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SiNNiX
30-08-2010, 20:06
So as some of you know, I'm reconstructing my 3k Dwarf list to try and get away from gunline a little bit. The dilemma I'm facing right now is whether to field a second unit of Longbeards or a unit of Ironbreakers. I haven't experienced Ironbreakers in 8th yet, but I would imagine their functionality is a little nerfed in 8th.

What do you guys think? Have you messed around with Ironbreakers yet in 8th? I used them in 7th to very great effect, but how do you think their worth shifted going from 2+ AS in 7th to 3+ AS / 6+ ward in 8th? I would imagine taking a second unit of Longbeards would be better.

Malorian
30-08-2010, 20:10
I don't think either is good.

Due to the reduced risk of panic checks (bsb reroll) that part of the longbeard's points is a waste, and ironbreakers still suffer from the fact that their save is one one better than the cheap warriors.

Personally I think warriors with great weapons are your best buy, warriors with shields if you want staying power, and hammerers if you want elite (stubborn trumps +1 AS in my books).

SiNNiX
30-08-2010, 20:23
Personally I think warriors with great weapons are your best buy

But isn't that what every Dwarf player does now? I want to try and stay away from the Dwarf list that you always come across. However, wins are still important to me, so maybe I'll go with that. Oh, decisions decisions.

Thanks for the input. Hammerers are looking very nice. I've been using Warriors with hand weapon and shield and it's been working pretty well for me so far in 8th.

amysrevenge
30-08-2010, 20:34
My recent list had Hammerers, GW Longbeards, and HW/S Warriors as the three core blocks. I chose Longbeards over more Warriors almost purely for the +1WS, and in this particular setting it worked out. It was an all-comers list, and I ended up playing WoC so the WS5 helped.

In a bigger game, I'd consider upgrading my anvil HW/S Warriors unit to Ironbreakers rather than adding another unit. Well, I would if I had the models anyway - I only have 21 Ironbreakers. :P The extra WS, S, AS, and the opportunity for a runic standard all make it probably worth the points.

Malorian
30-08-2010, 20:54
But isn't that what every Dwarf player does now? I want to try and stay away from the Dwarf list that you always come across. However, wins are still important to me, so maybe I'll go with that. Oh, decisions decisions.

Thanks for the input. Hammerers are looking very nice. I've been using Warriors with hand weapon and shield and it's been working pretty well for me so far in 8th.

If you want something different (and elite) I would go to hammerers first, longbeards with great weapons second, slayers third, and then ironbreakers at fourth.

The name of the game for 8th ed dwarfs is great weapons.

You might also want to look into quarrellers with great weapons, or even rangers.

Deon
30-08-2010, 21:09
You might also want to look into quarrellers with great weapons, or even rangers.

And also miners can be helpfull at times

knightime98
30-08-2010, 22:13
To me the Iron Breakers just don't stand out any more. Despite the runic standard, WS5, and 1 better armor save - I think they lack in the ability to dish out the damage. Only S4 and without any buffs that many armies enjoy with spells/augments/Engine of the Gods/Eye of the Gods/ War Altar/ War Shrine/ Cauldron of Blood, it makes it hard for them to be effective. Not only that, but ironically, they get targeted even more by magic and missle fire because they are a small unit (20 ish or so). Remember that in this edition you have to kill all models of a unit. Which makes the Iron Breakers a real target.

Sure the Dwarves have the Anvil but in my opinion it doesn't do nearly enough and cost way too many points for what it doesn't do. Pit of Shades/Purple Sun of Xerxus will take the Anvil and the Rune Lord with it! So, until a new dwarf book comes out the Dwarves are just meh.. in power level. Don't get me wrong, they are still the stubborn gunline force but getting wins is just not all that easy.

SiNNiX
30-08-2010, 22:22
I'm leaning towards nothing but Hammerers and GW Warriors. I didn't want to do this as I like to stick to why I love Dwarfs so much; one of the things that got me into Dwarfs, and thus Warhammer, was the armour aspect. The thought of an entire army crashing into a solid wall of Dwarven shield and axe was way too fluffy to resist!

Also Malorian, I've been debating whether nor not to field a unit of Ranger Longbeards with throwing axes. I love S5 throwing axes!

ooglatjama
30-08-2010, 22:31
I've been debating whether nor not to field a unit of Ranger Longbeards with throwing axes. I love S5 throwing axes!

They almost always hit on 6s though. :(

theunwantedbeing
30-08-2010, 22:32
If you like armour, take armour.
No point taking an army you don't want to take simply as you got peer pressured into using "optimal" lists rather than whatever it was you thought looked cool.

They almost always hit on 6s though. :(
Only when standing and shooting, they can hit a target upto 9" away from their starting position on a 5+
Pretty handy really, especially as ranger's scout.
Definitely a unit worth taking.

Cost effective, maybe not but damned cool and that's what matters.

dogofwar6565
31-08-2010, 03:08
I have played a couple games against my friends high elves and took a 20 man unit with FC and the 5+ ward save against shooting banner each time and each time they did pretty good, wiped out a unit of spearmen and archers each game and his wizard once. They aren't the best unit but I don't see why they would be considered horrible. But thats just my opinion, I have always liked them.

russellmoo
31-08-2010, 03:19
I've thought about using Ironbreaker as well but only because with a runic standard I could then throw in another rune of slowness, to give my guns additional time to do damage.

This is how I would field them- 29 Ironbreakers, R of battle, R of determination, BSB,R of battle

This gives you a base 7 CR. So you can most likely win the first round of combat, then if you eventually get whittled down you have the R of determination to help keep you there. Still it is way too many points but they might be effective this way.

sulla
31-08-2010, 04:24
But isn't that what every Dwarf player does now? I want to try and stay away from the Dwarf list that you always come across. However, wins are still important to me, so maybe I'll go with that. Oh, decisions decisions.

Thanks for the input. Hammerers are looking very nice. I've been using Warriors with hand weapon and shield and it's been working pretty well for me so far in 8th.Don't forget rangers for your elite choice either (even though they are core). Having one or two units lurking on the flanks can put a real crimp in your opponent's gameplan.