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View Full Version : Why no Bretonnian love GW?



tezdal
25-06-2010, 14:48
Was wondering last night checking out those new Empire minis, why no love for Bretonnia games workshop? Sure we don't have steamtanks, guns, or cod-pieces......but knights are pretty neet too...so why no love, and a plastic lord for us would be awesome.

phoenixguard09
25-06-2010, 14:57
Because Empire are the Space Mareenz!!11!LOL!ROFL!LMAO!BBQ!.

In all seriousness its because Brets don't sell as well as many of the other armies. I know only 3 Bret players personally and I'm one of 'em.

Its quite obvious, the big sellers all stem from larger than usual groin guards.

I mean Space Marines look like Superman with the underpants on the outside... :shifty:

dragonet111
25-06-2010, 15:32
Bretonnia is my second army after Chaos. I love them I bought the armybook for 5ed but I was young and at the time Bretonnia was really expensive so I waited the 6ed revamp to build my army. I love that army. My favorite mini is the Green Knight, the lord with axe is great IMO and Louen is awesome.
Actually the only wish I have for Bretonnia is plastic Questing Knights (this is my favorite unit in the book and 8ed is nice with them:D).
I have a 2000points army and a planned 3000points but if I have to choose between my Chaos army and my Bretonnian army I would choose my Chaos army. My soul belongs to Tzeentch:D

Bac5665
25-06-2010, 15:37
The armies that sell the least are the armies that get the least love from GW. It's a chicken and the egg thing and GW is absolutely crazy to not get it.

If they supported all armies equally, then they'd all be about as popular. Every army gets a huge boost from a new book, and I've seen every army be very popular at the local store at one time or another, usually right after the book came out.

That said, nothing for brets until my TK get their first new model since 2003.

Griefbringer
25-06-2010, 15:43
May I point out that almost the whole Bretonnian range got totally revamped when they got their previous army book release? The only old models remaining where the Green Knight (which is still pretty awesome model) and the mounted yeomen.

Charistoph
25-06-2010, 15:48
Model updates usually accompany army book updates. 2ndary model waves are a relatively recent GW practice. When you factor all that together...

Grand Master Raziel
25-06-2010, 16:08
My main beef with the Bret range is Questing Knights and Grail Knights being pewter. I balk at spending the amount of money I'd have to spend on them to get a good sized lance. Also, pewter models have a limited range of poses. There really isn't any need for any of the range to be pewter, except perhaps the Trebuchet and characters. There's already a basic Knight body with horse and whatnot that's already the base for both Knights Errant and Knights of the Realm. GW just need some sprues for Questing and Grail Knights. Give us those, and I'd be perfectly happy to kitbash my own Lords, thank you very much!

Kerill
25-06-2010, 16:12
Because there are only so many variations on a caparisoned horse they can do?

I've always felt that for bretonnian knights its the paint job that makes the difference (with all the unique crests and whatnot) whereas for empire knightly orders (which will have the same paint job) the models and variation there is more important.

Also getting updates isn't always a good thing- look at the complaints levelled when the new empire box sets came out with skulls, bare feet and no codpieces. Look at the silly price of the new greatswords.

Be careful what you wish for...

@Grand Master Raziel

Metal models, a pair of needle nose pliars and a tissue to wrap around the area you are bending can give you an awful lot of potential poses. Converting is a bit more troublesome, but personally I like the weight of the metal models.

Bloodknight
25-06-2010, 22:38
I think Bretonnia got some really nice models when their book was redone in 6th edition (like Wood Elves, about everything in the army was redone).

They don't seem to sell that well or appeal to many people, though. I've been trying to sell a 3K army of them for a friend (mostly only built, some stuff still new in the box) and people didn't want them at less than half price. I've then started to observe the 2nd hand market for them and the Brets more or less just don't go regardless of price, unless they're superbly painted. Painting Brets nicely is a major PITA, IMHO; more so than any other army. I guess that's what keeps people from doing them, they're not really speed-paintable unless you go for one of the pretty boring crusade schemes.

Ultimate Life Form
25-06-2010, 22:57
Bretonnia is quite a conundrum for it caters to the fantasy archetype (knights in shiny armor), but saleswise and in popularity terms are outclassed by the unique Empire by far. To me personally it has to do with the background without a doubt being the worst in the game, a cheap rehash of King Arthur and His Noble Knights without any creativity what. so. ever.

R Man
25-06-2010, 23:12
I agree, but for different reasons. Most players (at least on the Round Table) say they were drawn to the army because the Knights, while arrogant, were genuine good guys even if they are pricks.

But then 6th rolled round and Bretonnia went from being the land of shining armour to being the bastard son of Monty Python and Jabberwocky (sp?). The plight of the peasants was made to look brutal to gritty Bretonnia up, but instead it made it look stupid. At a 90% tax rate ans everyone being a hunchback its not dark, its laughable and impossible to take seriously for anyone who knows history.

