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View Full Version : new HE archetype?



kiron
24-06-2010, 18:38
I was really thinking about the 10 great eagles archetype in 2k (or 15 in 3k) and wondering how would most traditional armies fight it since the army is now even more dispered than WE!

One example would be: teclis (assuming errata to give loss of control on double 6s), another mage and eagle riding hero is about 975 points (use up 25% lord and 25% hero points). Then throw in 10 eagles (25% rare points) and spend the rest of core for a 2k list. The eagle will spend the whole game redirecting and attempting to march block while teclis just wrecks havoc (the list gets stronger in 3k).

HeroFox
24-06-2010, 18:44
Right now there's a limit on 2 of the same Rares.

So until a FAQ is out, that strat's out.

kiron
24-06-2010, 18:59
Right now there's a limit on 2 of the same Rares.

So until a FAQ is out, that strat's out.

But i thought the high elf elite army rule gets ignore slots restrictions for rares and specials (according the the rumour)

Malorian
24-06-2010, 19:02
Everyone should wait for the erratas before they do anything rash (like buy 15 eagles).

Kalandros
24-06-2010, 20:04
Your eagles arent going to do much except dying...
If Teclis uses too many dice, boom he goes down to that new scroll that for every dice you used, I roll that amount of dice and each 5+ is a wound to Teclis..
o;

I dare you to throw 6 dice at a spell!

Paraelix
24-06-2010, 20:12
Honestly sounds like a horrible list to play against... Because it is annoying and ridiculous... Not because it will necessarily achieve anything.

jet_palero
24-06-2010, 20:34
But i thought the high elf elite army rule gets ignore slots restrictions for rares and specials (according the the rumour)

That is still a rumor. one I really hope is not true because its moronic.

HeroFox
24-06-2010, 20:49
That is still a rumor. one I really hope is not true because its moronic.

Let me ask you:

How many core, specials and rares can High Elves play according to their 7th Ed. book?

King_Pash
25-06-2010, 01:49
It's certainly an unusual army to field and I would love to have the chance to fight against it. Unfortunately, there is little hitty in that army and since shooting is becoming a lot more dangerous and eagles having no armour, I see a lot of fried chicken for your opponent. Plus, redirecting and march-blocking is a lot less reliable in 8th Ed. and if you have no major shooting, a bit pointless.

All in all, an interesting list option (if it's even legal) but one that would likely not win you many games.

Kerill
25-06-2010, 04:18
I think the list would win a lot of games but it would be as popular/fun to play against as the old flying circus Tzeentch list from storm of chaos.

TheSanityAssassin
25-06-2010, 05:59
Honestly sounds like a horrible list to play against... Because it is annoying and ridiculous... Not because it will necessarily achieve anything.

Agreed.

Not really sure what you hope to achieve with it. Your for is a simple LD test away from not being march blocked, and with new movement rules, it's fairly hard to stop them moving completely, and fleeing charges is by no means a sure thing.

I really don't think High Elves are that boned in 8th like people are thinking. I've rolled up LOTS of combats comparing their units to others, and they still do quite well if you pick reasonable match ups...the general lowering of armour in things like Chaos Warriors and Dwarves combined with MORE attacks from their troops and re-rolls on spears make them respectable in combat.

IF the FAQ saying that their GW armed troops DO get re-rolls then Swordsmasters basically outperform almost anything in the game in combat.

Not really sold on Lions at all in this edition though....stubborn IS nice, but they lack attacks, and the lessening of armour, and predicted lessening of heavy cav make me wonder about them. IF the re-rolls come, they might be pretty good, without them there's too much of a chance on a fluff to me. Hense why I never used them in this edition.

Big blocks of Seaguard and Phoenix Guard are fantastic though!

Paraelix
25-06-2010, 08:13
Let me ask you:

How many core, specials and rares can High Elves play according to their 7th Ed. book?

And how different are the army comp rules from 7th ed? Really, what happened in 7th has little or no bearing on what happens in 8th.

HeroFox
25-06-2010, 09:07
And how different are the army comp rules from 7th ed? Really, what happened in 7th has little or no bearing on what happens in 8th.

Yes it does.

0-2 Core, 6 Specials and 4 Rares scream for an elite army.

You don't need to like the design of the army to accept it.

jet_palero
28-06-2010, 16:02
Yes it does.

0-2 Core, 6 Specials and 4 Rares scream for an elite army.

You don't need to like the design of the army to accept it.

Whats the point of rules regarding specials and rares if you just ignore them? hell just make them all core units then and get it overwith.

It's still a moronic rule change.

HeroFox
28-06-2010, 16:11
Whats the point of rules regarding specials and rares if you just ignore them? hell just make them all core units then and get it overwith.

It's still a moronic rule change.

The point of not conforming to the BRB is because that's the way the army was designed.

Keep saying its moronic, you'll get through eventually :shifty:

jet_palero
28-06-2010, 16:26
Core:
Archers
Spearmen
Lothern Sea Guard

Special
Sward Masters
Phoenix Guard
White Lions
Silver Helms
Dragon Princes of Caledor -
Ellyrian Reavers
Shadow Warriors
Tiranoc Charriot
Lion Charriot of Chrace

Rare
Repeater Bolt Thrower
great Eagle

What exactly is in there that you feel the need to take six specials of? Dwarfs have 3 core units as well and you don't hear us whining about how we ought to be an "elite army." Not only that you've got NINE special options and we've only got 7, although we do have 3 rare options to your 2.

Specials can be up to 50% of your army in points, I'm sorry I just don't see whats so bad about high elves that they need to have some elite army rule. Sure in 7th they got to have more special choices than other people, but that restriction has been eliminated for a different sort of one. If keeping that is so important, then they should get to take up to 75% of their army as special instead or something. The limiting duplicates is an attempt to keep people from overstocking imbalanced units (something GW has a habit of creating).

King_Pash
28-06-2010, 17:00
Not really sold on Lions at all in this edition though....stubborn IS nice, but they lack attacks, and the lessening of armour, and predicted lessening of heavy cav make me wonder about them. IF the re-rolls come, they might be pretty good, without them there's too much of a chance on a fluff to me. Hense why I never used them in this edition.

I must disagree with you there. Lions always lacked the attacks, true. But with an extra rank of attacks and the possibility of rerolls means they'll hit a lot harder than they've done in 7th Ed. Plus, with a natural Stubbornness, it means you don't have to worry about out-ranking the enemy. Plus, with their resilience against shooting, you'll be able to get more of them in combat. The only problem I have with them is their ok-ish LD value. 8 is nice but I just can't seem to ever make that damn roll.. :shifty:

HeroFox
28-06-2010, 18:30
@jet_palero
I don't think we're understanding each other.

I'm not comparing the number of core/special/rare choices there are in the book. Let's just get that straight.

7th Ed for High Elves meant we can take LESS core for MORE specials and rares. In 8th, the same should apply because obviously, that's how the army is designed to be played. Thus, something like 15% core instead of everyone's 25% and 65% instead of everyone's 50% specials.

Now I'm not saying that I personally want this to happen, I'm just saying that if the original design was to keep HE playing that more "elite" feeling, then why has 8th Ed. went against that. The FAQ will reveal all in the next couple of days. Until then, I'm done with this thread.