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Lord of Nonsensical Crap
30-01-2011, 00:37
Dear Warseerites: as the title reads, which armies do you find make the best allies and enemies to have in a battle? To clarify, by "allies," I refer to the rare occasion when you have a team game, with one or more army on a single side. Which armies do you think complement your own army the best? As for "best enemies," I am referring to fun factor: which armies do you enjoy playing against the most?

For me, while I have not had any team battles in ages, I would imagine that the best allies for my Lizardmen would be as follows:

HIGH ELVES- High Elves, in my opinion complement Lizardmen extremely well in that both have similar strengths-- hard-hitting elite units, high manouverability, and extremely potent magic. I would imagine that Banner of Sorcery + Slann on the same side would be an excellent advantage, and High Elves bring certain units to the table-- long range artillery, flying monsters, cheap Chariots, etc-- that the Lizardmen are lacking (while the Lizardmen, in turn, have cheap and sometimes expendable skirmishers, which the Elves are lacking themselves).

EMPIRE- Empire, I would imagine, would be a good ally primarily because they have the numbers and the artillery that the Lizardmen don't have. Between Skink Skirmishers and Detachments, both races have lots of harassment/diversion units, and can both field some very nice close combat units as well. Plus, as far as metagame goes, I can't think of anything scarier than a Slann, War Alter, Steam Tank and artillery on the same field (though that would depend on the points level).


For "Best enemies,' the races I enjoy playing against the most are as follows:

DAEMONS OF CHAOS- I played only one game against Daemons in 8th, but it was an absolute blast. As powerful as Daemons are, Lizardmen have plenty of ways to counter them, and at the end of the day, both armies have lots of manouverability, magic, and elite troops slogging it out. Plus, they're ancient enemies, so battles between them always resonate nicely with the background.

SKAVEN- Lizardmen and Skaven are polar opposites in many ways: one usually has a few units of durable, elite infantry, while the other throws out waves of expendable cannon fodder. One race relies on dangerous reptiles and weird alien technology, the other uses advanced guns that tend to misfire horrendously. I've had only a few games against Skaven, but I've found them all quite enjoyable (well, unless they were against 6th-ed shooty armies of death...and the less said about them, the better).

WOOD ELVES- One of the most fun games I had in 7th edition was between my skirmishy Lizardmen list and a Wood Elf army. It was one of the most dynamic and bloody games I've ever played, which charges and overruns all over the place on either side, and lots of spells, poisoned darts and arrows flying back and forth. I have yet to face Wood Elves in 8th edition, though.

What about you guys/gals?

H33D
30-01-2011, 00:44
I think that for most armies at least the magic heavy ones, Dwarves would be an incredible ally. They won't use your power dice, they can hold the line better than anyone, and they will shoot everyone to bits for you.

Berry
30-01-2011, 00:53
Tomb Kings has lots of magic that doesn't drain a single power dice. On the downside they are neutral so they can never be trusted allies to anyone

vinny t
30-01-2011, 02:18
I really like the idea of Empire for Lizardmen, as they have some really scary War Machines as well as good magic defence.

Maybe Dwarwes, as they offer all of the potential war machines as Empire, but also have Grudge Throwers and such

Jolly Puggles
30-01-2011, 02:44
I've always thought of this subject in light of campaigns that make sense from a thematic point of view. I also tend to think in fours...

Brettonia/Wood Elf vs. Skaven/Beastmen: This one is fairly self explanatory, I think. Brets and W.Elves complement each other on the battle field quite obviously; Heavy Cav and artillery from the Brets is well supported by the W.Elves impressive archery and maneuverability. Likewise, Skaven and Beastmen complement each other with the Skaven bringing mass troops and arcane devices and the Beasts bringing much needed heavy support (Bestigors, Minotaurs, Monsters, etc.). The thematic link is obvious for a campaign set on the borders of and within the Loren forest.

Empire/Dwarves vs. Orcs and Goblins/Skaven: Another one that's fairly obvious thematically, for a campaign set in and around the Blackfire Pass and/or the Worlds Edge Mountains. From a gameplay point of view both Empire and Dwarves and OnG and Skaven have fairly similar play-styles (the former pair being infantry plus heavy artillery and the latter being mass-troops with odd stuff), which means that any alliances won't make a lot of difference to either sides tactics. Having said that, the Dwarves provide much heavier infantry than the Empire can muster and the Empire can field much faster moving troops (like Knights) to protect the Dwarven flank. Likewise, OnG have cavalry and heavy infantry where the Skaven do not and Skaven have halfway decent warmachines where the OnGs do not.

Similar groups can be formed from other "theatres of war" and factions and it doesn't take a genius to make the appropriate links. Typically speaking every army has its own peculiar weakness that is rarely duplicated by another, which is something that makes alliances dangerous territory from a gameplay point of view. Take away the checks and balances and any notion of 'fair play' can go out the window. Where alliances are made, it is imperative to build armies along more "thematic" lines than "gaming" ones because truly borked lists will inevetibly emerge if you don't.

ftayl5
30-01-2011, 03:47
O&G and Skaven wouldn't fit in the deployment zone...
Anyway, for my Goblin army, I'd want Warriors of Chaos allies probably. They're elite and expensive but hard to kill and very killy, while my guys are cheap but awful in combat. They cover each other's weaknesses well.

