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malika
30-07-2010, 15:24
I'm curious, what were the relationships between the Alpha Legion with the other Legions. I know there was rivalry between the sons of Alpharius and the Ultramarines and that Alpharius looked up to Horus. But what about the rest? Is there any official info out there? I vaguely remember something about the Imperial Fists being disliked as well and the Word Bearers too, but I can't confirm it.

So is there any info on this?

Zothos
30-07-2010, 16:40
As far as I can recall the Alphas disliked the Ultramarines and pretty much kept to themselves beyond that. Being focused on trying to show how "great" they were in comparison to the "older" legions.

However i have no exact reference point for this, more of a faded old memory of something......

Londinium
30-07-2010, 17:20
Horus was a father figure towards Alpharius so you'd expect there was some degree of camaderie between their legions aswell but other than that theres not much mentioned.

Grubnar
30-07-2010, 17:52
Alpharius, and his Legion, did not see eye to eye with most Legions. They dispised the World Eaters for their lack of varied tactics, the Word Bearers for their religious dogma and the Imperial Fists for their fanaticism. But most of all they dispised the Ultramarines for their rigid Codex Astrades (although the actual codex had not been writen by then, its ideals were already influencing the Ultramarines).

"They aim at fixed values, but in war everything is uncertain and calculations have to be made with variuable qualitys." - Carl von Clausewitz.

It seems to me that both Leman Russ and Alpharius are, to a degree, based on he writings of Carl von Clausewitz and therefor did not like the Codex Astrades one little bit!

Promethius
30-07-2010, 18:00
There was some mention of a deep enmity between the fists and the alphas, but ive never found out any more than that. Why they hate each other, beyond the obvious, i don't know.

I assume they hate the white scars for the whole valdorus thing.

malika
30-07-2010, 18:14
Where did you get that info from, them despising the World Eaters, Word Beaders and Imperial Fists?

Lord Lorne Walkier
30-07-2010, 20:29
Every we know about the Alpha Legion is tainted with lies and damm lies.

malika
31-07-2010, 01:00
I found this little snippet on the Alpha Legion forums:


???
Conflicts with allied Space Marine Legions
---------------
The Alpha Legion's pride leads to a number incidents where they clash and even fight against members of other Legions prior to the Heresy. They clash with the Imperial Fists on more than one occasion, which hints a mutual hatred between the two Legions.
---------------

* Sources
3rd Edition Codex Chaos Space Marines (1999): p.32

There is something very dangerous in this. Prior to the Horus Heresy, the novels only seemed to suggest Marine infighting when the Loken encountered the possessed marine. However, the 3rd edition Chaos Codex seems to suggest that the Alpha Legion were already attacking other Legions (plural) before the Horus Heresy. Odd thing is why this hasn't been investigated by the Imperium or why haven't they been declared Traitors sooner?

Lord_Crull
31-07-2010, 01:06
The Alpha Legion had a rivallry with the Imperial Fists first, then when the IA series came along they changed it to the Ultramarines.

TheMav80
31-07-2010, 01:08
I bet various Legions had conflicts quite often. Just not full blown attacks on one another.

The fight between Russ and Johnson being an example.

The Thousand Sons and Space Wolves as well.

malika
31-07-2010, 01:13
The Alpha Legion had a rivallry with the Imperial Fists first, then when the IA series came along they changed it to the Ultramarines.

It was more than mere rivalry, the Codex seems to describe it as mutual hatred. Why would that and the rivalry with the Ultramarines be exclusive of each other? Alpharius could have a rivalry with Guilliman and feelings of hatred for Rogal Dorn. Maybe his hatred for Rogal Dorn made him a great buddy of Perturabo?


I bet various Legions had conflicts quite often. Just not full blown attacks on one another.

The fight between Russ and Johnson being an example.

The Thousand Sons and Space Wolves as well.
The fight between Johnson and Russ was sort of a brotherly fight. I don't know about the Space Wolves and Thousand Sons before the Space Wolves invading Prospero though...

Lord_Crull
31-07-2010, 01:40
It was more than mere rivalry, the Codex seems to describe it as mutual hatred. Why would that and the rivalry with the Ultramarines be exclusive of each other? Alpharius could have a rivalry with Guilliman and feelings of hatred for Rogal Dorn. Maybe his hatred for Rogal Dorn made him a great buddy of Perturabo?


Well because IA Alpha Legion makes absolutely no mention of the fist rivallry. I would expect at least a passing mention since then.

But then again everything is lies and secrets with the Alpha Legion.

Wyrmwood
31-07-2010, 15:31
I wouldn't have expected the Alpha Legion to have been actively friendly with any other Legion aside from those that favoured more individuality, but were not so snide and superior - like the Luna Wolves.