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Citadel97501
25-07-2010, 05:57
Well the title says it all, does an extra hand weapon count as a special weapon?

I am thinking about giving my Chaos Warriors, Halberds, and Extra Hand Weapons, but I wasn't sure if it was possible to use the extra Hand Weapons if I have Halberds? If not it might just be an option if I have shields?

Reasoning for Equipment on Frenzied Warriors: (12 warriors 2x6)
-24 strength 5 attacks
-30 at Strength 4

Ultimate Life Form
25-07-2010, 06:07
'We use the term special weapon to cover anything that isn't a hand weapon.'

The book then proceeds to list the various types of special weapons under the header 'weapons'. So how do we know it's only special weapons on that list? Because the only explicitly non-special weapon, the hand weapon, is not included. Listed among the special weapons is the entry 'two/additional hand weapon'. So yes, it is a special setup. Further evidence is the fact that it confers a special rule (extra attack) which is by the book's definition not a trait of an ordinary hand weapon, but rather a special weapon (several lines scattered across the 'weapons section').

burad
25-07-2010, 07:13
Please note that the halberd require two hands, so you cannot use another weapon and a halberd at the same time. It also says that a model can't, however, wield a brace of pistols or additional hand weapon alongside another type of special weapon such as, say, a halberd.
So if you want to take the additional hand weapon, go ahead, but you can't use it and a halberd at the same time, and won't get an additional attack for having it.

Atrahasis
25-07-2010, 07:52
You'd get to choose each combat what to use, though.

Azhrar
25-07-2010, 10:29
The additional handweapon really isn't worth it anymore (if it ever was) as you don't get support attacks with the additional attacks and then the strength bonus from Halberd is vastly superior.

alextroy
25-07-2010, 20:54
True, but sometime you need volume of attacks more the strength.

But to answer the important question, an additional hand weapons is as much a special weapon as a halberd and you get to choose which you use at the beginning of each combat.

Notably, a model armed with an Extra Hand Weapon must use that Extra Hand Weapon in combat and cannot use a shield (now that EHW is has been changed to include Requires Two hands in the Errata/FAQ).

Citadel97501
25-07-2010, 21:26
Ok, thanks for the clarification, I also did some math and the extra hand weapon is not worth it, except in the rare case where they fail their fear test, or with Dragon Ogres, and this is all done with the idea that killing is more important than surviving.

Using WS 3 Base. . .
6x2 Frenzied Chaos Warriors with Full Command (Chosen are the same)
EHW vs. Toughness 3: 13.5 wounds
Halberd vs. Toughness 3: 13.775 wounds
EHW vs. Toughness 4: 10.33 wounds
Halberd vs. Toughness 4: 10.89 wounds

3x2 Nurgle Ogres with Chaos Armor (If they pass their fear test, + stomp)
EHW vs. Toughness 3: 10.93 wounds
GW vs. Toughness 3: 11.515 wounds
EHW vs. Toughness 4: 8.25 wounds
GW vs. Toughness 4: 10.515 wounds

4 Dragon Ogres (No Frenzy, If they pass their fear test, + stomp)
EHW vs. Toughness 3: 12.15 wounds
GW vs. Toughness 3: 9.95 wounds
EHW vs. Toughness 4: 9.6 wounds
GW vs. Toughness 4: 9.32 wounds

alextroy
26-07-2010, 04:42
On the average, you are correct. However, EHW has a wider variance then Halberd or Great Weapon.

Paraelix
26-07-2010, 05:09
(now that EHW is has been changed to include Requires Two hands in the Errata/FAQ).

Sorry... But if you attempted that in a game, you deserve to be slapped thoroughly.

Blitz001
26-07-2010, 06:21
Sorry... But if you attempted that in a game, you deserve to be slapped thoroughly.

quoted for truth