Lord of Divine Slaughter
30-01-2011, 09:35
The allies that work the best, are those that work fluffwise. So lizzies should always be alone, since nobody likes them.

Although I did have a random teamup with darkies and high elves that was rather fun. Basically we spent most of the game insulting each other, keeping score of casualties inflicted ("That still only counts as one!") and generally having a good time. The arrogance level was so high that we really couldn't care about the opposing armies, as long as we outdid the other :D

TrojanWolf
30-01-2011, 10:34
The allies that work the best, are those that work fluffwise. So lizzies should always be alone, since nobody likes them.

QFT. :D

I went to a doubles tourney recently with my Skaven and a mates High Elves. Ours seemed to work pretty well, with massed HE infantry and shooting paired with large Skaven units and hard hitting beasts like Rat Ogres and the HPA.

The whole thing was great fun, and we got third overall and best sports. It had its moments too, my personal favourite being a unit of Clanrats fighting enemy Sea Guard to the front and some dwarfs to the flank. The Clanrats slaughtered both units. :D

Haravikk
30-01-2011, 18:25
I've played a couple of team battles as Dwarfs paired with Wood Elves and they complement each other very well; lots of tough, armoured blocks supported by fast-moving, high impact units. Lore of Life is great as a boost to Dwarfs, and even the Lore of Athel Loren doesn't go amiss as Regenerating Dwarfs are nothing to scoff at, and call of the hunt is a pretty good spell if you can get it, it's like having an Anvil of Doom.

Urgat
30-01-2011, 19:51
Orcs would complement my goblins fine I think :)

SilasOfTheLambs
31-01-2011, 03:17
I'll plug my empire guys as a very good ally for anybody on the good side for one reason: Warrior priests. Priests can cast some spells that can do some things nothing else in the game can do... Lord on a carnosaur, and both of them re-rolling to hit and to wound. High elf bookmage with a 4+ ward. Oh, and if you're not a high elf, I can join your units with my priest and give you hatred. Saurus with hatred... dwarf longbeards with great weapons and hatred... grail knights with hatred. meanwhile those same guys are coughing up epic dispel dice. And then I have some guns.

Zilverug
31-01-2011, 08:20
My Dwarfs are popular as allies due to the leadership the Dwarfen general will provide.

TwoBitWriter
31-01-2011, 12:46
I find that my Dwarves work very well with my friend's High Elves.

daladzor
31-01-2011, 13:43
In my local playing group we tend to stick to more fluff related alliances, elves and dwarves, empire and dwarves.
Main ones at the moment are Empire and Dwarves and My skaven with my Vampire Counts.

Drongol
31-01-2011, 15:49
For my Ogres, I love playing alongside Dwarfs. I let them take the middle of the board and get to be the hammer that comes along the flank and crushes what goes after their anvil. Plus, you know, cannons and grudge throwers and stuff.

I also like playing alongside Night Goblin armies, but that's largely because they're fun in general and because my wife plays one. I probably fear her Fanatics worse than any of my opponents ever will!

As for my opponents... I don't really have a preferred enemy as such, so much as a preferred playstyle. If the army makes thematic sense and doesn't include a flying mage with a Power Scroll to Lawl Purple Sun! me to oblivion, I'm going to have a lot of fun playing. ;)

a18no
31-01-2011, 20:52
To your post:

Best allies for Lizard

fluff: nothing, they accept help from no one
competitive: empire is probably the best for them. Warmachine, long range shooting, "cheap" rank and file

Best ennemy for Lizard:
Fluff: skaven, deamon, dark elf. Deamon since they are the oldest for them, skaven because they screw so many of their city. Dark elf cause they have made many raid against them

For my armies:
Dark elf
Best fluff allies: nothing... except maybe deamon mainly slaanesh!
Best competitive allies: nothing, unstable ally is a pain to play. But skaven could be possible, at least both are unstable, skaven can bring warmachines an number, and dark elf provid good elite unit.

Ennemy: high elf is funny (re-roll each turn!!), but i'm tired of ASF. It's not broken, just stupid as an army rule. It change too much things.

For O&G
allies fluff wise: maybe skaven... as tricked allies!!
competitive: skaven can be good, but the unstable is a pain. Deamon for the elite and unbreakable could provid some strenght in the battle line

Ennemies: empire is always fun to face for the sake of destroying them once and for all!!

For Ogre:
Allies is hard since nothing can be good ally. But since I could go on both evil and good... that could provid some great tactica (empire, slann for magic, deamon for power, O&G is always fluff)

Ennemies: everything is hard to face, brettonian is near an auto-lost. But army with LOTS of cheap troop are fun the face, 25 to 30 dead body each turn is so satisfying!