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Ahra Returns
02-11-2010, 14:13
Hi Everyone,

I'm a little confused about step-up in combat (mainly because myself and my opponent disagree on how it works).

Say, for example (as this happened in the game); 20 Goblins with Spears and Shields charge a unit of 15 Phoenix Guard.

The Phoenix Guard attack first (10 attacks in total thanks to supporting attacks) and kill 6 Goblins - how many attacks back do the Goblins have?

Casualties are removed from the front (If I remember correctly - though they are removed from the back to make everything easier from a game play perspective), so - at this point - the Goblins had 5 models in base to base contact and 5 models in the second rank eligible provide supporting attacks; which means a total of 10 possible attacks.

My question is this;

Do you subtract the casualties caused by the Phoenix Guard from the Goblins attacks back, leaving them with 4 attacks, or do the Goblins make 10 attacks back?

Apologies if this seems obvious, but I've only just got my hands on the new rules and I can't be sure I'm not confusing two editions worth of rules.

Oh, also, supporting attacks DO get to make use of the units weapons, correct (Halbereds on the Phoenix Guard in this case)? But are limited to 1 attack (or 3 for monstrous infantry)? Correct?

I've leant my rule book to one of my friends so he can brush up on the new rules... which, ironically, is preventing me from doing the same :o

Thanks in advance.

A.

theorox
02-11-2010, 14:22
5 Wide gobbos look like this:

GGGGG
GGGGG
GGGGG
GGGGG

Then 6 die

GGGGG
GGGGG
GGGG

With spears you fight in 3 ranks. All gobbos can attack. :)

Theo

theorox
02-11-2010, 14:23
Oh and on the weaponquestion, yes you can use your weapons.

Theo

Avian
02-11-2010, 14:43
Casualties do not matter - if there is a model physically in a position to attack, that model ALWAYS gets to attack, regardless.

eyescrossed
02-11-2010, 15:17
Unlike last edition. Glass hammers are not so useful now.

Ahra Returns
02-11-2010, 15:24
:D

Excellent! I won the roll off and that's the way we played it - (not that my Goblins actually achieved anything in that particular fight). So I'm pleased to hear we played it properly.

Oh - one thing though;

''With spears you fight in 3 ranks. All gobbos can attack. :)

Theo''

That doesn't apply if the Gobbo's charge though, right? Or did I cheat myself out of 5 (wildly ineffectual) attacks? :p

a18no
02-11-2010, 15:27
Spears don't work on the charge, you're right.

Palatine Katinka
02-11-2010, 18:16
I find it best to think less when working out attacks. Don't think about how many goblins were able to attack. Don't think about how many died. When it is your turn to attack just see how many can attack right there and then. Before and after that moment don't matter.

Bac5665
02-11-2010, 21:37
Casualties are taken from the back. For all intents and purposes, your PG are killing the gobbos in the back rank NOT the gobbos in the front rank. Think of it that way (which happens to be the way its written) and its all clear.

theunwantedbeing
02-11-2010, 21:46
The best way to think of it is not to think about it.
The models that are there when it is their turn to attack, get to attack.

That is it.
Forget 7th ed combat completely, this is 8th ed and all you'll do is confuse yourself.

Kevlar
02-11-2010, 21:50
Casualties are removed from the front (If I remember correctly - though they are removed from the back to make everything easier from a game play perspective), so - at this point - the Goblins had 5 models in base to base contact and 5 models in the second rank eligible provide supporting attacks; which means a total of 10 possible attacks.


This is the part you have wrong. In the previous editions casualties were removed from the front limiting attacks back. In the current edition "step up" means exactly that. All the models step up to fill in the gaps, so essentially the casualties are removed from the back. Anyone in a combat position may make an attack. Remember though, supporting attacks are limited based on unit type.

Thundergod
03-11-2010, 14:12
PK and TUB have it exactly right, clear your mind, forget all past editions and look at who can hit when your turn to attack comes. Everyone who has gotten confused by this (including myself) is overthinking the rules.
Good luck!