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Methios
22-08-2010, 16:40
Hello all,

Im a new Warhammer Fantasy player.
And i am excited :)

Im aiming on building a army of 1000 points asap so i can get into action.
Ofcourse, like any new player i bet, im heaving a headace as to which army to collect.
So many nice ones! and GW pricing doesnt alowe me to collect 4/5 armies hehe.

Soo, what am i looking for.
- No empire, with all nice fantasy races i wouldnt want to play mere man.
- A good closecombat fase. (heavy hitters)
- This might sound silly, but i would like a army that is not played alot.
- Not a army that is considerd to be overpowerd. (lizardmen and skaven seem to have that flag if i read up here)

So far i have come up with:
- Beastmen
- Ogre's
- Wood Elves
- Vampire counts

And perhaps Darkelf and WoC: altho ALOT of folks seem to play those.

Any help would be nice.
And thanks for reading, as you folks prob get alot of these post around here :)

cheers

meth

bfeijter
22-08-2010, 17:10
I think VC is also played alot still, cause it was powerfull in 7th.
Dark Elves are indeed played alot where i live.
WoC is avaragely played i would say.
----------------------
Beastmen - nice models, not played alot, good CC (mino's ftw)
Trick is getting into CC b4 you die of missle fire. (not alot of armor)

Wood Elves - Great models, treeman and treekin are decent CC models. the elve units are crap in CC tho.
Its verry hard to win with wood elves until there new book comes out.

Ogres - No idea here.

Vampire Counts - No idea here, other then i think its quiet popular. perhaps cause they were powerfull in 7th, perhaps because of the fluff.

I think you should take up dwarfs in your "to consider" list if i read your points

antin3
22-08-2010, 17:18
Lizard men would be my first choice, but you don't want them. So non-human, close combat monsters...What about Orcs? They have the animosity thing but they are a fun army with many different unit types. Maybe High Elves, they can be monsters in clise combat depending upon what type of army you build and they are coming out in the new boxed set soon.

TheKingInYellow
22-08-2010, 17:29
Beastmen or Ogres both fit the bill. Ogres can get to 1k with very few models.

Duke_Corwin
22-08-2010, 17:39
The new box set soon to be released has high elves and skaven. If you go with high elves you can trade the skaven for additional elves.

This will help you to build up an army quickly. Also high elves are good in close combat. The box includes Sword Masters, one of the best close combat units in the game.

Just a thought.

Edahlo
22-08-2010, 18:05
I would personally suggest Lizardmen, Warrior's of Chaos or High/Dark Elves given your first two listed points. Looking at your two other points, that leaves High Elves and your two "maybe's". Would you like to play forces of order or forces of destruction? Judging by the majority of the armies you listed, you prefer forces of destruction. Which kind of leaves High Elves out, since they're pretty much the army that's furthest up the "good scale".

Do you like painting? We all like pretty models of course, but do you enjoy the process of painting lot's of models to a high standard? Forces of destruction are generally easier to paint well, due to the darker shades they usually have. And Chaos Warrior's are really expensive points-wise, so you won't need that many I think. Anyways, now I'm bordering onto stuff I'm less knowledgable about, seeing as I don't play this army.

Myself, I wouldn't let the choice of other people affect my own, in the sense that if I liked an army, I would definately pick it up, regardless of popularity.

Seeing as you listed WoC as a maybe, and that it's an army I find really cool, even though I don't collect it myself, I recommend Warriors of Chaos or Dark Elves.

Methios
22-08-2010, 19:19
thanks for the replies!

I dont care much about the forces of destruction, or order.
Altho i would find the lore of beastmen cooler if they werent "childs of chaos" but merly beast.
Cant blame a lion for killing a gazzele.
And invading their home and chopping it up to build houses surely invoke their angre. :)

Anyways, Beastmen would be my first choice. but im told they are not a compatetive army at this moment.

I like the painting part, im just not verry good at it :)

Does anyone have some input about the ogres and vampire counts?

@bfeijter dwarfs are fun, but their army looks kinda dull. you got wariors. wariors with +1 str and + 1 ws, wariors with 1 point armor more, and wariors with hammers. and thats about it :)

mrtn
22-08-2010, 21:07
Anyways, Beastmen would be my first choice. but im told they are not a compatetive army at this moment.

