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alcarothar
06-09-2010, 04:27
Thatīs the question.
Anybody heard about something like that?
Itīs possible?

Son of Sanguinius
06-09-2010, 04:41
For an overwhelming majority of Chapters, no, it is not possible. And no, I've never heard of anything like that. That said, an extremely liberal chapter or officer could feasibly offer the chance for redemption for a brother who has not fallen too far.

Polaria
06-09-2010, 05:06
That said, an extremely liberal chapter or officer could feasibly offer the chance for redemption for a brother who has not fallen too far.

Although he would risk the unfounded attentions of The Big I when doing so... and no matter how awesome marines may be even they don't trample on Inquisitors toes without extremely good reason.

N0-1_H3r3
06-09-2010, 05:24
Thatīs the question.
Anybody heard about something like that?
Itīs possible?
Reportedly, the new background in the Deathwatch rulebook contains mentions of "Black Shields" - Deathwatch marines whose Chapter heraldry is covered over, each of whom has a different reason for no longer associating themselves with their Chapter - some may be the last survivors of otherwise-dead Chapters, while others may be marines from Chapters that have turned traitor.

I can't go into any more detail, as I've not yet got the book, but it sounds quite intriguing.

AlexHolker
06-09-2010, 05:41
There's a short story where an ex-Ultramarine CSM recanted and died aiding the Imperium. But as far as actually rejoining the loyalists rather than going out in a blaze of glory? I would say never.

feno12
06-09-2010, 05:42
If a chapter 'did' take a marine back (which I find highly unlikely more so with the inquisitors) they would likely use the person for information and suicide missions. They couldn't be trusted with information as what is to say they are not a spy, they would have to be guarded at all hours to prevents sabotage, and heaven forbid they be allowed access to weaponry while within the chapters stronghold, ultimately there is far too much risk with bringing back a marine who had been a traitor once before to the chapter. Remember Space Marines are genetically designed killing machines, you wouldn't let a lion loose in the middle of a pack of deer, it'd be a slaughter. Likewise is a gun from behind.

Son of Sanguinius
06-09-2010, 05:50
Although he would risk the unfounded attentions of The Big I when doing so... and no matter how awesome marines may be even they don't trample on Inquisitors toes without extremely good reason.

The membership in such a chapter would without a doubt be kept a closely guarded secret. I see your point, but at the same time, a Chapter that made regular practice of trying to give traitor Marines redemption through anything other than death would certainly knowingly keep its practices private.

Come to think of it, your point works the other way too. The background seems to imply that Inquisitors need a lot of evidence to go after a Space Marine Chapter. Their military allies would be reluctant to commit the amount of forces required to take on a Chapter without damn good reason.

FarseerMatt
06-09-2010, 07:21
Imperial policy is pretty clear on the subject:

A Heretic may see the truth and seek redemption. He may be forgiven his past and will be absolved in death. A Traitor can never be forgiven. A Traitor will never find peace in this world or the next. There is nothing as wretched or as hated in all the world as a Traitor.

Polaria
06-09-2010, 09:36
Come to think of it, your point works the other way too. The background seems to imply that Inquisitors need a lot of evidence to go after a Space Marine Chapter. Their military allies would be reluctant to commit the amount of forces required to take on a Chapter without damn good reason.

Anyone in his right mind would be reluctant to take on Chapter. Good reason or not. Thats why Chapters with highly suspicious practices have survived so long. So yeah, you technically a Chapter could go huggybear with traitors and choose to ignore the usual Imperial Policy of "no mercy, no hesitation". They could conceivably do so even for quite a long time before the evidence massed against them was enough to grant the Inquisition with enough military power to actually make the open move.

However, that day would come sooner or later and I am sure the Chapter masters themselves would know that you can fool all of the people some of the time or some of the people all of the time but not all of the people all of the time. I fail to see why a Chapter would take the risk of practically writing a blank check to accuse them of turning traitor by associating with fallen in any way... What would the Chapter gain from such association that was even remotely worth the risks involved?

Memnos
06-09-2010, 10:23
I think we're discussing two entirely separate things:

1) Can a traitor return? Yes. Absolutely - The Badab War is proof of that. After seceding from the Imperium, several chapters were granted a centuries long crusade of penance.

2) Can a Chaos Space Marine return from Chaos? This is a much trickier proposition. What you're really asking is, "Can someone, once they've been embraced by the Chaos Powers, be cleansed and returned to active duty with their Chapter?" - The Chaos powers twist the mind as well as the body. Once someone is a full Chaos Space Marine, they have the Mark of Chaos Undivided or even a patron. If you're a renegade marine, you can be forgiven. If you're a Chaos Marine, you have actively sold your soul. I would suggest that Chaos Space marines cannot return to active duty. Traitors can.

Arkondak
06-09-2010, 12:26
If a marine sold himself to chaos and later truly repented, the thought of his treason against his Emperor and Primarch, and all the evil he had done in service to the dark gods would probably make him not to keen on living anymore, and he would be most likely to off himself in a way that would take as many of his chaos buddies with him as possible. Like that story AlexHolker mentioned. I think the guy put a bunch of high explosive in his chest cavity and suicide bombed a Demon Prince.

