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ShurikenSerpent
05-08-2010, 15:49
Damn you Games Workshop, damn you.

Having been brought up on a diametrically-opposed diet of Khorne-hates-Slaanesh/Nurgle-loathes-Tzeentch goodness (thanks to the old school Realms of Chaos books and much monotheistic indoctrination in the hallowed pages of White Dwarf), I'm finding it difficult to get my head around all the combined-God army hijinks the young whippersnappers get up to nowadays.

Almost impossible, even.

See, I'm trying to build a Warriors of Chaos army, but every time I write a list, it ends up assuming a pretty God specific look. I know combined lists are probably more effective, I know there's no rule restrictions... it just happens. And now, despite only having around 2,000 points worth of troops, I have heros coming out of the wazoo as a result.

3 Disc riders. Sigvald, a Slaaneshi BSB, warshrine and exalted on boobworm. Having picked up the gorgeous Lord-on-Jugger model, I'm now seriously contemplating buying the Bloodcrusher set so I can model Chaos Knight champions and another BSB. Where does it end?!

I'm having to paint my models in neutrals and metals, because it would be simply inconcievable for me to field Khorne champions with troops in pink or blue. I'd end up overturning the games table.

Is it just me? Does everyone now happily enjoy the let's-all-get-along tea party of the Chaos Gods? Or does anyone else have similar issues? And more importanly, are there any support groups available?

Tonberry
05-08-2010, 15:57
Well, the chaos gods are opposed, doesn't mean their followers have to be. The northmen will take whatever they can get to survive, and if it means annoying Khorne by shooting lightning bolts or annoying Nurgle by having their hair done then eventually they will pay the price, the gods are fickle indeed.

So, in my oppinion, tea party> we must fight each other because our trousers are a different colour.

Odin
05-08-2010, 16:03
Damn you Games Workshop, damn you.

Having been brought up on a diametrically-opposed diet of Khorne-hates-Slaanesh/Nurgle-loathes-Tzeentch goodness (thanks to the old school Realms of Chaos books and much monotheistic indoctrination in the hallowed pages of White Dwarf), I'm finding it difficult to get my head around all the combined-God army hijinks the young whippersnappers get up to nowadays.

Almost impossible, even.

See, I'm trying to build a Warriors of Chaos army, but every time I write a list, it ends up assuming a pretty God specific look. I know combined lists are probably more effective, I know there's no rule restrictions... it just happens. And now, despite only having around 2,000 points worth of troops, I have heros coming out of the wazoo as a result.

3 Disc riders. Sigvald, a Slaaneshi BSB, warshrine and exalted on boobworm. Having picked up the gorgeous Lord-on-Jugger model, I'm now seriously contemplating buying the Bloodcrusher set so I can model Chaos Knight champions and another BSB. Where does it end?!

I'm having to paint my models in neutrals and metals, because it would be simply inconcievable for me to field Khorne champions with troops in pink or blue. I'd end up overturning the games table.

Is it just me? Does everyone now happily enjoy the let's-all-get-along tea party of the Chaos Gods? Or does anyone else have similar issues? And more importanly, are there any support groups available?


My solution is to create several different god-specific armies that can be merged for really big battles - very much in keeping with even the old background material.

For me, painting a Jugger rider in non-Khorne colours to avoid clashing is far worse than fielding units from different Gods.

ShurikenSerpent
05-08-2010, 16:09
That's a pretty damned expensive solution (even if it is technically the way I appear to be heading).

That said the different-coloured-trouser comment holds much sense. Even though it goes against every fiber of my being, I may avoid God specific colours altogether on everything other than Lords. And Heroes. And maybe standards. Weathered metals and leathers it is...

Vashta
05-08-2010, 16:12
I'm having similar issues with a Daemons army :S

Peegore
05-08-2010, 16:27
Never was big into Chaos and Daemons until WoC book came out. So when the time came and I plunged headlong into a 2k army, fielding a list of mixed Deity-worshipping troops didn't feel alien in the slightest.

Having said that, I didn't want a pockets of Pink, Red, Blue and Green units dotted around my deployment zone.... in my armies, like many other peoples, a solid colour scheme throughout the ranks is a must! So I plumped for purple/greyish blue with highlights of pale pink. Biased I suppose towards a slaanesh/tzeench looking force.

