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DaemonReign
19-12-2010, 21:14
Ok?

Well imagine this:

A Bloodletter Horde with +d6 to 1st Charge Move charges unit 1.

Unit 1 chooses Flee as charge reaction.

Bloodletters Re-Direct toward unit 2 (diagonally behind unit 1).

Unit 2 chooses Hold as Charge Reaction.

Bloodletters roll 3x6 (23")
Unit 1 rolls Snake Eyes (2")

Conclusion: Unit 1 is in the path-line of Bloodletters charging unit 2.

Question: Is unit 1 destroyed ('caught') and the charge completed, or does the Bloodletters have to complete the charge on unit 2 using one wheel - without touching and thus not wounding unit 1?

Most likely the latter, right?

Edit: Just got the book out.. Let's see if anyone " Ninjas " this..

If the charge is failed the unit basically starts wheeling to "get around" unit 1. That's the only indication we find.

Korraz
19-12-2010, 22:00
No, you won't catch it. The unit will try to wheel, but most likely the charge will fail.

DaemonReign
19-12-2010, 23:39
No, you won't catch it. The unit will try to wheel, but most likely the charge will fail.

Yes the only precidence we find in the Brb is how to resolve failed charges.

But precisely because that's as clear as it gets, RAW must be this way.

It opens for philsophical questions though..
:
Shouldn't a scenario like the one I described warrant the 'bonus' rather than the "meh" resolution of this [highly unlikely] set of events.

I guess I should start a thread in the background section of the Forum. Thanks.

Palatine Katinka
20-12-2010, 00:20
Is the flee move not made before redirect is declared? This would mean you would know whether or not they are going to block your charge before declaring the charge and could instead complete the original charge against the fleeing unit.

DaemonReign
20-12-2010, 02:24
Is the flee move not made before redirect is declared? This would mean you would know whether or not they are going to block your charge before declaring the charge and could instead complete the original charge against the fleeing unit.

I guess we play it "wrong" then because as I remember it we tend to declare 'everything' and then roll all the dice (for each sub-phase).

I don't mean to say we roll all the power/dispel dice in one go and sift through the result - but in the case of charge/charge-reactions my group doesn't play it like you say for some reason.

It must have just seemed obvious.. Nobody's really looked it up before me thinks.

Still, and especially the way you say it's supposed to be played, alas the goody fluffiness of those Bloodletters over-running the first unit and smashing right into the second unit is just not RAW.

I maintain that it would be cooler that way - and it's not like Bloodletters is the only unit-type/faction that could "benefit" so even though I drew an example to a theorethical event "close at hand" it's really got nothing to do with "Bloodletters" per say.

I digress.. Are you SURE the flee-move is made before the re-direct-'decision'?

Palatine Katinka
20-12-2010, 08:39
I'm not 100% sure in the case of redirects but I know that for other charges you declare a charge and then your opponent declares and resolves their reaction before the next charge is declared. Only when all charges are declared and all reactopns resolved do any chargers move. As I read it, to declare the redirected charge you have to have first resolved the previous reaction.

Korraz
20-12-2010, 11:15
I'm not sure there, I don't have the book here.
But what is sure: If you choose to redirect, the other unit is out of the picture. You can't interact with it any more, so you can't catch it.

DeathlessDraich
20-12-2010, 11:28
1) Yes, Palatine is right (he usually is :)) about the sequence -
i) declare,
ii) respond - hold, move fleers or S&S ,
iii) next declaration and Redirects.
iv) Calculate charge range after the last charge response has been resolved
v) Move chargers

2) EITW from 7th was abandoned, so a charger can only make contact with the unit it (initially) has declared a charge against unless ...

3) If the charger wants to redirect, it must pass a Ld test.

A)If the charger passes, it must redirect only. If (as in your scenario)the fleer (or any other enemy units) is in the direct path, then the charger must move around this unit and if it cannot the charge fails.

B) If the test fails, the charger must maintain its original charge - in your case probably a successful charge.

One of the reasons why in 8th ed, a straight lure now has 5 outcomes instead of 2 in 7th.

T10
20-12-2010, 12:54
The rules aren't quite clear as to wether you resolve the first flee move before declaring a redirect. It makes sense to resolve the flee move first, though. This way it is clear wether or not the fleing unit is blocking the charger's path to other units.

-T10

DeathlessDraich
20-12-2010, 13:32
Redirect is a fresh charge declaration (pg 18) and therefore must occur after the previous charge response is completed (pg 16)