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View Full Version : Eternal guard fighting stlye and Great weapon.



Smithpod68
17-01-2011, 00:39
The WE FAQ says a model with the Eternal Guard fighting stlye loses the benefits if he uses a magic weapon or magic armor. Does that mean if he takes a great weapon he still gets the benefit as it isn't magical and requires 2 hands like the etrnalguard weapons?

senoja
17-01-2011, 00:42
great weapon isnt a magic wepon is it so yes he still benefits??

Archangelion
17-01-2011, 01:13
I'm confused senoja. Why did you answer with a question?

senoja
17-01-2011, 02:34
sorry the question marks were more my connfussion as to why the question was asked in the first place as he basicly answered his own question himself

Masque
17-01-2011, 09:05
I believe if you give him a great weapon it will have no effect though.

SkawtheFalconer
17-01-2011, 09:10
Does the WE Army book cover this? It seems like you would lose fighting style to me...

Memnos
17-01-2011, 09:15
I seem to recall that you can't take additional weapons under that fighting style.

Although, to be honest, that is such a terrible option that I wouldn't care one way or the other. A 5+ armour save Elf with T3 who always strikes last.

Whoopee.

Satan
17-01-2011, 09:29
The WE FAQ says a model with the Eternal Guard fighting stlye loses the benefits if he uses a magic weapon or magic armor. Does that mean if he takes a great weapon he still gets the benefit as it isn't magical and requires 2 hands like the etrnalguard weapons?

What?! Are we reading the same FAQ? Mine says specifically on p. 3, right side near the bottom that a character from the Eternal kindred may take additional armour or weapons and still benefit from the Eternal Guard fighting style.

What do they mean by that anyway? I can take magic armour and/or weapons which combine with the fighting style? I can take additional light armour and/or shield thus improving my armour save? That would be my spontaneous interpretation of the FAQ, but can't cross-reference with the army book right now.

Ikhoornix
17-01-2011, 10:38
the Eternal guard rule states that the model counts as if armed with 2 handweapons when in b2b, or armed with a spear when not in b2b. Additionally the model is counted to have a 5+ armor save.

In my gaming group we see the FAQ answer as:
You can buy whatever (mundane) armor or equipment you want, but will still count as 2hw/spear and 5+ save.

Satan
17-01-2011, 10:55
the Eternal guard rule states that the model counts as if armed with 2 handweapons when in b2b, or armed with a spear when not in b2b. Additionally the model is counted to have a 5+ armor save.

In my gaming group we see the FAQ answer as:
You can buy whatever (mundane) armor or equipment you want, but will still count as 2hw/spear and 5+ save.

But RAW does equal magic/mundane equipment as I'd see fit from my understanding of the FAQ, since it's not specified.



Q. May a character from the Eternal Kindred take additional
armour or weapons and still benefit from the Eternal Guard fighting
style? (p68)
A. Yes.

Any other similiar examples where it specifies magical or non-magical additional armour or weapons?

SkawtheFalconer
17-01-2011, 15:31
So, presumably his armour save would stack to 4+ if he also took a Shield (etc)? I also suspect the 'additional weapons' thing refers to stuff like Bow of Loren, which could be used "as" Additional HW/Spear in combat due to Eternal Guard special rule?

I don't have a clue how this ties into the original poster's Q regarding Great Weapons, however.

The word 'May' implies you can choose to benefit from Fighting Style if you wish, but you'll gain an attack (add hw) instead of strength bonus (gw)? But then, that seems like a 7th ed solution, when now the rule is 'if you have a particular weapon (i.e. not just a handweapon) you must use it'.

Satan
17-01-2011, 15:42
So, presumably his armour save would stack to 4+ if he also took a Shield (etc)? I also suspect the 'additional weapons' thing refers to stuff like Bow of Loren, which could be used "as" Additional HW/Spear in combat due to Eternal Guard special rule?

I don't have a clue how this ties into the original poster's Q regarding Great Weapons, however.

The word 'May' implies you can choose to benefit from Fighting Style if you wish, but you'll gain an attack (add hw) instead of strength bonus (gw)? But then, that seems like a 7th ed solution, when now the rule is 'if you have a particular weapon (i.e. not just a handweapon) you must use it'.

