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Grand_Marshal_Kazan
26-05-2005, 21:47
What do you think would occur if Kroot were to eat some Tyranids? Whould they be able to handle the Tyranid DNA or would the flesh be deadly to them?

athamas
26-05-2005, 22:09
um,.. its flesh...

they would eat it,...


only if they tried o encrporate the DNA into them would problems arise, and then theere is only a small chance that the individuals offspring would be nid controlled, and would be put down instantly...


so no, no problems!

Talkie Toaster
26-05-2005, 22:29
Don't Tyranids have microscopic bity-things (OK, I forgot the name) as a replacement blood/digestive system? Eating tyranid flesh might turn out slightly fatal, it would be pretty similar to (oh irony) being eaten by the tyranid, if you didn't dry it out first.

Grand_Marshal_Kazan
26-05-2005, 22:32
Eating tyranid flesh might turn out slightly fatal, it would be pretty similar to (oh irony) being eaten by the tyranid, if you didn't dry it out first.

Ah Tyranid jerkey.

Goblinardo
26-05-2005, 23:15
Well, when Kroot eat Tyranids, bad stuff happens. Or so do the Kroot believe:


As the Gaunts drew nearer, his whipping tongue savoured the pheromone messages permeating the humid jungle air: the lust to survive, the drive to consume and integrate. Something in the scent made the Shaper pause. The warriors behind him were becoming impatient and the enemy were getting closer. High pitched whistles from behind told him his kindred was almost beyond the point where he could control their carnivorous appetites and with an angry series of warbling clicks he silenced the impatient warriors. He needed more time to consider the meanings in the enemy's musky scent.

In a moment of instinctive insight, the Shaper sensed what was wrong with the enemy's scent; they too were predators who survived by consuming their foes, by taking within themselves the traits of those they defeated so that successive generations could survive and prosper in an ultimately hostile world. Something in this was wrong, something about this foe made it imperative that their spirits must not be allowed to mingle with those of the Kroot.

Pertinax
26-05-2005, 23:16
In the first of the Cain novels, the kroot refuse to eat the 'Stealer cult members that they have slain, because they are "tainted".

If BL books are anything to go by...

Briareos
27-05-2005, 08:37
1. Tyranid phage-cells (present in great numbers in all Tyranid organisms) act like organic acid on any foreign body they come in contact with. Eating a 'nid equals being devored from the inside as the phage-cells immediatly attack the foreign, non-Tyranid digesting system.

2. Kroots (mostly shapers, but warriors as well) seem very, very reluctant to eat Tyranid, or Tyranid related, organisms.

athamas
27-05-2005, 09:30
i expect that is more likely, they would not eat it, but from a purely biological point of view, they should be abe top eat dead nis meat... ob. eating the vital organs would be a bad idea

Briareos
27-05-2005, 09:39
Phage cell being present in Tyranid blood the same way leucocytes (white cells) are present in human organisms, eating _any_ organ or part of a Tyranid is a bad idea. Unless you filter the blood, but that doesn't strike me as something a Kroot would do.

Alpharius
27-05-2005, 14:24
Don't Tyranids have microscopic bity-things (OK, I forgot the name) as a replacement blood/digestive system? Eating tyranid flesh might turn out slightly fatal, it would be pretty similar to (oh irony) being eaten by the tyranid, if you didn't dry it out first.

"slightly fatal"!

Good one!

Plaguebeast
27-05-2005, 14:54
I was actually thinking about this the other day. Eventually I just thought that the corpse of any tyranid creature would 'bony', with whatever meat on it being quite tough. Furthermore, whatever internal fluids flow through their bodies are likely to be highly toxic. Looks like those pieces of fluff confirm it.

Plaguebeast

Cloudscape_online
27-05-2005, 15:35
What about the other way around? If/when the hive has consumed enough kroot, will there be a tyranid model that has hyper accelerated evolutionary mutation? Like a gaunt that as soon as it kills a SM, gains +1 to each of its stats that was higher than its(own except armour and Ld).

Elite
0-1 Krogaunts

Gaunt Statline.

Brood: between 8 and 24 Krogaunts

Pts/model: 10.

Options: All Gaunt options

Special Rule:

Mutated evolution

Whenever the Krogaunt unit wipes out a enemy infantry unit in close combat, all Krogaunts in the unit get +1 to either Ws, Bs, S, T, A or I as long as the enemy unit had at least one of these stats higher than the Krogaunt Unit.

Briareos
27-05-2005, 15:40
"Hyper accelerated evolutionary mutation" ? Kroot don't change overnight - it's a tedious process that requires constant supervision to avoid evolutionary dead-ends. Hence the need for shapers who guide the tribe's evolution.

Cloudscape_online
27-05-2005, 15:54
Yes, I know that. The tyranid genus always overemphasises the prominent characteristics of the race that has been used to create that genus. Eldar are used to make Zoanthropes, and SMs' are used for Tyrant Guard. What is the Kroot ability? To visibly evolve their characteristics within 2-3 generations. A kroot based tyranid organism would allow this change to happen a LOT faster.

