outflanking/Infiltrating you say? And they can JSJ, and be invisible to enemy fire? A properly outfitted SMT costs about the same as a Raider, but as a force multiplier they are unrivalled in the Tau army. They can move and shoot, they will probably last the entire game, and they will remove cover saves and make your units BS4 or BS5 when it counts. Pathfinders are bait, SMT are the real support unit. Personal choice though, I find Tau get by fine without markerlights.

Kroot: Ah, my favourite unit in the army. They cost the same as Veterans, have essentially BS3 bolters, can spam Hounds (which cost 1pt less to be better in combat but have no gun) to rape you at I5 with massed S4 attacks, and they can Infiltrate/Outflank and ruin your backfield. I have (I kid you not) killed more tanks with my Kroot than I have with railguns. Taken as either an Outflanking blob of 10 x Carnivores+10 x Hounds, or just as speedbump/harassment units of 10 x Carnivores, they are cheap and annoying. Think of them as Orks that lost their way and wound up in a shooty army.

Devilfish: Overpriced (seeing a recurring theme here yet?), but makes an able gunship when given an SMS and Multi-tracker. Tack on a Disruption pod (for that delicious 4+ cover save) and you've got your anti-infantry/objective holding needs covered. Don't forget the 6 x FW's to make it score. Kroot die, Devilfish hold objectives. Oh, and if you have the points, take flecette discharges and bait assault units into attacking them. Massive lulz ensure (especially if they're horde infantry and lack an decent armour save).

Piranha: Fusion blaster, targetting array, and we're done. Rather like Landspeeders, just run them into the nastiest enemy tank and crack it open. Disembark drones, then spend it's short remaining life blocking LOS and generally being an annoyance. Excellent synergy with Kroot. Never take them in squadrons, always singly. 2-3 is my usual deployment (cos hey, it's not like there is anything else in Fast Attack worth taking). Oh, and if you have the points, take flecette discharges and bait assault units into attacking them. Massive lulz ensure (especially if they're horde infantry and lack an decent armour save).

Hammerheads: Submunitions, how I love thee, let me count the ways...Ork horde descending on your lines? Drop submunitions on them. Assault Marines about to eat your Crisis suits? Drop submunitions, let Crisis finish them off. Genestealers show up outta nowhere and infesting your backline? Bomb them to mush.
The solid shot is kinda meh, considering the points you pay. Still there when you need it, but honestly I miss so often I don't even bother most games. Having too much fun reducing their precious Troops to red smears from across the board.

Broadsides: Ah railguns, the one thing Tau can never have enough of. I usually only take one team (as two would be both expensive and possibly broken), but they're always good fun. Pro-tip: hold them in Reserve (after buying the stablisation system for them), then bring them on using the Positional Relay when you need them (that thing also comes in handy for bringing Kroot blobs or Devilfish on time). It saves them having to endure lascannon for a few turns, and with the stabilisers active they can shoot on the tun they arrive.

Everything else in the Tau army is overpriced or useless. I've gotten bored with my army for this precise reason (because we have zero option for variety, unless you enjoy losing). No Deathstars, no psykers, no variety in Troops, overpriced firepower, overpriced tanks...when I read the Blood Angels codex by comparison, I die a little inside. I know xenos armies have to suck so Marine players still stastically win over half their games, but at least make it interesting next codex release....Nicassar for psykers (make them suck in close-combat though), expand Kroot to have hybrid options (kinda like Veteran Doctrines) so we have actual assault units not glass swords, make the Skyray and Vespid usable (classic case of excellent concept, craptastic execution) etc.

Askari
22-06-2010, 15:11
Tau can be a good fight. I got tabled by Tau playing my Daemons.

Really? I find that Daemons are the perfect counter to Tau armies. Last game I saw with both the Daemon player tabled the Tau player, losing only 2 models... a single Horror to dangerous terrain, and a Bloodthirster to, shockingly, a Death or Glory attack against a Devilfish.

Horrors with their AP4 Assault 3 ranged weapons really mince Fire Warriors and Kroot left right and centre. Fiends and Seekers are too fast for the Tau to stay away from Assault. Railguns are wasted on Greater Daemons and Daemon Princes who have many wounds and 4+/3+ Inv. saves.

The whole army Deep Striking just makes it worse as the Tau only get one turn of shooting before everything is up right in their face.

Jayden63
22-06-2010, 17:42
Taipan pretty much covered it.

There is only one build that the Tau have that is competitive. Thats to spam 6-9 crisis suits, 6 broadsides, 2-3 units of Kroot, and the lone 6 man firewarrior squad in D-fish because you have to.