Just means that when I deploy my army, I have to point out to the opponent which unit has what mark. No biggie really. All I care is that the army looks unified as a whole :)

wizbix
05-08-2010, 16:44
I'v always assumed that although chaos factions hate each other they will from time to time come together to pour out of the chaos realm, they usually loose because they are not that cohesive and there is a lot of infighting. Hence you can get away with a combined list. I am however not a chaos expert so please feel free to enlighten me if i'm wrong. If I were a chaos general though I'd be looking to collect a themed list soley around one of the chaos gods but thats just me. I'd pick nurgle and buy myself the ridiculously expensive model from forgeworld because I love it.

Zangor
05-08-2010, 17:03
I just come up with my own fluff. My army looks mostly nurgle, but that wont stop me from using other marks, i just fit that into my nurgle theme. As an example i think frenzied plague zombies (MoK marauders) are a lot more scary than ordinary khorne marauders. But i have never spend much time reading the background stories and it may be harder to justify those kind of ideas if you have.

SideshowLucifer
05-08-2010, 17:12
I hate the new era of Chaos cooperation as well, and I especialy hate the segregation of the Daemons and warriors.
I know all the younger players want to be able to play mixed lists and go nuts with combos that should never be, but I realy wish tey had options and reasons to take loyal lists.

Brother Loki
05-08-2010, 17:30
The way I look at it, unless you're fighting exclusively in the chaos wastes, chaos armies are likely to be multi-mark anyway. The chaos armies that invade the 'civilised' sections of the old world are usually made up of an amalgamation of warbands that come together to go raiding. While the northern tribes often hate each other, they hate everyone else more. Every so often a lord will conquer enough rival warbands to make up an army, and head south for some pillage and plunder against the soft southerners. When this happens on a really large scale, you get the chaos incursions, such as the ones led by Asavar Kul and Archaon. No reason it can't happen on a smaller scale as well, though.

Furthermore, most of the tribes venerate the gods as a pantheon, and will offer prayers to whichever is most appropriate to the cirumstances. Monotheistic chaos worshippers would likely be in a minority.

I think its pretty reasonable to have an army made up of several warbands, even if they do carry different marks - give each one a champion or sorceror to lead it, and then have the lord and his warband (probably the largest) as the core of your army (perhaps as an undivided lord to tie the others together).

TheKingInYellow
05-08-2010, 17:31
I'm mixing right now, but when I get a better handle on the army (new WoC player) I'll mono-mark it.

I'm going to paint my whole army in black, grey, bronze, with hits of red and blue, but I'll have extra standard bearers with their standards painted for all my blocks with clear colour coding so that I can make it easy to remember which unit has which mark. Red banner? Khorne mark. Easy peasy.

Lord Inquisitor
05-08-2010, 17:31
It is indeed odd to the old ways, but there's some cool fluff about it - the 40K Daemon Codex explains it best, in that Chaos is ... well, chaotic and you could have Slaanesh forces fighting other Slaanesh forces allied with Khorne forces in a great scheme to thwart Nurgle's manipulations of Khorne, all of which was of course set in motion by Tzeentch...

In any case, however, I play Slaanesh and thus far all of my armies (both 40K and Fantasy) have been purely Slaanesh based. However, I'm starting to think about branching out into a few non-Slaanesh units like Horrors just because they're too damn useful...

Soul of Iron
05-08-2010, 17:47
I was mono-god Tzeentch for 2 editions. The new demons book is designed for you to mix the gods around so I've been splicing Khornate units into the army.

The army functions better this way. At least for me.

w3rm
05-08-2010, 18:08
As long as you have one marked hero for each god marked unit you take I think it would be fluffwise fine.

EG

Khorne Lord on Jugger
Herald of Slaanesh BSB
Nurgle lvl 1 Sorc
Tzeetnch lcl 2 Sorc
15 Warriors with Shields and MoT
30 Mauraders with GW and MoK
10 Maurader Horsemen with MoS
6 Knights with MoN
5 Knights with MoK
3 Dragon Ogres

Seems like a nice fluffy army to me.

Tarliyn
05-08-2010, 18:09
To make mixed marks work in a mono-god army it just takes a little creative thinking for instance:

A Khorne army-
Mark of Nurgle- affects WS. I can think of a number of reasons why khorne would grant his warriors a gift that would allow them to hit faster and better than their opponents. He wants his warriors to be able to destroy their foes. Giving them increased combat proficiency seems like a good way to help ensure that.
Mark of Tzeench- Grants Ward save. Rather than have it be a ward save, say khorne grants the warriors the ability to parry attacks or dodge blows more efficiently, an increase in strength or bulk so they can just shrug off a wound, a rage so deep they don't care if they are mortally wounded, etc.
Mark of Slaanesh- Gives some protections against psychology. While I struggle with something to come up with here, I am sure someone else could figure something out.