There is a precident in a manner of speaking for chaos traitors going back to the imperium. The Dark Angels accept former chaos marines back with full forgiveness, so long as they repent. They then mark them off of the big book of traitors and give them a bolt round to the head in lieu of months of agonizing torture. That's probably as close as marines would get to rejoining the ranks. That is about as forgiving as loyalists get for chaos marines.

Turning against the big 4 probably either leads you to being dead by your own hand or in the service of Malal(sp?)

Balgora
06-09-2010, 13:53
Aye that's probably the better question..do you survive long enough after turning your back on your new chaos masters to ask anybody for forgiveness..or do you get dragged up before your former god and made an example of for a few thousand years until they get bored..

Jonman
06-09-2010, 15:27
The closet that happend to that was in issue 6 of inferno when a nurgle sorceror is turned back to the emperor by a Sister he once knew. He then suicide bombs a Daemon prince lord with an exterminatus bomb.

Formosa
06-09-2010, 16:40
here are the examples of the Chaos marines returning from the dark side (that i know of)

A red corsair went to the Ultramarines and wanted to repent, they did not trust him, so they asked him to kill lufgt huron, they also sent an Ultramarine to aid or kill him if he lied, huron killed the smurf outright when they got to his ship, the Corsair tried to get huron but was stopped by his sorceror (the corsair was also a sorceror) Huron then stated " now you die last of the astral claws" he was the nput into a dreads sarcophagus, withnot intention of putting him into a dread.

in Deamon world, a marine starts an elaborate sceme(sp?) to gain control of his sould back from the chaos gods, and suceeds dieing in the process.

this is all the references i know of

tezdal
06-09-2010, 18:07
Blood Ravens?

FabricatorGeneralMike
06-09-2010, 18:28
here are the examples of the Chaos marines returning from the dark side (that i know of)

A red corsair went to the Ultramarines and wanted to repent, they did not trust him, so they asked him to kill lufgt huron, they also sent an Ultramarine to aid or kill him if he lied, huron killed the smurf outright when they got to his ship, the Corsair tried to get huron but was stopped by his sorceror (the corsair was also a sorceror) Huron then stated " now you die last of the astral claws" he was the nput into a dreads sarcophagus, withnot intention of putting him into a dread.

in Deamon world, a marine starts an elaborate sceme(sp?) to gain control of his sould back from the chaos gods, and suceeds dieing in the process.

this is all the references i know of

No that was a White Scar in the first story. It's a great read btw.

The UM who came back was Caseus (SP) him and Sister Aeron ( the SoB leader in the second Soul Drinker books) was the sister who tried to hunt him down until she was warned off by her cannoness.

That was a great redemption story btw, I highly recomend it if you can get your hands on 'Let the Galaxy burn' (great book btw).

If you have gone renegade I think your hosed except in very special sercumstances. Most chapters would look at your like a oath breaker and there for 'shoot on sight'.

Can some marines rejoin the fold? Of course they can, after all we do need good stories of redemption to read eh ;)

Scalebug
06-09-2010, 19:01
Blood Ravens?

When did Blood Ravens fall to Chaos? :confused:

alcarothar
06-09-2010, 19:06
What about an Alpha Legion marine?

Cuchulain84
06-09-2010, 19:27
It happened in an Inferno short story.

Lord Malorne
06-09-2010, 19:35
None that I know of, its possible for a renegade marine to rejoin the imperium, but a chaos marine? Don't see it happening, even with evidence :angel:

spetswalshe
06-09-2010, 19:45
The White Scar/Red Corsair story is the closet I've read - but he is never actually trusted, and rejoining the ranks isn't an option; he just gets to try and assassinate Huron and go out in a blaze of glory. Of course, him being a sorcerer means he's a double-heretic and probably couldn't redeem himself in the eyes of that heartless False Emperor no matter how hard he tried.

If the OP is actually wanting to strongarm this into a story, his best bet is with the less codex chapters like the Space Wolves. After all, they call millenia-old Eye-dwelling Space Marines wracked with mutations due to warp proximity '13th Company' instead of CSM.

AndrewGPaul
06-09-2010, 19:56
Blood Ravens?


When did Blood Ravens fall to Chaos? :confused:


It happened in an Inferno short story.

Er,, not quite. The Blood Ravens' homeworld was taken over by a Chaos cult (led by Captain Gabriel's father, I believe). None of the Ravens turned to Chaos themselves, except for the Librarian in the first game, and he wasn't forgiven.

tezdal
06-09-2010, 20:45
The Blood Ravens are Thousands Sons to begin with...............

MrSatan
06-09-2010, 21:27
The Blood Ravens are Thousands Sons to begin with...............

Never been stated as true, just VERY heavily hinted

Lord Malorne
07-09-2010, 00:00
(led by Captain Gabriel's father, I believe).

