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ChaosPuppet
21-08-2010, 15:02
I'm playing in an non comp, 3k tournament shortly and I was wondering if I could get some changes or tactics advice for this list. The lists I will be up against are sure to be WAAC lists from hell so with that in mind bring on the fromage!

Bloodthirster @ 530
Immortal Fury, Armour of Khorne, Firestorm Blade, Collar of Khorne

Herald of Khorne @ 190
BSB with Great Icon of Sundering, Armour of Khorne

Skulltaker @ 150

Blue Scribes @ 81

Herald of Tzeentch @ 165
Spell Breaker, Master of Sorcery

Blood letters x 38 @ 511
Full Command, Icon of Endless War

Horrors x 39 @ 561
Changeling, Musician, Standard Bearer, Icon of Sorcery

Flesh Hounds x 10 @ 350

Seekers x 5 @ 175
Full Command, Siren Standard

Fiend x 1 @ 55

Fiend x 1 @ 55

Flamers x 5 @ 175

Total: 2998
530 (lords), 586(heroes), 1072 (core), 525(special), 285 (rare)

sergentzimm
22-08-2010, 05:35
more flamers if you have the models. I think the flesh hounds might be a bit much for the cost. One casualty and they cant break ranks. They might do better in two units of 5, or make room for more flamers!

thesheriff
22-08-2010, 10:11
What lore are you taking on the herald? Recommend life or shadow.

Obsidian armour instead of the collar and armour. It's still worth it for sure.

I would put skulltaker on a juggernaught. The extra movment lets him sneek into challenge position nice and early. Also with the 0+, 5++, Mr2 will kepp him ticking and compensate for his relativly low 2 wounds. All for 200pts. Bargain.

Drop the back rank of letters, and use the points to make scribes anouther herald of tzeentch (9 Blood letters + Scribes = 189) with spellbreaker. You only need 29 in the unit (+bsb) for the full 30 odd S5 attacks. and the extra wizard + scroll will help alot in the power and dispel phase.

Keep the flesh hounds as one unit, just make sure that one of the wizards takes life and keeps the hounds nice and health until they smack into the flank.

If you can, drop the seekers for more flamers. Seekers are'nt that good, and extra flamers wourld be alot better.

thesheriff

ChaosPuppet
22-08-2010, 19:18
Thanks for the advice, I think the idea was to take lore of life to try and keep my hounds at full strength and to buff the toughness of the bloodletters/horrors. I think a lot of what you said makes sense though.

I'm never sure about taking the obsidian armour over the much cheaper AoK - People almost expect you to have it and are reluctant to throw anything that stands any real chance of killing it away, not only that but I can nearly always choose what I'm fighting with the BT anyway... However I'll definately look at that - the CoK was the last thing I added to the list because I had the points left over.

I'd be worried dropping the extra bloodletters as i expect them to take a lot of casualties from shooting and I doubt my HoT will be able to keep them at full strength for long, I want them to be able to survive prolonged combat and keep the extra attacks but again it is definately worth seeing what the options give me.

I don't have Skulltaker on a juggernaut - though I could proxy a herald but the main thing that worries me about juggernaut heralds/skulltaker is warmachine shooting that ignores armour saves.

Sadly I only have 6 flamers at the moment, although I definately think I want more for future games - they are by far my favourite rare choice for obvious reasons. I think I will take a look at what I can do with dropping the seekers - I could at least run two units of 3 flamers and give myself a second fiend and rejig my hero choices.

thesheriff
22-08-2010, 20:02
Right, adressed in order of point made;

It comes in handy. When an assassin with Venom sword runs in and kills you BT with Armour of Khorne and spellbreaker, you will never leave home without your suit of god forged green gem armour.

Again, lore of life comes in well. Because loremaster does not effect spell count in a specific lore, 2 heralds with Life is very possible, and as your offensive magic lies in your horrors. Also, 2 dwellers is pretty offensive when you need it.