If you run into this, there is enough AP 1-2 weaponry to make marines cry and enough S5-S4 guns to take care of non-MEQ armies as well.

But that is it and even this army will collapse if the other guy is a fast assaulter and can reach you quickly. Tau can hold their own against other gunline, shooty type armies, but thats because your more or less just trading blows using the areas of the game the Tau are actually decent in.

Thud
22-06-2010, 17:53
Tau has one good build. A very good build, in fact. One of the best in the game, even.

Of course, you'll never read that on forums, as armies without super-units that can win games on their own by plowing through the opposing army like napalm through butter suck, right?

Gorin9SQ
22-06-2010, 19:33
Tau has one good build. A very good build, in fact. One of the best in the game, even.

Of course, you'll never read that on forums, as armies without super-units that can win games on their own by plowing through the opposing army like napalm through butter suck, right?

I mass of 30" STR 5 guns? :D

The ability to take those 30" STR 5 as part of a combined arms effort (That means units of varying abilities working together amd supporting each other for greater effectiveness.) can make for some serious battlefield havoc.

Charistoph
22-06-2010, 21:59
I mass of 30" STR 5 guns? :D

The ability to take those 30" STR 5 as part of a combined arms effort (That means units of varying abilities working together amd supporting each other for greater effectiveness.) can make for some serious battlefield havoc.

{sarcasm}
You're full of it, combined arms would never work. It is better to lumber forward in a tank to hit the enemy with a sword!
{/sarcasm}

Kirby
22-06-2010, 22:22
Tau has one good build. A very good build, in fact. One of the best in the game, even.

Of course, you'll never read that on forums, as armies without super-units that can win games on their own by plowing through the opposing army like napalm through butter suck, right?

*hugs Thud*

I know, oh how I know.

Garven Dreis
22-06-2010, 23:22
I am intrigued by the whole 'Railguns are just scary'. Yeah, sure, in your running with just AV 14, but I have the fear of Railguns in me, both Solid Shot and Submunition. Those things vape my Predator in the first turn or so, and in the most recent apocalypse game I played, it vaped a LR in the first shot.

In my experience, Railguns, ESPECIALLY on Hammerheads, are to be respected.

Grand Master Raziel
23-06-2010, 00:58
I know xenos armies have to suck so Marine players still stastically win over half their games,

:rolleyes: Oh, please! Get over yourself. Tau were one of last edition's power armies, and when they get redone they doubtless will be again. The Eldar and Ork dexes kind of poke a hole in your theory that GW makes xenos armies deliberately weaker than SM ones. Just because it flatters your ego to think that overpowered rules are what allows SM players to win games and being an awesome general is what lets you win games, that does not make it so.

burning crome
23-06-2010, 01:29
Tau has one good build. A very good build, in fact. One of the best in the game, even.

Of course, you'll never read that on forums, as armies without super-units that can win games on their own by plowing through the opposing army like napalm through butter suck, right?

please enlighten me (or is it the 6-9 suits and 6 broadside listed on the last page)

Cerraand
23-06-2010, 01:34
To the original poster : I don't think you underestimated the Tau that much, your deployment helped me a lot. Plus, you remained static, helping me again, I could shoot the flank of your tanks at the 2nd (or 3rd, I don't remember?)

However, it is in games like this that we learn at lot from our errors ;)

persevere and you'll be very good in a short time :)

Kirby
23-06-2010, 02:44
please enlighten me (or is it the 6-9 suits and 6 broadside listed on the last page)

Your "standard" 2k Tau list =

Commander w/PR/MP/MT/HW-TL
3x3 Crisis w/PR/MP/MT
6x FW
2x 10 Kroot w/7x Hounds
8x PF w/Devilfish w/SMS, MT, Targeting Array, DPods
2x2 Piranhas w/Fusion Blasters, Targeting Arrays, 1 DPod
2x Broadsides w/ASS, leader w/2x Shield Drones, TL
2x Hammerheads w/SMS, MT, DPods, Railgun, TL

Blockers = Kroot, Piranhas, Devilfish, Drones
Anti-tank = Broadsides, Hammerheads (secondary), Piranhas (secondary), Crisis suits (secondary)
Anti-infantry = Crisis suits, Hammerheads, Kroot (secondary), Devilfish (secondary)

More info can be found here (http://kirbysblog-ic.blogspot.com/p/armies-in-5th-edition-articles.html).

