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Krom The Eternal
02-10-2010, 01:45
Ok, So I am finally starting my Warmaster Chaos Army 1500pts. I'm wondering where to start I've been reading the rules and Im thinking I want to go khorne. Something like 2x units of warriors as a base then some marauders maybe 1x unit of knights or chariots 2 or 3 heros some ogres or dragon ogres what do you guys think would be a good 1500pt starting khorne force?

Cpt. Drill
02-10-2010, 05:39
Ahh Chaos are an excillent choice in warmaster, they are both cheap and provide limitless conversion oppertunities. I am always happy to try and help or encourage more warmaster players, with this humble guide I hope to do both! This is part of a guide I wrote before on Chaos adapted slighting for the points value.


I have played Chaos for many years in Warmaster with dozens of army combination and found a few that really fit my play style and what I want out of the army.

For 1500pts here is a run down of what I would take and why.

As buying your units with how they will be brigaded in mind I will present them in groups rather than a list of quantities of units.



Brigade 1 Your anvil

Chaos Warriors x2
Maruaders x 2

Points 420

This is one of my favourite possible brigades in Warmaster, its simple and proves burtally effective time and time again. Outside of occasional horrible dice rolls (This cant be avoided) the brigade never fails to excel in battle. If you deoploy with the warriors at the front and the weaker marauders in support you have a very powerful brigade.

^^^^^^^ (Direction of facing)
WWWWWW
MMMMMM

W=Warriors
M=Marauders

THis brigade is great at destroying enemy infantry. It can withstand almost any frontal assault and I usually will risk it in situations where it will be charged. The hardy chaos warriors at the front with take a huge amount of damage and the cheaper marauders behind will add a great stock of support to help win combats.

Cavelry in great numbers can risk a frontal assault and win so it is worth being aware of the danger. This being said anything fighting your formation will not come out of it untouched. Just watch your flanks your not nearly as tough there.

An additional point which I often overlook. Marauders get out shone by chaos warriors in every respect they are weaker not as tough and dont have as good a save. This being said they are still above average infantry and in a pinch should be called upon to charge if their Chaos warrior bodygaurds die.

just a side note but if you are planning a Khorne army you could use the Blood Letter models instead of marauder models for a really nice stand in. I play an undivided army and use one of each of the demon types as marauders and they look awesome!




Brigade 2 The Hammer

chariots x2
Knights x1

Points 490

Like in the last edition of Warhammer Knights were where the money is. THe same can be said for warmaster and heroic charges of your cavelry will often be the decider of games.

Deploy
CCCKKKCCC

C=Chariots
K=Knights

Generally in warmaster you should assume you will be fighting 2-4 units of knights per 1000pts if your playing an experienced foe. This formation is designed to take out enemy units of knights. If you get the charge you will be able to put down enough attacks that you can overwhelm lesser knights. Although this formation is weak to being charged by knight brigades and a crucial failed charge can lead to a swift defeat.

If your foe doesnt have many knights then you should split your Chaos Knights away from the brigade and release them on the hunt. A lone unit can far more easily make flank charges and the can even risk charging lone infantry in the front safe in the knowledge they can call off the attack if things start turning sour.

If you have split your brigade then send the chariots after light cav that may harrass your infantry, use them as a spear head and charge a big infantry brigade to try and break them up (Chariots will die if in sustained combat).




Brigade 3 The Dogs

Chaos hounds x2

Points 60

Okay Chaos hound suck... Despite this they have their uses. Generally I use them to skulk around the back of my lines and use them to pick off injured units to try and break my foe and use them to secure a flank to my Anvil.

A wise enemy will try and kill your hounds early to break your army and you cant let this happen. Sometimes you may never find a good oppertunity to send them into a fight or be to close to your break point to risk losing them. If this happens alot or you are not enjoying the hounds ditch them from your force. Maybe get some marauders for Brigade 4.




Brigade 4 The Support

Ogres x 2

Points 210

This is a small brigade that you will use in close proximy to your anvil. Use it to protect the flanks and in turn harrass the flanks of others. It is strong enough to send it into combat with success and resiliant enough that it can take charges. They are a great back up force to fill gaps if your chaos warriors start to fall.