Oh no, you are kidding? What terrible writting :cries:

Skawolf
07-09-2010, 01:32
Never been stated as true, just VERY heavily hinted

Where would one find this hint?

Joustarr
07-09-2010, 01:42
I don't think a chaos marine can return to the loyal fold. Their souls belong to the chaos gods there is no turning back. There all fanatical unto death, some have practiced their religion for ten thousand years. Take Khan and the World Eaters. Remorse, salvation, humanity? Ha - they love bloodshed too much. They are enhanced to be so. Even on the other extreem it wouldn't work. For example; a repentant fallen Dark Angel would die for his sins in a dungeon on the rock.

tezdal
07-09-2010, 02:50
Never been stated as true, just VERY heavily hinted

Facts are the enemy of Grimdark!

Lord Damocles
07-09-2010, 08:12
Where would one find this hint?
The Search function would be a good place to start...

Sir_Turalyon
08-09-2010, 12:28
Some Fallen Angels tried or at least wanted to, with predictable results.

Less orthodox chapters may offer redemption in death - as in opportunity to redeem soul by dying in suicide mission. Redemption combined with staying alive and returning to chapter - I don't believe so.

MagosHereticus
08-09-2010, 16:17
the dark angels have been trying, but no amount of torture ever seems to be enough

TheOverlord
08-09-2010, 18:32
Actually, the Blood Raven's Chapter Master and the first company turned to Chaos in the newest game Chaos Rising, as does your commander if you put too many points into Chaos. I think according to the ending only 3 companies of Blood Ravens are still loyal to the Emperor, more or less.

Sir_Turalyon
08-09-2010, 20:28
the dark angels have been trying, but no amount of torture ever seems to be enough

No, they try to capture and torture even those willing to repent, just in the case. They are not interested in reabsorbing them back into ranks anyway, just to make sure they repent before they are killed.

Col. Tartleton
08-09-2010, 21:00
Actually, the Blood Raven's Chapter Master and the first company turned to Chaos in the newest game Chaos Rising, as does your commander if you put too many points into Chaos. I think according to the ending only 3 companies of Blood Ravens are still loyal to the Emperor, more or less.

Which in my opinion was the best thing that could happen seeing as they were basically a mildly better version of the Soul Drinkers. It should have been obvious they were on a path to turn traitor before the end in the first game. Did no one else make that connection that that was in fact the point of the story arc?

hateful
09-09-2010, 12:27
The gray knight story hammer of deamons the main character goes over to khorn for a while he loses his mind but then brings down the planet tells the inquisitor who say that he would be taken back if he put in a good word but then says the in the inquisition could use him also

Archaon
09-09-2010, 13:26
Not quite correct.. Alaric loses himself in battle and relishes it for a while but at no point during it he begins to worship Chaos.

He just embodies all that Khorne stands for and the chaos cultists errect a statue of Alaric as a mighty warrior of Khorne because they were so impressed by his skill and rage.

Kind of an awesome scene.. a Grey Knight having a Khorne fanclub :D

massey
09-09-2010, 16:43
It really just depends on how well the story is written. Normally such a thing is not allowed. If I sat around and thought about it for half an hour I could probably come up with a way to do it, though.

Generally, it will be easier if the guy isn't all mutated and crazy. There's a difference between Bob the Chaos Marine, who runs around in scary spikey armor and gets to use 2 close combat weapons, and Bob the Plague Marine, who has his intestines falling out of his face. It will be harder for the Plague Marine to come back. At that point, he's sort of living solely on Nurgle's power. Turn away, you fall over dead. Just a regular run-of-the-mill marine, however, he might be able to do it.

I think a non-traditional method of joining up would be best. You probably don't want to walk up to your old chapter and say "Remember me? I decided to be a good guy now. We cool?" It's probably a better idea to get yourself a non-evil looking suit of armor, find some other chapter, and claim to be the survivor of some lost company. "Hey, I'm the last of the Silver Stars Chapter, we got blown up fighting the Tyranids and I've just sort of been hanging out here on this planet for the past 10 years. Mind if I join up?" You'll have to pass all sorts of tests, including a psychic reading. But there are probably ways to fake that, so if you know what you're doing, you might be okay.

Then again, if you've got a lot of guys with you, so like your entire company is going to become loyal again, maybe the best idea is to just repaint your armor and pretend it never happened. "Here we are, the, umm, Giant... Hands Chapter ("Aww, dude, that name sucks..." "Shut up, stupid! You're gonna get us caught!"). Yes, that's us. The Giant Hands. And we're back. To serve the Emperor." Change your name, lay low for a hundred years or so, then go back and attack some orks in some out of the way place. Smile, kiss babies, all the normal stuff. Submit your geneseed to the Adeptus Terra, and then angrily demand to know who is responsible for the fact that they've never heard of you. "YOU LOST OUR GENESEED???" Act indignant, and then play it cool.

It could work.

Lord Zarkov
11-09-2010, 19:47
^^Thinking about it, this could very well be what the Blood Ravens actually did