Heywood38
23-06-2010, 03:05
I almost never lose with my Tau even against Chaos Marines or hordes.

I have a take-all-comers list with lots of TLMP + TA suits (cheap and lots of shots), speed bumps like gun drones squads (jump outa the way to shoot from behind them, jump back in to provide cover save), lots of railguns of course.

You just need to target your potential enemy units and stay to the objective.

lubi125
23-06-2010, 13:02
To the original poster : I don't think you underestimated the Tau that much, your deployment helped me a lot. Plus, you remained static, helping me again, I could shoot the flank of your tanks at the 2nd (or 3rd, I don't remember?)

However, it is in games like this that we learn at lot from our errors ;)

persevere and you'll be very good in a short time :)

That's about what the real opponent told me, he said like that I should have advanced with my army (even though it's a gunline IG) and that my Chimera should have been more in the open to be more effective

1 Thing that was ''funny'' was when he deepstriked a Crisis suit with plasma and melta almost beside Pask's LM Vanquisher. So this the things that that shot the Pask:

-Hammerhead
-2 Crisis suits with melta and plasma (At close range)
-2 Broadsides

In the end he only managed to get a Crew stunned and a weapon destroyed (sending Pask flying?!)

Considering I had built the tank the night before the game, maybe this brought luck!

Cerraand
23-06-2010, 16:08
1 Thing that was ''funny'' was when he deepstriked a Crisis suit with plasma and melta almost beside Pask's LM Vanquisher. So this the things that that shot the Pask:

-Hammerhead
-2 Crisis suits with melta and plasma (At close range)
-2 Broadsides

In the end he only managed to get a Crew stunned and a weapon destroyed (sending Pask flying?!)

Considering I had built the tank the night before the game, maybe this brought luck!

Yeah, the suicide crisis attack was an Epic Fail :D

Setesh
23-06-2010, 19:17
hammerheads consistently take out my vindicators and preds before they can pop them or the fishies hiding in their transports. Absolutely hate the things - but thats probably because I run such an armour heavy list.

lubi125
23-06-2010, 23:18
Yeah, the suicide crisis attack was an Epic Fail :D

So YOU ARE the guy I played agaist 0_0
That's a nice encounter!

You come to GW this sunday for the megabattle?

Cerraand
24-06-2010, 03:23
I don't know honestly, maybe...
I haven't planned yet

I guess I'll decide Sunday morning

Meanwhile can you tell (PM) me the rules/points costs?

Xyrex
24-06-2010, 03:27
I think Tau do well against Guard, Hordes and other shooty armies. Tau can shoot, and they can shoot tanks.

Tau struggle quite abit more against Assault-oriented MEQ armies. Since the latter are very, very popular, playing Tau can be a bit frustrating.

Tau have a hard time taking out large numbers of in-your-face MEQ infantry (not to mention if they come with FNP) unless the whole army-list is geared towards doing mainly just that at the expense of any semblence of being an "all-comers" list.

"other hordes" is a bad statement. Tau suck against orks completely and epically. I can see why the IG would have problems though.

Kirby
24-06-2010, 03:49
"other hordes" is a bad statement. Tau suck against orks completely and epically. I can see why the IG would have problems though.

lol no. Eat Piranhas. Now some drones. And here's some Kroot. During these minimal 3 turns of being blocked I'm torrenting you away with the addition of markerlight support. How again do orks do we all against Tau? (waits for Trukk comments, lots of bodies and everything else that always comes up here and doesn't work).

lubi125
24-06-2010, 04:41
I don't know honestly, maybe...
I haven't planned yet

I guess I'll decide Sunday morning

Meanwhile can you tell (PM) me the rules/points costs?

Well there's a chance it might be a warhammer fantasy game, it depends on the people present.

It start's in the after noon and it's a army of 1k and the staff let's you use some of the store models.

I will probably bring my Chaos playing friend (last time he came, he borrowed some Chaos marines and a vindicator)
I actually want to try out the Valkyrie :D

In the end, it's sunday afternoon, 1k, from any army and it's just a game for fun.