You can do that with every mark, gift, or magic item in the book. Just because something is called Khorne's Collar of Magical Doom doesn't mean there isn't a similar item devoted to another god somewhere in the warhammer world.

Just do some creative thinking and if anyone calls you out on having a mark of nurgle in your khorne army say, "its not mark of nurgle its mark of Khorne likes killing stuff, it just does the same thing as mark of nurgle :p "

Dhaemian
05-08-2010, 18:37
Why call it mono-god madness.

Historically only one general ever managed to ally all the armies under the single banner of Chaos. And that was Archaon.

All other times units of one God would only follow another God's general if they could use the guy for ulterior motives set by their own God or if they were forced, In which case they probably try and kill the guy at the first occasion.

It makes sense to play mono-god when your general's affiliated.
If he ain't affiliated well that's another story. Though I find it hard to believe someone unaffiliated might be strong enough to stand up against those who have been blessed.

Personally I play mono-god and always will. Makes me less competitive for sure, but heck it's way more amusing.

As for painting, well I went with a viking look (cold looking metal, wood, leather, wool) and my banners will decide if a unit gets a mark or not.
Means I'll be able to go over elsewhere easier by just swapping a new general, banner bearer etc...

dragonet111
05-08-2010, 18:44
I was mono-god Tzeentch for 2 editions. The new demons book is designed for you to mix the gods around so I've been splicing Khornate units into the army.

The army functions better this way. At least for me.

Same story here.
Mono Tzeentch under Horde of Chaos but since the Daemon army book I play a Tzeentch/Khorne army with a Herald of Khorne as my general.

Brother Loki
06-08-2010, 12:09
Historically only one general ever managed to ally all the armies under the single banner of Chaos. And that was Archaon.


Archaon is just the most recent Everchosen who led the united armies of chaos. There have been a whole bunch more before him (I think Archaon is the 13th, but I may be wrong on that). His Predecessor was Asavar Kul, who led the incursion which the Empire refers to as the Great War against Chaos, when Magnus the Pious united the Empire, Elves and Dwarves to throw back the invaders.

I would definitely have any army with mixed marks led by an undivided character though.

kramplarv
06-08-2010, 12:17
For me, painting a Jugger rider in non-Khorne colours to avoid clashing is far worse than fielding units from different Gods.


personally I dislike "god specific" colors on everything. red/brass/gold khorne armies = boring. :) I would rather look at a big bad neutral painted juggernaut than another circus army led by a redpainted lord with golden bling! :D

mrtn
06-08-2010, 12:25
I use a unified colour scheme on all my chaos models, I think the rainbow armies look very strange. Besides, no one would look askance on a Empire cannon crew painted in Ostermark colours, or demand that they should be repainted in Nuln colours, so I don't see why anyone would do something similar to chaos, which is supposed to be one of the most varied armies, what with mutations and all.

I also prefer the pantheon idea to the old "all gods hate each other" thought which is more prevalent in the community than in the actual books.

Pendragon
06-08-2010, 14:05
I still play my WoC has completely mono-slaanesh (barring magic items and gifts), basically, anything that can have the Mark of Slaanesh will have it.

Although, I'll probably paint up a wizard in somewhat more neutral colours and have him unmarked for some magical variety, but the mark of another god? Never!

...

But then again I include a DoW cannon in friendly games, so I can probably be considered something of a dirty cheater anyway... ;)

/Joel

snyggejygge
06-08-2010, 14:45
I have the exact same issues, I solved it by making sure that the Gods that hate eachother can never be fielded in the same army, so potentially I can run the following armies:
Khorne with either Tzeentch or Nurgle (but noth both)
Tzeentch with either Khorne or Slaanesh
Nurgle with either Slaanesh or Khorne

Right now I use a Tzeentch/ Khorne army, themed around a Khorne marauder warband, but including a Tzeentch level 4 (the tribes shaman), the other 2 characters & the troops have Mark of Khorne (if possible).

Like many others I prefer a more natural & less disco look on my army, I use Brass warriors instead of red etc etc, still Khorne themed, but usable for other themes or marks.

It might not be the best solution, but it's one that I quite enjoy, allows me to use some mixed armies, but don't stray too far away from the old fluff.