This will happen, but i find i would rather have my 200pt skulltaker die to a cannon than my 550pt Bloodthirster. And, with the lifebloom ability every time you cast a spell with the heralds, you can heal an odd wound on your charecters (and flesh hounds for that matter :D)

That sounds ideal. Confucious say, you need more flamers young grasshopper (said in a mocking, but not racist, chiniese accent :wtf:)

ChaosPuppet
24-08-2010, 23:30
Right, adressed in order of point made...

...That sounds ideal. Confucious say, you need more flamers young grasshopper (said in a mocking, but not racist, chiniese accent :wtf:)

Well I took your advice (in some ways) and played a herald on a juggernaut out on his own (Skulltaker was busy on foot elsewhere but I would definitely consider swapping him out next time, if it takes the heat from my Bloodthirster it can't be bad. I dropped the seekers completely as I thought the fiends would do anything they could but cost far less if they fell over.

I stuck with the Blue scribes though, I'll let you know how that goes on Saturday after the final two games are played...

In the end my list looked like:

BT @ 515
Firestorm Blade, AoK, Imortal Fury

HoK @ 165
Jugger, Aok

HoK @190
BSB, AoK, Standard of Sundering

Skulltaker @ 150

HoT @ 140
MOS

Blue Scribes @ 81

Bloodletters x 38 @511
FC, Icon of Endless War

Horrors x 39 @561
FC w Changeling, Icon of Sorcery

Fleshhounds x 10 @ 350

Fiend x 1 @ 55


Fiend x 1 @ 55

Flamers x 6 @225
Pyrocaster

Total 2998

I played against all khornite units and Tzeentch wizards WoC and in terms of how the match went, I had some horrible luck early on and some great luck towards the end.

First of all, my bloodletters didnt turn up until turn two, due to the scenario, so I had a HoK BSB and Skull-taker standing out in the breeze until their unit would arrive on turn 2. My first spell-casting turn, which wasn't boosted by the scribes, was a damp squib and on his turn a just in range gateway saw off my herald of khorne with the BSB (I forgot about his magic resistance bonus to his ward save so he may well may have survived, luckily Skulltaker remained unaffected by the same). My bloodthirster then chased a group of knights off the table, the ONLY time I ever rolled high enough to catch a fleeing unit... and so he was out of action next turn...

Miss-casting on my second attempt at throne of vines due to a Pandemonium spell and two threes (i had forgotten to dispell it using my overly plentiful PD - thanks to his great spellcasting the previous turn and my scribes) and then rolling low on the miscast table after he dispelled the thrones spell so no 2+ miscast avoidance, followed up by him using his magic item which adjusts my miscast result by D3! Meant my HoT went bye bye on turn two.

So no more life magic and no more free wounds back... I then lost my Herald on juggernaut and a fiend in a combined combat with the remains of a knights unit and some Warriors to some devastatingly bad rolls... I should have broken the knights the previous turn and I was failing easy charges left right and centre. I also couldn't catch any fleeing units to save my life and he would continually rally much to my annoyance!

Essentially everything was going wrong until my horde of bloodletters won a combat with some warriors (he assumed I would need to take on two units at once though there was plenty of room to avoid the other), they fled and I caught and killed the warriors and careered into the flank of his main horde wizard bunker a Flkank charge with my Bloodletter Horde and Skulltaker! I challenged his champion and managed the maximum overkill and some 18 wounds from the bloodletters and some more from my flamers in the opposite flank, meant he fled, fled through my flamers but out of their reach, then through my bloodthirster who was standing in front of a wall after a failed pursuit which I don't even want to talk about, and still i didn't catch them. He took a few more wounds from the dangerous terrain tests and ultimately it was a combined charge by some augmented +1S +1T flamers (thanks Scribes) and my Horrors and Changeling, which would see them chased off the table inevitably, neither of my units would have caught them either...

I won by a fair margin but only because he didn't kill the BT or either horde unit. which meant i had well over 1500 points safe and the only banner he had was from my BSB.

Glad I didn't have the seekers I'm not sure what they would have went up against. Still a very tough army in this edition and some tactical errors meant I won despite the dice.

The Bloodthirster's armour made little difference as he did nothing but destroy a unit of knights, run away and utterly failed to catch any runners.... sheesh. He is still very nasty though and I tend to keep him away from characters as I dislike being challenged!!!