Or

Dragon Ogres

Points 250

Think of these guys like a cruise missile. Point it at the centre of your opponenets army or at an expensive unit. Keep in it support range of your anvil as it can suffer if attacked alone or on the flank. These guys dish out so much damage virtually nothing in the game can stand before them. At 250pts for the unit they had better be good! They are alot of fun to use and your opponent will always be terrified of them.



The reason i include both of these choices is because although I concider the ogres a better choice, Dragon ogres are alot of fun to use. Despite being a bit hit or miss and a little fragile at times they are killing machines and watching them smash through unit after unit is very appealing. I leave this choice to you.




Brigade 5 Umm... Harpies

Harpies x1

Points 65

Flyers are awesome in Warmaster! they have a horde of uses which really makes them very practical. Either trying to suicide into enemy warmachines that can ignore your expensive armour saves. Flying near or behind the enemy to confer a leadership penalty, this works especially well against cavelry whose movement if restricted can ruin your opponents plans. Extreme flank attacks can be achieve from unforseen places, due to their 100cm move positioning them on an extreme flank allows them to charge unsuspecting units in the flank. Because they are flyers and few enemies can persue them they can be used as a screen to defend your Cavelry from being charged. By positioning them a just under 20cm infront of your knights if the enemy charge them they will not be able to persue, in your following turn you should flee with the harpies and charge with your knights.





Characters

General

With the highest leadership in the army you will want your general making your most important orders. In this case your general should always be stationed with the cavelry. He can happily run off up a flank and leave the infantry to his subordinates. Be careful to avoide combats but if he is going to survive in any unit it will be the chaos knights.

Sorcerer

I really rate the sorcerer but many find that with only points for a second character they would prefer the command range of a hero (20cm for a sorcerer and 60 for a hero). I reason that if you are leaving your lesser character in charge of the infantry who only need to get off an order or two a turn to happily advance down the field, you do not need the added range.

He has the benefit of some awesome spells The main one you should eternally spam is 'Anger of the Gods' It can be worth risking him ahead of your army in the early turns to give his -1 command penalty in the opening turns. Epecially going near enemy cavelry to slow their progress. If this is the plan make sure you always have him within 30 of a friendly unit so he can flee to them. Doing this tactic limits your opponents moves but it also limits yours, your general will have to order the whole army as the sorcerer will be long out of range. Combinign anger of the gods with the command penatly from harpies being near can cripple parts of your opponents army and force his characters to fail orders.

The next spell you should use is death frenzy. It is risky but if you get it off you can turn a unit of hounds into brutal kamakzis. Best combined with the Ring of magic.




Now that army should come to 1500pts. If you take the Ogres instead of the Dragon ogres it frees up some points for you. I would definatly spend these on the Ring of Magic for your mage. Use it a crucial time to cast death frenzy on a unit that has to win a combat. Otherwise putting the odd magic sword here or there can be good or the dispel scroll to stop people using the command spell. I hope this helps and I havent posted an essey when you were after some notes.

fracas
02-10-2010, 18:17
That was a great overview

wellspring
03-10-2010, 15:35
Very good army advice!


Let me add something-- Chaos is a good starting army because it's fairly straightforward to play and since the units are so expensive in points, the army's cheap in terms of cash cost. You'll also see mortal chaos warmaster armies going up on ebay and other trading sites all the time at very reasonable prices. (Tomb Kings and High Elves are the other two armies you see a lot. )

Warmaster is fairly forgiving of army composition, so if you buy a bunch of blister packs and don't get precisely the units you want, don't feel like the army is unplayable.

I've noticed that most of the Warmaster fanatics tend to collect 3000 points so that they can field a couple variations of 2000 point armies. 2000 makes for a very nice, interesting battle. 1000 points tends to be a bit simplistic (you only have the troops for one big, decisive engagement).

Krom The Eternal
13-10-2010, 05:51
Ok well I bought some stuff and i was wondering what you guys think a good build would be for this stuff heres what i got
2x Units of warriors
2x Units of marauders
2x Units of knights
1x Unit of warhounds
1x Unit of harpys
1x Unit of Ogres
and a characters pack

what do you guys think would be a good list i could make with this or what i should buy to make a better list I deffinatly want some dragon ogres and chariots but that will come later i just need to make a good starting 1k army to learn the game!