See ya!

orkz222
24-06-2010, 05:54
Your "standard" 2k Tau list =

Commander w/PR/MP/MT/HW-TL
3x3 Crisis w/PR/MP/MT
6x FW
2x 10 Kroot w/7x Hounds
8x PF w/Devilfish w/SMS, MT, Targeting Array, DPods
2x2 Piranhas w/Fusion Blasters, Targeting Arrays, 1 DPod
2x Broadsides w/ASS, leader w/2x Shield Drones, TL
2x Hammerheads w/SMS, MT, DPods, Railgun, TL

Blockers = Kroot, Piranhas, Devilfish, Drones
Anti-tank = Broadsides, Hammerheads (secondary), Piranhas (secondary), Crisis suits (secondary)
Anti-infantry = Crisis suits, Hammerheads, Kroot (secondary), Devilfish (secondary)


I played against an almost similar Tau list but at 1750 using my csm and lost.
damn those kroots and their dogs sure can fight in CC, and the disruption pods are very irritating. Rhinos + LR was blown up in 1st turn even with smoke, bad luck on my side maybe... got to walk all the way to tau lines and still need to get through the kroot, after killing the kroots. Game end... tau shooty stuffs still alive.

Kirby
27-06-2010, 05:19
I've written an in-depth article on why Tau are good in 5th edition and how to use their list which enables them to compete very well in the current rules set. You can check it out here (http://kirbysblog-ic.blogspot.com/2010/06/how-to-hybrid-tau-applied.html).

Wolf Lord Balrog
27-06-2010, 05:46
I've written an in-depth article on why Tau are good in 5th edition and how to use their list which enables them to compete very well in the current rules set. You can check it out here (http://kirbysblog-ic.blogspot.com/2010/06/how-to-hybrid-tau-applied.html).

I dunno if I'd say Tau are 'good'. The codex is outdated, everything costs too much and there is exactly 1 build and 1 general strategy that still works. They need an update as bad as Necrons.

Jayden63
27-06-2010, 06:46
I've written an in-depth article on why Tau are good in 5th edition and how to use their list which enables them to compete very well in the current rules set. You can check it out here (http://kirbysblog-ic.blogspot.com/2010/06/how-to-hybrid-tau-applied.html).

I find it funny that the list your using to show them being competitive is the exact same as previously mentioned. Spamming crisis suits, minimal FW, and speed bump piranha. It is the only competitive build in the codex.

Kirby
28-06-2010, 03:59
@Balrog; read the article to see why they are "good." Eldar, WH, Tau & DE are all good with mono-builds because those builds work appropriately in 5th edition.

@Jayden63; the list that I posted here? And again, you only need one competitive list for a book to be competitive because it can produce a competitive list. CSM, Orks, Necrons, Daemons & Daemonhunters would love to have that luxury.

Wolf Lord Balrog
28-06-2010, 05:44
@Balrog; read the article to see why they are "good." Eldar, WH, Tau & DE are all good with mono-builds because those builds work appropriately in 5th edition.

@Jayden63; the list that I posted here? And again, you only need one competitive list for a book to be competitive because it can produce a competitive list. CSM, Orks, Necrons, Daemons & Daemonhunters would love to have that luxury.

You are technically correct, but I think our definitions of 'good' are different. I want more than just 'competitive' out of a codex. I want every codex in the game to have at least 3 viable (not razor-edge competitive, but viable) builds. And I'd like at least one, preferably more, of the those builds to look kinda like how the fluff describes the army as fighting. The true shame of GW's game design is how little justice the game mechanics do to the fluff, for almost every codex.

Kirby
28-06-2010, 16:26
Agreed in terms of flexibility but the lack of it doesn't make a good bad, just 'not as good.' There is no denying the power and ability of the Hybrid tau build appropriately applied and used though.

Zweischneid
28-06-2010, 16:36
I often feel like the Tau Codex was written for a smaller game.

Tau do excellent in around 1000 pts. games, and decent up to 1500 pts. There combined arms approach works well in these games I feel and you actually can use some off-the-wall units for interesting effects. In a 750 pts. game, Vespids for example, are a threat!

But even at these points, you're by and large already using the best of your HS and Elites slots most of the time.

At higher point levels, target saturation just overwhelms a Tau army more often than anything else. while you spend points on "nice-to-have-but-not-crucial" things in your list as your FOC is pretty much exhausted.

Playing 2000+ pts with Tau against opponents who know how to build some redunancy into their lists is just painful.

sir samuel
28-06-2010, 21:01
never underestimate the skyray
scary

Kirby
29-06-2010, 02:42
@Zewischneid; I encourage you to read the linked article. Tau (alongside DE) are plain disgusting at lower point levels because of their ability to create balanced lists at that level with a lot of firepower but Tau operate very well at 2000+ thanks to their ability to spend points in blocking or @ 2500 get more Crisis through HQ bodyguards. DE can't do this which is why they scale poorly.

@sir samuel; hammerheads > skyrays. The ability to take on tanks & infantry is a lot better than two markerlights and some missiles.