Pertinax
27-05-2005, 15:59
So waht happens when a Kroot eats a Necron?

According to Andy Chambers, you get Krootons.

Cloudscape_online
27-05-2005, 16:07
lol :p :cool:

Bruen
27-05-2005, 17:20
What about the other way around? If/when the hive has consumed enough kroot, will there be a tyranid model that has hyper accelerated evolutionary mutation?

Tyranids already have this, DNA from stuff that Tyranids eat gets sent back to birthing chambers in the hive fleet where the Norn Queens decide which evolutionary traits to include in the next generation of critters.

You get Zoanthropes from Eldar DNA for example.

Cloudscape_online
27-05-2005, 23:50
umm, didn't I make that example already? :rolleyes:

Barbarossa
27-05-2005, 23:54
So waht happens when a Kroot eats a Necron?

According to Andy Chambers, you get Krootons.

You know you'll have to be smoten for that.

Aside from this, I think the Kroot's genetic malleability could be put to use in improved lictors who can even better adapt to the planet they were sent to. Maybe let the Lictor reroll cover saves IF there is cover.

Now back to the smiting part. *looks for a thunder hammer*

Flame Boy
29-05-2005, 21:06
Having Tyranids that could evolve themselves independently of the Hive Fleet's intervention would be interesting... It would be quite amusing if the Tyranid involved could absorb the wrong DNA and mutate horribly to the point of death... They might not have the Hive Mind's omnipotent understanding of genetics, after all... I guess it could be a larger variant of the ripper, it ingests everything in it's path and it's hyper-efficient metabolism extracts useful genetic information and the overgrown-ripperdon-thingy starts inheriting traits from it's surroundings. When you put it in front of a patch of fungus you end up with deadly spore-spewing skin...? I can imagine it would have a nasty effect on morale... something that keeps growing and changing as it moves around... Almost like a Tyranid chaos spawn, so maybe it wouldn't be a unique enough concept. aving an optional change for this semi-intelligent harvester to twist into a shape that is unable to survive would be an interesting disadvantage... maybe it could lose wounds due to an unstable metabolism. I'd imagine most Tyranids would have short lifespans anyway... a giant centipede-slug thing that hoovers up organic matter and combines the DNA spontaneously as it grows would generally die pretty quickly andway, but it would gather up a lot of DNA as it goes.

I guess it could serve the role of a testbed or "prototype" Tyranid, which exists firstlyto consume biomass and secondly to exaggerate traits in harvested biomass to test for suitability? When these creatures are re-absorbed by the rest of the hive, their success could then be analysed perhaps?

Then again, I think I accidentally described the Red Terror just then, didn't I?

Barbarossa
29-05-2005, 21:16
The Red Terror doesn't exist anymore. It was eaten by the Tyranids. :D

TheSonOfAbbadon
29-05-2005, 21:24
Exactly, he said that at the end of his post.

I bet Old One Eye was the same kind of thing, and he was very successful.

Khaine's Messenger
29-05-2005, 21:29
Having Tyranids that could evolve themselves independently of the Hive Fleet's intervention would be interesting

Done and done. They appear in some of the old Kryptmann background; one of them was used as an assassin organism and basically ate other animals and mutated "on the move"...'twas an ugly thing, little better than Chaos Spawn in terms of keeping a coherent form, iirc. Of course, that's old background....

Flame Boy
29-05-2005, 21:46
Nice one, Barbarossa. :D Does that mean we are not allowed to speak of the Red Terror ever again? Will we get the "Red Terror Question" in every Q+A session? ;)

In reply to Khaine's messenger, That sounds pretty interesting, I would have thought to assassinate someone you'd need a tight control on your Tyranid's capabilities, so to "morph" on the fly does seem somewhat odd... What if it chooses to evolve in a way that makes it useless as an assassain? It seems odd to instinctively "know" what DNA is best to incorporate into yourself. The Kroot have difficulty figuring it out over long periods of time, so how could a single Tyranid get it right so easily on the fly?

Naturally i'm biased, but I prefer the idea of a harvester/testbed 'Nid for this purpose, as an assassain organism would give it's position away by eating the Lieutenant's prized cat, his cactus collection and the cleaning lady before attacking... :D

What would that create? A spiny, mop-wielding Tyranid that can be distracted with catnip? :eek:

Khaine's Messenger
29-05-2005, 22:07
"Getting it right on the fly"? Eh. As I noted, the end of the organism's lifespan is rather messy. Of course, I only called it an assassin because in that background it seemed "keyed" to hunt out Kryptmann somehow; it simply raged in as straight-line a path as possible while feeding merely to sustain itself and adapt to the local environment. No need to instinctively know what works locally, just accrue enought body mass or stored energy (at the very least) to be a threat.