Sorry, after coming home and and consulting the AB I concluded that indeed they can't be issued magic EQ if they wish to use the Eternal Guard fighting style.

Using other non-magical EQ would be fine though. Question is whether it would stack for his armour save, thus reaching 3+ w. shield and light armour.

apbevan
17-01-2011, 18:53
Consulting AB for rules.... I hate it when im playing someone and they cheat(inadvertent or not) because of AB and further annoy me by not taking responsibility and just well thats what army builder says.

Im not making any judgement on you I just want to post a warning to not use AB for rules

Masque
17-01-2011, 19:15
Seeing as he said "the AB" rather than just "AB" I assume he meant "the armybook" rather than "Army Builder".

apbevan
17-01-2011, 19:49
well that makes me look rather silly, I apologize.

bluemage
17-01-2011, 20:07
Yeah, if you take a great weapon you'll have +2 str and strike last, and a 5+ armor save. There isn't really any point in taking a shield though, as you're forced to used two hand weapons in combat. The eternal guard fighting style the worst kindred upgrade you can choose and I've never seen someone take it before.

senoja
17-01-2011, 21:00
hmm i dunno bout tht blue mage tbh as if u use outside boosts hordeing them could be quite interesting (50 attacks?) bearing im mind i dont have the WE book so dont flame me bout how expensive they are or anything like tht as beyond this thread i have no knowledge of WE

Haravikk
17-01-2011, 21:10
Isn't the eternal guard fighting style really, really cheap? I think that's kind of the point of it; if you want to keep a character inexpensive then you can take that as a nice minor boost. Otherwise you go with another combo.

theunwantedbeing
17-01-2011, 21:44
Isn't the eternal guard fighting style really, really cheap? I think that's kind of the point of it; if you want to keep a character inexpensive then you can take that as a nice minor boost. Otherwise you go with another combo.

It's cheap, but does almost nothing anyway.
You get a flat 5+ save, and fight as if you had an extra hand weapon regardless of how you are armed or armoured.

A magic weapon or armour negates this above effect.
It's not a very useful kindred to have.

Palatine Katinka
17-01-2011, 21:45
hmm i dunno bout tht blue mage tbh as if u use outside boosts hordeing them could be quite interesting (50 attacks?) bearing im mind i dont have the WE book so dont flame me bout how expensive they are or anything like tht as beyond this thread i have no knowledge of WE

He's talking about characters getting the upgrade to Eternal Kindred, not the Eternal Guard unit.


Isn't the eternal guard fighting style really, really cheap? I think that's kind of the point of it; if you want to keep a character inexpensive then you can take that as a nice minor boost. Otherwise you go with another combo.

It's the only way to get equivalent to mundane heavy armour and additional hand weapon and for a hero it is slightly cheaper than light armour and an additional hand weapon (for a lord slightly more). If you want a hero with no magic weapons or armour it is cheap and cheerful but I can't imagine a lord using it.

Smithpod68
18-01-2011, 00:21
My question relates to the fact that would he get the extra attack with a great weapon because of the Eternal guard fighting style since it is a mundane weapon? That way he'd get an extra attack with a great weapon. For a Noble that would be 4 str 6 attacks. Give him the spite where you are only hit on 6's in a challenge and you could have some fun.

Masque
18-01-2011, 00:25
Like I said earlier, I'm pretty sure he'll attack as if he had two hand weapons and only get a 5+ save no matter what mundane equipment you give him.

senoja
18-01-2011, 11:50
Like I said earlier, I'm pretty sure he'll attack as if he had two hand weapons and only get a 5+ save no matter what mundane equipment you give him.

i agree the rule specificly states they fight as if using an additional handweapon it make no reference to the equipment hes actualy using
Its an outright statement there no choice involved with how or what he fights with

SkawtheFalconer
18-01-2011, 12:14
Agreed, the AB seems clear, but the FAQ has muddied the water.

Lex
18-01-2011, 14:40
I'm not really sure how its muddied the water. It says fights as though armed with an additional hw/spear, not +1 atk and attack in additional ranks. You can buy a gw, but it has no effect as you will fight as though you had additional hw/spear, no choice.

Smithpod68
19-01-2011, 00:18
Thank you for the clarification everyone.