They are not overpowered cheese at the moment, which means that some people complain. It looks like the beastmen army plays a lot different in 8th edition compared to both 7th and 6th, which means that more people than usual complain about them, since they're stuck in an old mindset that doesn't work with the new armybook. Not that it's wrong to miss the old play style, but that's nothing you'd need to worry about as a new player. ;)

They are certainly playable, don't worry about that. :)

IMO they're a great army to paint and play with. If you're interested you can check out the Herdstone forum, see the link in my signature.

Cain-asmodeus
22-08-2010, 21:29
When it comes to ogres, with the new update with 8th edition, it makes ogres alot more lethal when it comes to cc. Not only is it easy to collect the entire army in a few models, but they are also easy to paint, and setup on the feild asap.

Large units of Ogre Bulls and Ironguts are the best tactic to utilize. When they charge they deliver a bone-shattering charge that few can oppose, and those unlucky enough to survive the impact must then fight against creatures with a Str and T4 and a minimum of 4A. Hard hitting and direct, the army army is great for steamrolling the enenemy line

Ogres dish out a lot of damage in combat. Ogres have to charge at least 6" in order to get a Bull Charge but when they do, they get Impact Hits, they should qualify for a Bull Charge nearly every time. Combine this with the Stomp special rule available to all monstrous infantry, which is a bit like an impact hit unto itself, and even your basic Ogre Bulls get five attacks each (two of which automatically hit) instead of three.

The vampire counts, the specialize more into cc that bog down enemy units and severely punish them next turn when they have units charging your flanks. They do have powerful abilities spellcasters which replenishes their army quite often, and dont get me wrong but they do have some nice cc for the vampire characters.

One of the things that best characterises the Vampire Counts army is the fact that it's very hard to make it stay dead. Every unit in the army can be replenished and many can even be increased in number beyond their starting size! You can even create brand-new units in the midst of battle, raising units of Zombies behind your foe. The dynamic of the army is one of relentless advance, in the face of overwhelming casualties and a ceaseless magical offensive. Because every model in the force is Immune to Psychology.

hope that helps into picking your army.

btw, the beastmen you mentioned earlier are great if you can manage to utilize the ability to ambush and their 'unique' set of units, If you love monsters then the beastmen army is for you. The Rare section of the army list is one of the most packed in Warhammer and is full of great monsters - everything from a giant to a cygor. Each creature has its own individual abilities. A cygor, for instance, is a mobile stone thrower and mage hunter, while the ghorgon is an even fiercer, larger type of minotaur. One thing these creatures do have in common is that they can all make Thunderstomp attacks at the end of a round of combat.

WarmbloodedLizard
22-08-2010, 21:37
i vote beastmen. they are pretty much a mid-field army. better than ogres or wood elves but slightly worse than VC.

bfeijter
22-08-2010, 22:32
Beastmen ineed are nice.
But there isnt much to "utilize"about the ambush rule.
It sux. hehe

Wariors of Chaos indeed are a good option too.

Goodluck desiding between the 2 :)

Woodsman
23-08-2010, 01:59
I'd avoide Vampire, at , locally we see a lot of vamps in play, possibly because they we're(may well still be) one of the harder armies aboot.Also you don't want to play men and vamps are essentially men, just not great conversationalists.

Beasts aren't that popular, but i'd say they got a boost in 8th their lores improved and they certainly have great variety of models and can lay down some serious cc hurt.

OK are similar to beasts in someways, although I see less variety between lists. If money and painting are real issues OK can make some very small forces and their battalion is good value. Check out the fantasy logs, there are a couple of truly great ok forces down there that will inspire the socks off you!

Helves have always been popular and with IoB I'd guess we'll see a few more of them.

macmusic22
23-08-2010, 09:52
My suggestion would be Ogres...2 battalion boxes and a few extras can put you over the 2000pt mark with ease...so 1. Fits the bill 2. Probably your cheapest option

Lord of Divine Slaughter
23-08-2010, 10:04
Beasts, Woodies, Ogres all fit the bill. Just choose the one with the models that you're itching the most to paint :)

Methios
23-08-2010, 11:54
Thanks for all the help.
I think i will go for Warriors of Chaos.
Had a chance to look into the books of both armies and everything beastmen can do WoC can do aswel. (and for the most part better i think?)