Flame Boy
29-05-2005, 23:57
Okay, My fault for reading your post too literally. Sorry... :)

MasterShaper
14-04-2006, 07:02
There's something in that idea that appeals to me. Maybe I'm prejudiced cos i play kroot and nids, but there is potential.

I read somewhere of kroot being forced to eat tyranid meat so often it came to the point that the kroot were so much like a tyranid organism, the hive mind just accepted them as its own. i don't think this would work, as the kroot wouldnt have a link to the hive mind, but it's an intersting notion, no?

Briareos
14-04-2006, 08:22
The Tyranid organisms are highly toxic and overflowing with killer-cells designed to break down any biological organism they come in contact with. It is something half-way between contagious cancerous cells and organic acid. In a way Tyranids are a bit like fugu, except the whole body is poison glands.

So there is no way, as the current fluff stands, Kroot (or anyone) could eat Tyranid without a lentghy preparation and purification process - and Kroots aren't really known for their culinary expertise.

Melchiah
14-04-2006, 10:34
Before we all suffer another "krooton" , they wont touch chaos either, read a fluff in a WD sometime ago where some kroot thought it would be a good idea to eat some noise marines. "Kroot and the techno-colour dream hide." They thus burned the chaos-kroot.

CommanderCax
14-04-2006, 13:40
1. Tyranid phage-cells (present in great numbers in all Tyranid organisms) act like organic acid on any foreign body they come in contact with. Eating a 'nid equals being devored from the inside as the phage-cells immediatly attack the foreign, non-Tyranid digesting system.


Well, not necessarily. Tyranid phage cells would certainly be disolved by the Kroot's digestive fluids and broken down into its amino acids as all proteins are. If the Kroot have a digestive system similiar to humans (which I doubt...), the only possibility for any phages to act would be on its way into the stomach (mouth, oesophagus). Once in the stomach hydrochloric acid and proteases like pepsin would get rid of any Tyranid phages quite fast...

Rlyehable
14-04-2006, 13:49
While definatly not cannon by any strech of the imagination, I used the mutual gene-shaping in the background of my tyranid hive.

A splinter fleet met some Kroot mercs and tried to use thier genes to enhance the tryanid gene absorbing/directing process.

It backfired. The new species showed a great ability for self-direction, like genestealers. So the gene was incorporated more widely. Unfortunatly, the later generations started to form independant hives and did not seem to share synapse with the parent hive.

The splinterfleet was ruthless in its response. It cleansed every organism with the incorporated kroot genes. Unfortunatly, the genes were incorporated into most of the fleet. After the purge, there was only bout 1/3rd of the hive left. And it no longer had the gene-template to create Hive Tyrants or Carnifexes.

This explained why my hive fleet has yet to field a monsterous creature.

Briareos
14-04-2006, 14:02
Tyranid phage cells would certainly be disolved by the Kroot's digestive fluids and broken down into its amino acids as all proteins are. If the Kroot have a digestive system similiar to humans (which I doubt...), the only possibility for any phages to act would be on its way into the stomach (mouth, oesophagus). Once in the stomach hydrochloric acid and proteases like pepsin would get rid of any Tyranid phages quite fast...
Since simple organisms such as stomach worms or other such intestinal parasites manage to survive easily their little trip in digestive tracks. I believe Tyranid phage-cells, designed to devour other organisms and survive hostile conditions, wouldn't have any trouble whatsoever to survive stomach acids.

mjolnir
14-04-2006, 14:06
So waht happens when a Kroot eats a Necron?

According to Andy Chambers, you get Krootons.


Hm. For some reason, I was expecting the answer to be 'constipated'.

Necrons are made out of some kind of metal, right? :rolleyes:

cav da man
14-04-2006, 23:20
im certain i read somewhere about kroot having mega super dupa digestive systems, possibly in the tau codex. They eat like things filled with metal and dissolve everything good and regurgitate whats left.
Maybe that would make it so the phage cellls cant liquidate it from the inside out. Mmmm krootshake

azimaith
15-04-2006, 02:35
Well actually if kroot actually ate necrons, they'd probably choke. Besides that, the living metal would just phase out of them when the necrons left. Living metal is essentially indestructible given enough time.

TheSonOfAbbadon
15-04-2006, 03:25
Hm. For some reason, I was expecting the answer to be 'constipated'.

Necrons are made out of some kind of metal, right? :rolleyes:

No, Necrons are made of cheese.

I think Kroot can't digest 'Nids because if they did, then GW would have to bring out a new range of Kroot-Nid minitures.

Or maybe it's because Kroot can't incorperate the 'Nids DNA.

The Mighty Gnoblar
15-04-2006, 05:35
Maybe Kroot Shapers make sure that Nids arent eaten much like how Chaos effected meat is off the menu

As for Necrons I dont think they eat them sicne there is no DNA to sample and absorb into the genetic make up of the Kroot