Lord_Goober
13-10-2010, 06:36
First off, fill your minimums. I'm checking the army list pdf right now.

So your absolute minimums are going to be this.
So your base is 335 points.

General: 125 points

Chaos Warriors x 1: 150 points
Chaos Marauders x 1: 60 points

Now in a 1000 point army I would definitely NOT go with any Knights or Dragon Ogres because they just take up WAY too many points.
I would go for higher numbers of regiments over heavily armored ones at the low levels since warmaster is more about manuevering vs specialty stuff.

Here is what I would probably do for a straight 1000 point list

General: 125 points
Hero: 80 points
Chaos Warriors x 1: 150 points
Foot Marauders x 3: 180 points
Marauder Horsemen x 3: 270 points
Chaos Hounds x 2: 60 points
Trolls x 1: 110 points

That's 975 points there with 10 regiments which gives you a break point of 5 which is alright for a 1000 point game. While you could go with a Sorceror instead of a hero, I don't think magic is as hugely necessary as it is in WFB. I should say, CHAOS magic isn't as necessary. For Orcs and Goblins, getting as many shamans in as possible is huge because of Gerrofff!!!. That spell is HUGE for o+g as it disrupts enemy lines.

What I would do to expand this to 2000 points.

Sorceror: 90 points
Chaos Warriors x 1: 150 points
Foot Marauders x 1: 60 points
Trolls x 1: 110 points
Chariots x 2: 190 points
Chaos Knights x 1: 200 points
Chaos Hounds x 2: 60
Chaos Furies x 2: 130

Then a magic item or two to taste.

As you can see in the second 1000 points is where you start expanding into the more interesting unit types like the knights, chariots and furies. Once again I have added 10 regiments to the army.

As was posted, most people build 3000 point armies. My local group actually plays 3-4000 point games as standard. I've got 4000 points painted of Dwarves and Tomb Kings myself and about 3000 painted of High Elves. My 4000 point army of Chaos Mortals is unpainted right now and is EVENTUALLY going to be sold to a friend of mine.

Cpt. Drill
14-10-2010, 00:12
Okay from what you have I think I would probably field...

General
Sorcerer
2x Warriors
2x Marauders (Brigade of death)
1x Knights
1x Ogres
1x Harpies

Its not ideal I would prefer two units of chariots rather than the knights. If you face the Empire army with 4 units of knights you will get messed up.

Possibly you could run...

General
2x Warriors
2x Marauders (Brigade of death)
2x Knights
1x Harpies

This army will hit hard! Two units of Chaos Knights will be hard for most 1k armies to deal with. Your infantry formation will be able to look after itself and take most charges. Harpies will be there purely to take out artillary and hinder enemy cav. Your two units of knights will have to be used a little more sneaky than you normally would as they cant afford to take many hits.

With one average general leading your army you are going to be prone to bad luck and will probably lose games when you knights fail to charge someone.

Krom The Eternal
14-10-2010, 05:44
So I'm thinking I need to buy the following
2x Units of chariots
2x Units of marauder horsemen
1x unit of hounds
1x unit of harpys
and maybe
1x unit of trolls
1x unit of marauders

and that should pretty much set me up for bigger games I'm definitely wanting some chariots as I'm going with a khorne theme for my army

any other tips or advice you guys could give me?

Cpt. Drill
14-10-2010, 12:10
I would definatly pick up some chariots they are great in the game especially seeing as you dont have cheap heavy cav. the only reason I only ever bought two units for my army are warmaster chariots are a nightmare to build as they come in 8 pieces!

Marauder horsemen are cool but I find that I prefer chariots to them and if I had to choose between them it would be chariots all the way.

Take hounds in brigades of two units or not at all. Extra hounds are worth while.

Up to 2000pts I would say one unit of harpies are fine. Although more flyers are never bad and you will always find a use for them.


I would strongly advise against the trolls for chaos. Generally you need your army to be a mobile one due to lack of shooting, most opponenets will exploit this and force you to come to them in the hope your army will get split up in the mass of orders you will have to make. Although trolls can be killers the ony time I would take them would be in an Orc and Goblin list to protect warmachines that are likely to linger nearer your table edge. In the chaos force they will leech orders from more important units and slow down your army.