PDA

View Full Version : How many models attack?



r3flexx
14-07-2010, 03:59
In the rules it says something like only models in base contact can attack each other (and then the supporting ranks).

So why do people take hordes. The guys on the sides are just being wasted aren't they? There are a few benefits, but I don't really see it being worth it. Same goes for heavy cav. I see people going 1x7 with them but half of the time 2 of the 7 won't attack.

I know this doesn't seem like a rules question, but I'm trying to clarify if there is a rule that lets you attack with all of the horde unit or all of the cavalry unit.

Clowater
14-07-2010, 04:18
Even if people keep 5 wide units. If you go up against a equal horde unit with basic equipment you're already losing.

You get 10 Attacks.

They get 21.

You need to kill 6 models to break a rank, they need 1.


And if you do hordes on 20mm bases you'd be surprised how easily you can get your full attacks on 25mm bases.

If they're 5 wide, you're attacking in 8-9 files, and it's not uncommon for people to send in more than 1 unit.

The only thing that really allows you to increase attacks is the attack in extra ranks rule. The Skaven Screaming bell was recently changed from "All models count as being in base contact" result to "you can now make supporting attacks in all ranks" which is a huge loss.

mightyzombie
14-07-2010, 05:14
The Skaven Screaming bell was recently changed from "All models count as being in base contact" result to "you can now make supporting attacks in all ranks" which is a huge loss.

A loss? Sure. A huge loss. I don't think I'd go that far.
Only in very specific circumstances is such a change going to affect the actual number of attacks being made. There are no units that can push a Screaming Bell AND get more than one attack by default, since that only include Clanrats and Stormvermin. The Lore of Ruin spell Death Frenzy, is the only one off the top of my head that the Skaven had immediate access to, although there are probably a couple of others. Plus that was only a single result of the nine available on the Ringing the Bell table. On top of all that, it is one of only three effects on the table that occur on a single result (13 in this case). The other 6 occur on multiple different results of the 3D6 rolled, making this one result a 1-in-10~ish chance of being rolled.

If one is banking on a 1-in-10~ish chance each turn, 5 times per game (since this result can't be obtained on the first turn), then I can see how one would consider this to be a huge loss. Although, at that point, I'm guessing ALL of one's games are huge losses.

EDIT: My math failed during this post.

Clowater
14-07-2010, 05:38
A loss? Sure. A huge loss. I don't think I'd go that far.
Only in very specific circumstances is such a change going to affect the actual number of attacks being made. There are no units that can push a Screaming Bell AND get more than one attack by default, since that only include Clanrats and Stormvermin. The Lore of Ruin spell Death Frenzy, is the only one off the top of my head that the Skaven had immediate access to, although there are probably a couple of others. Plus that was only a single result of the nine available on the Ringing the Bell table. On top of all that, it is one of only three effects on the table that occur on a single result (13 in this case). The other 6 occur on multiple different results of the 3D6 rolled, making this one result a 1-in-15 chance of being rolled.

If you're banking on a 1-in-15 chance each turn, 5 times per game (since this result can't be obtained on the first turn), then I can see how this would be a huge loss for you. Although, at that point, I'm guessing ALL your games are huge losses for you.

Instead of bashing a small part of my post you could've stayed on topic and posted something constructive.

My opinion may differ from yours, but you should really respect mine and not base one small point of a game on my success.

Regardless it's a significant change without considering anything that gives bonus attacks, as supporting attacks can only be used if the models in front are in base to base.

It worked great when you charge a monster, get flanked, or of course were death frenzied.

Not quite so much now.

Plus your math is wrong.

getting a 13 on 3 dice is roughly a 9.7% chance. Equalling roughly 1 in 10 not 15.

Theres a 1 in 3 chance you'll get a result from 8-13

mightyzombie
14-07-2010, 05:45
Instead of bashing a small part of my post you could've stayed on topic and posted something constructive.

My opinion may differ from yours, but you should really respect mine and not base one small point of a game on my success.

Regardless it's a significant change without considering anything that gives bonus attacks, as supporting attacks can only be used if the models in front are in base to base.

It worked great when you charge a monster, get flanked, or of course were death frenzied.

Not quite so much now.

Plus your math is wrong.

getting a 13 on 3 dice is roughly a 9.7% chance. Equalling roughly 1 in 10 not 15.

Theres a 1 in 3 chance you'll get a result from 8-13

You are correct, sir. My math was indeed wrong. I also was speaking in the generalized "You" rather than speaking directly to you. I will edit my original post accordingly, so there's no lingering confusion. Also my apologies for going so off-topic. I simply meant to express my disagreement with the statement "huge loss" and ended up sort of tangenting. Tangenting. It's a word now.