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Spiney Norman
21-01-2011, 06:59
The West Ind Trading Company Expeditionary Force

Lords - 462 pts (20.5%)
Kolonel Maximilian van der Kuypers, General of Marienburg
Full Plate Armour, Enchanted Shield, Holy Relic

Lord Kaspar van Gelding, Wizard Lord of the Gold Order
Level 4, Talisman of Preservation, Rod of Power, Terrifying Mask of Eee!

Heroes - 303 pts (13.5%)
Cptn Oswald van Essen
Battle Standard, Armour of Meteoric Iron, Dawnstone

Father Mannfred von Bokel, Warrior Priest of Manann
Heavy Armour, Great Weapon, Ironcurse Icon, Dragonhelm

Ambrose the Eccentric, Master Engineer

Core - 590 pts (26.2%)
40 Halberdiers
full command

10 Knights
full command

10 Handgunners
full command

Special - 605 pts (26.8%)
30 Greatswords
full command, Banner of Swiftness
+ Detachment: 10 Crossbowmen

Great Cannon
Great Cannon
Mortar

Rare - 115 pts (5.1%)
Helstorm Rocket Battery

Total - 2250

kornfolk
21-01-2011, 07:49
not sure you got enough knights? have you battle tested this army yet?

Spiney Norman
21-01-2011, 08:23
not sure you got enough knights? have you battle tested this army yet?

Only once, against High Elves, the knights work fairly well at that size if they can flank a non-elite infantry block. That may sound fairly specific and hard to achieve, but the damage my artillery was wreaking on my enemy caused him to advance pretty quickly. The Knights flanked his (somewhat depleted) spearmen horde and held them for two turns for no losses while my Greatswords manouvred for their other flank.

This setup broadly works by over-powering the enemy with artillery and forcing them to get across the table where the blocks can finish off the depleted regiments. Not sure how I would fair against dwarfs, I suspect it would come down to whose cannons knocked out the opponents war machines the fastest.

To be honest it doesn't matter how big your heavy cav unit is in 8E they're not going to break an infantry block single handed. I could perhaps invest in another 5 Knights instead of the Outriders?

Also the lore of metal is pretty good with Empire, it synergises very well with them in a number of areas, my opponent was particularly frustrated by my 2+AS Greatswords.

Reiksmarshal
21-01-2011, 19:28
[QUOTE=Spiney Norman;5257366]
To be honest it doesn't matter how big your heavy cav unit is in 8E they're not going to break an infantry block single handed. I could perhaps invest in another 5 Knights instead of the Outriders?
QUOTE]

Personally id always take pistoliers over outriders. being able to march and fire without penalty and being able to auto rally after fleeing then march and fire without penalty is brilliant. They can drw the enemy away and kill some of them while their at it. give the sergeant a repeater pistol and pistol and the unit is pumping out 12 s4 ap shots a turn.

If you want knights to break an infantry unit on their own take 16 inner circle knights with banner of magic resistance with Kurt Helborg and a warrior priest. While this is a very expensive unit ( i generally use it in 3k) it is extreemly effective.

electors champion
22-01-2011, 01:46
i agree with reiksmarshall although you can get away with cheaper units because thats pretty heavy points wise. unit of 14 core with warbanner, priest 4+mr, ludwig swarzhelm, i know he's not ideal but i love the guy and its pretty cheap on points for a cav unit with +6 static combat res from ludwigs +2, the knights +2 and 2 ranks. coupled with kills you should break most medium infantry of 25 men or less. and he's the only guy in the empire army with killing blow, and re roll to wound which can work miracles. 10 knights is unlikely to do much and is way too expensive for a supporting unit.
also handgunners would be better as a detachment

Karolinen
22-01-2011, 15:07
I only use helberds as attachments. Take 40 spearmen and you can fight in 3 to 4 ranks.

Spiney Norman
23-01-2011, 08:21
After roadtesting some NG hordes I'm really not impressed by the killing power of massed str 3. I'll take str 4 any day ;)

and seriously guys, this isn't a tourney list, what would the presence of Kurt Helborg or Ludwig Schwarzhelm do to my theme?

Besides, SCs are cheap crutches, good gamers should be able to manage without them.

also, just a question, but would the presence of my gold wizard in the halberds make the whole unit cause terror, as it, will they be immune to terror from anything else?

Torpedo Vegas
23-01-2011, 19:11
It seems some people in this thread are still playing 7th ed. Anyways, your list looks solid, though I also prefer pistoleers to handgunners, as a rule. Your wizard will make that unit to cause Terror and be immune to it, I think, though Terror really isn't that big of a deal anymore, I would try and fit in a dispell scroll.

Tigranius
23-01-2011, 20:18
Hi,

Depending on your style of playing i would try and get some more handgunners in, rather then crossbows. I prefer the blackpowder weapons above the bows and Xbows.

Getting a second squad of handgunners gives you the chance to get several Hochland long rifles in. Also give the Master Engineer one, meaning you have three sniper shots. Ideal for picking of smaller units or loose chars .. near the end of the battle you can also use them to kill of small units, securing extra victory points.

Best of luck with your list :)

thesheriff
23-01-2011, 20:59
I say keep knights. they add movement to a 4 warmachine army.

I always take handgunners to deal with WoC abd knights, but depends on your local competition.

I would consider dropping sone wargear and making tge halberds spears. Then work better as an attrition block because of parry.

Your greatswords should be charging, not being charged. So thr detatchment is a bit pointless as a detachment. Switch them to Handgunners and attach them to the big core unit

Thesheriff

Spiney Norman
23-01-2011, 22:10
Hi,

Depending on your style of playing i would try and get some more handgunners in, rather then crossbows. I prefer the blackpowder weapons above the bows and Xbows.

Getting a second squad of handgunners gives you the chance to get several Hochland long rifles in. Also give the Master Engineer one, meaning you have three sniper shots. Ideal for picking of smaller units or loose chars .. near the end of the battle you can also use them to kill of small units, securing extra victory points.

Best of luck with your list :)

A quick question, has the application of HLRs increased drastically with the move from 7th to 8th? HLRs on handgunner regiments was little more than a whimsical waste of points in 7th Ed, I don't ever remember killing a character in less than 3 turns, even with three of them.

With regards to the crossbows, I find the extra 6" of range very useful for instances where I get the first turn as handgunners would lose an entire turn of shooting. Also crossbows are better targets for the enchanted blades spell since they gain more than the gunners would. Nevertheless I usually include a regiment of both to spread my options wider.

I admit with regards to the inclusion of Outriders I mainly wanted to test how the vanguard move had affected them, being able to pile out shots from T1 seemed like an impressive option on paper and they did pretty well in the game I played, although that was mainly due to crippling the enemy ranged power early in the game. I appreciate they would be target numero uno against anyone with a half-decent ranged component.


It seems some people in this thread are still playing 7th ed. Anyways, your list looks solid, though I also prefer pistoleers to handgunners, as a rule. Your wizard will make that unit to cause Terror and be immune to it, I think, though Terror really isn't that big of a deal anymore, I would try and fit in a dispell scroll.

I took some time deciding between the dispel scroll and the rod of power, but went for the rod in the end because it provides a more constant effect and can also balance out poor WoM rolls. The more I play 8E I'm more and more convinced that more than 4 levels of magic is a waste of points. The only time a L2 would ever get to cast anything in this list is if my wizard lord failed an early casting roll, and the more I play the less that seems to happen.

The mask of Eee! was more of a thematic touch than a strategic inclusion, I rather envisage the Gold mage as a sort of darth-vaderesque figure on the battlefield projecting an aura of dread to all those near him.

Thanks for all your comments guys