I don't mind Bretonnia being portrayed as elitist, ruthless and arrogant. In fact I prefer a militant Bretonnia. But they have to actually be honest even with that arrogance and generally stand for their beliefs. Its this brutal honesty and selflessness that sets them apart from the Empire which just isn't shown this edition.

That and the model range is More limited than for most. About 3 units are basically the same unit with minor changes.

Lord Malorne
25-06-2010, 23:15
Perhaps with 8th they will have a bright future.

:)

The Inevitable One
26-06-2010, 05:43
May be is it because Bretonnians speak French :D

But seriously, I am sure that Games Workshop will bring out some new models for Bretonnia in due time. As far as I have seen most of the knights in a Bretonnian army are all different, so I am guessing it would take a bit of time to sculpt them, judge them, redo them, and then wait for the right time to bring them out.

I think Bretonnia don't have guns because they are an army focused in what seems to be the Middle Ages, while the Empire is an army that would match up with the Industrial Revolution.

Personally, I think Bretonnia are the Warhammer Fantasy's Space Marines and the Empire are the Imperial Guard of the Warhammer Fantasy world.

Arkfatalis
26-06-2010, 15:32
My main beef with the Bret range is Questing Knights and Grail Knights being pewter. I balk at spending the amount of money I'd have to spend on them to get a good sized lance. Also, pewter models have a limited range of poses. There really isn't any need for any of the range to be pewter, except perhaps the Trebuchet and characters. There's already a basic Knight body with horse and whatnot that's already the base for both Knights Errant and Knights of the Realm. GW just need some sprues for Questing and Grail Knights. Give us those, and I'd be perfectly happy to kitbash my own Lords, thank you very much!

I like the current models for the questing knights as they make great heavy cavalry for my DOW. However, I do admit they are a bit expensive and need an update, but don't mock the way the current ones look just because they are made out of pewter.

RichBlake
26-06-2010, 15:35
I don't mind Bretonnia being portrayed as elitist, ruthless and arrogant. In fact I prefer a militant Bretonnia. But they have to actually be honest even with that arrogance and generally stand for their beliefs. Its this brutal honesty and selflessness that sets them apart from the Empire which just isn't shown this edition.



I think what they tried to portray, but failed to do so, is that the Knights are like "Ho there! We shall fight evil wherever we find it, tally ho!" and totally don't realise that their people fight off starvation every day and that in fact crippling taxes and things are what fund their ability to just prance all around the continent slaying dragons and so forth.

It's more like the tale of Robin Hood, the nobles were so busy sorting out problems elsewhere the peasants paid for it.

I think there is far too much focus on the Holy Grail in the Brettonia book at the moment, I mean really, does every knight need to be hoping to one day drink from it?

I'd like to see Brettonia be a country where to nobles are obsessed with Crusading against evil and totally arrogant and out of touch with their people, but at the same time honourable. Some knights go questing for the Holy Grail hoping to one day become a Grail Knight. Others having failed in this task by growing weary of what is seemingly a wild goose chase or simply believing themselves unworthy are simply Knights to fight Brettonia's enemies.

OR

The King is like the best king ever and is struggling to help the peasants but at the same time the Knights demand ever more money for their constant crusades for the Holy Grail and other such crazy ideas.

At the moment the Brettonian background is a bit one dimensional: Sucks to be a peasant, all Knights want to drink from the Holy Grail. Done.

Knights who didn't believe in or couldn't/wouldn't find the Grail would be a nice edition as Core choices. The idea of some sort of internal conflict in Brettonia between the needs of the Peasants and the needs of the Knights would be good too.



That and the model range is More limited than for most. About 3 units are basically the same unit with minor changes.

I think that comes from the fact the entire army is largely knights tbh. Knights are knights, there isn't even that much difference between Empire Knights and Brettoninan Knights.

I think if Men-At-Arms weren't so bad people would be more willing to take masses of bows, shielded by some Men-At-Arms supported by Cavalry which would make Brettonia much more viable.

EmperorNorton
26-06-2010, 17:55
They don't seem to sell that well or appeal to many people, though. I've been trying to sell a 3K army of them for a friend (mostly only built, some stuff still new in the box) and people didn't want them at less than half price.
When one can order stuff from England for little over half price it's really no surprise you can't sell Brets (or anything that's still available, really) even at a seemingly low price.

Brets are my first army. My other armies are merely for practicing my painting before I attempt to paint them.
I agree that the background went a over the top in regard to the peasants. The heavy inspiration by Arthurian legend I don't mind, even if it's not terribly original (as anything truly original is rare for GW anyway).

Their army desperately list needs some more options, though, which I hope they'll get with their new army book, whenever that will be out.

Duke Georgal
26-06-2010, 18:58
Because in the current Warhammer there is no need for anything shiny and well maintained. It is all about blood, gore, mud, and grime now.

No new Bretonnia until the Warhammer World cleans up a bit.

Shining polished armor all they way!