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Guardian of the Rage
21-08-2010, 12:13
Greetings all,

I have a list that I would like critiqued because while i'm not displeased with it, i'm not quite over-the-moon either. I just feel that it lacks something in the MSU part of the battles.

I will post it here now and most things are subject to change, though obviously a few aren't... Any help that you guys can provide would be greatly appreciated.

Archmage: L4 (life), Foliaths, Tal. of Saphery, wand - 350 (in PGs)

Noble: BSB, AoCaledor, Pond stone/Guardian Phoenix, great weapon (in PGs) - 168
Mage: L1 (high), annulian - 140

Spearmen (50) Command - 475 [horde]
Seaguard (15) Command, Banner of scarecrow - 225
Seaguard (15) Command - 220

Phoenix Guard (28) Command, obsidian pendent, Banner of sorcery - 515 [6*5]
White Lions (24) Command, banner of eternal flame - 400 [8*3]
Dragon princes (6) musician, Standard, Banner of Ellyrion - 225

RBT - 100
RBT - 100
Eagle x4 - 200

I'm starting to feel like I have too many eagles and not enough of the dragon princes (in one game it would have useful if they were considerably bigger). Also, I have 3 what you would call 'line' units which actually have more than 2/3s of the armies points cost (including characters) sunk into them. The Seaguard provide war machine protection (hence that scarecrow banner), flank charges and archery support as appropriate. The Spear horde has proven useful thus far, although a direct hit from a Rocket battery was not nice, and the Dragon princes focus on killing smaller enemy units and skirmishers. The white Lions are normally my answer to enemy monsters cavalry and heavier infantry.

I am willing to purchase pretty well anything and I do have other models etc. Also, this is not a tournament list, more a kind of semi-pro.

As i said, any comments at all would be greatly appreciated.

Kind regards,
GotR

thesheriff
21-08-2010, 22:42
Looks good. Looks really good. Honestly, you should do fine. Al i would do is drop 2 of the eagles for anouther RBT, 2 should be enough.

Also, How are you finding horde spearmen. In theroy, its awsome, but seeing it play, and fail, i don't value it. It just seems like a points sink too far

Guardian of the Rage
22-08-2010, 20:25
Thanks for the reply Sheriff,

I have found the horde spears decent enough, provided that I pick the right opponents. I don't find that they draw much magic or ranged attention to be honest, this is normally reserved for the Lions. I don't know about the bolt thrower, I don't think that I could do without the Eagles they always seem to kill off the war machines. I'll certainly think about it.

Kind regards,
GotR

Bloody Nunchucks
23-08-2010, 18:11
4 eagles is to many, another bolt thrower would be good, i would also lower the spear unit and take some more seaguard.

its a really good list, its pretty much what i use myself all the time, think about korhil to make a unit stubborn and take out heroes. also i would take SM's instead of WL, just a preference, both are great

Stoffen
23-08-2010, 20:53
I think you should throw the banner from the highelf book that grants magic resistance (2) on the the spearmen, it really is nice to have some magic defence on a unit like that, and a 25pts its a steal.

Also, you should keep your 4 eagles.

However, the bolt throwers are really, really risky to take in 8th.
remember, you always wound on 6s now. And the BRB states that warmachines need a crew of at least 2 to work. This means that if you take as much as 1 wound and fail your 6+ save, its as good as dead.

I think you should take the banner of sorcery and put on the white-lions, and then give the razor standard to the phoenix guards, it makes them so much more killy.
Ofc this means no flaming, but with my suggestions you should get more attacks to compensate against regen.

Also, field your whitelions in horde ;) youre stubborn and with the extra attacks they become insanely killy.

I like the small units of seaguards, though never seen them used before, however I think you should drop one of the units and add a few more models to one of the units until you have spent as close to exactly 750pts spend on core.

Add more white lions for the points until you hit 30ish modelcount on them.

The 6 dragon princes are just a plain awesome and insanely killy unit and is more or less mandatory now.

Bloody Nunchucks
23-08-2010, 20:57
dragon princes are NOT mandatory, they will NEVER break a unit on their own anymore, the most they can do is support a charge or be put on a flank for refusal.

eagles are good but they dont march block anymore and you cant direct charges now

Stoffen
23-08-2010, 21:01
With that banner and the killing power of 13 whitelions on the charge they are a sane bet to use as a flank charger to add some extra kills to a combat where the opponent is not steadfast.

Dude, even brets are having a hard time using only cav to break things on their own.

Eagles are warmachine hunters, seing as template weapons are now insanely deadly, squishy HEs will die in hordes (wink, wink) unless you take them out, and fast.

thesheriff
23-08-2010, 21:48
White lions can work well as both hammer and anvil. In a high elf army, i always suggest taking a largish unit of white lions or phoiniex guard as the anvil. They both have good saves (more so phoiniex guard) and when charges can dish out alot of attacks. 30, 10x3 is what i run, maybe aa bsb or combat charecters to keep them ticking. I then flank it with with 2-3 ranks of either white lions or swordsmasters. They hit the flank, take away ranks and the anvil mops up the rest with its 30 odd S4+ attacks.

lacurra
24-08-2010, 00:12
i love DP's, as long as they don't get wiped out by a cannon or fanatics but when they charge you are hard pressed to find a harder hitting unit.

Signius
24-08-2010, 04:41
However, the bolt throwers are really, really risky to take in 8th.
remember, you always wound on 6s now. And the BRB states that warmachines need a crew of at least 2 to work. This means that if you take as much as 1 wound and fail your 6+ save, its as good as dead.


While the fluff description may have been somewhat confusing, the BRB does not state this. And they FAQ'd it for good measure in the BRB FAQ. I still think they are too fragile, but it takes two wounds not one.

D'Haran
24-08-2010, 17:16
Keep the Eagles, drop the RBT's to add more bodies to the seaguard units and the DP's (this is totally optional). Never believe you have too many Eagles, heck maybe you should put 2 more in there for good measure, I have to say in 8th I've never found myself thinking after a battle that I had too many Eagles.

thesheriff
24-08-2010, 21:39
However, the bolt throwers are really, really risky to take in 8th.
remember, you always wound on 6s now. And the BRB states that warmachines need a crew of at least 2 to work. This means that if you take as much as 1 wound and fail your 6+ save, its as good as dead.


Just out of intrest, whats gonna get close enough to shoot the RBt's. 48" range of a RBt means that you should (if your clever) you'll be at least 18" away from all the bowmen people are scared about. Not to mention, if he choses to move towards them, he'll have to worry about all the combat units edging closer to his plucky bowmen. Unless people are taking armies of bow-toting fast cav., you don't need to worry that much. And, 6's are 6's, and you've still got to hit the damn thing.

lacurra
24-08-2010, 22:27
yeah i don't think they are that risky, they are still a great artillery and great at thining out enemy units. also they are great for taking down tough units. yeah they get nerfed a bit with 2 wounds but toughness 7, it won't be easy to wound them with bows. still a sound choice to have a couple. i run 3 in my 3k lists

Stoffen
25-08-2010, 13:25
My bad, with the "only 1 wound on bolt throwers", didnt realize it had gotten faq'ed.
Bolt throwers are indeed good, but I still say that seing as HE infantry is some of the most killy in warhammer, invest more points there than in shooting.