Or am i missing something important?
the primal fury bit is rerols of to hit on a succesful leadership test?

Plus the batteljan box from the beastmen is super dull heh and also seems less cost effective.

Ill surely miss the minotaurs/doombull tho :(

bfeijter
23-08-2010, 15:18
If i am correct (which i am often not) gives you hatred, and lets you re-roll to hit.
I think a bsb (Battle standard bearer) even lets you re-roll this failed leadership test
And if you role double 1, the subject gains hatred AND frenzy.

Also, minotaurs have bloodgreed. which means after winning combat they gain frenzy.
And for everything they win combat after that you gain +1 attack.

So those 2 rules gives an extra bit of punch to your beatsmen units.
A unit of chaos wariors/chosen with a halbert/gw and mark of khorne hurts aswell tho :) your choice.
And yes the battalion box from the beastmen is a downer heh.

BluePojo
23-08-2010, 15:32
I've been enjoying Wood Elves this edition. They play differently than last edition, but you'll not have that problem as you'll be new!

If you want to play in all phases of the game, Wood Elves are a good fit: Excellent mobility, Good Magic, Very Good Archers, Several hard hitting close combat units.

Also I like the models quite a lot. :)

Otherwise, Ogres seem to be a good fit as well, though their magic is wonky and I think I'd get tired of painting ugly fat man things. :eyebrows:

Crovax20
23-08-2010, 15:39
Thanks for all the help.
I think i will go for Warriors of Chaos.
Had a chance to look into the books of both armies and everything beastmen can do WoC can do aswel. (and for the most part better i think?)

Or am i missing something important?
the primal fury bit is rerols of to hit on a succesful leadership test?

Plus the batteljan box from the beastmen is super dull heh and also seems less cost effective.

Ill surely miss the minotaurs/doombull tho :(

Beastmen have acces to more ranged weaponry, in the form of shortbows and a stone throwing giant that likes eating wizards.

Beastmen have the ambush special rule which helps against shooty armies, as you can hopefully shut down their shooting fast.

mrtn
23-08-2010, 20:19
Thanks for all the help.
I think i will go for Warriors of Chaos.
Had a chance to look into the books of both armies and everything beastmen can do WoC can do aswel. (and for the most part better i think?)

Or am i missing something important?
the primal fury bit is rerols of to hit on a succesful leadership test?

Plus the batteljan box from the beastmen is super dull heh and also seems less cost effective.

Ill surely miss the minotaurs/doombull tho :(
Yes, you're missing something important. Re-rollable Primal Fury on Ld9 (with BSB and Beastlord in range) means that you have a 97% chance of having Hatred (including a small chance for Frenzy as well). Hatred is great for beastmen. If you boost your troops with the +1S banner and/or the signature Beast Lore spell even your lowly Ungors can be scary with rerollable S4 attacks.
WoC can't do any of that. :)

The battalion might seem dull but it's great if you want a infantry army. Two battalions and you're halfway to a 8th edition army. Sure, I'd like it to be cheaper, but it's definitely a good buy now, much better than in the few months in 7th.

decker_cky
23-08-2010, 20:29
I'd also argue that beastmen have access to better lores on their hero level wizards. WoC sorcerors have fire (meh) or death (great lore) if unmarked or their mark lore if they take a mark (I rank these lower than the basic lores).

Beastmen have beasts (amazing basic spell, decent otherwise), shadow (great lore), death (slightly worse than WoC at Ld7) and wild (trash).

Beastmen also are faster across the board. That 1 MV might not seem to make much of a difference, but it can still be very handy.

Being forced to challenge is actually a weakness for WoC, and is much worse than the benefit of rolling on the table when you win said challenge.

Warriors have lots more points in the battalion for sure, and they're good units, but the beastmen battalion is also all very useful stuff.

As a purely subjective thing....I find beastmen a lot more fun to play and play against.