PDA

View Full Version : Nurglesque grey knights.



jack da greenskin
23-02-2011, 00:18
This one's not a joke.

So we've all seen the dex, and we've all had the idea of the 16 man army in the back of our heads (15 paladins+draigo.)

These paladins will have FNP thanks to an apothecary, and 2w on their profile.


How easily would I convince people that typhus and 15 nurgle terminators are infact the elite of the deathguard, potent psykers and ferocious warriors, with FNP and 2w thanks to their allegiance to nurgle.

Everyone I've suggested it to has threatened to punch me in the face. Yet they'd be okay with me buying 15 of the new grey knight models.

am I being a git? I'd be building up and painting this army from scratch PURELY to use these rules.

Nezalhualixtlan
23-02-2011, 00:25
This one's not a joke.

So we've all seen the dex, and we've all had the idea of the 16 man army in the back of our heads (15 paladins+draigo.)

These paladins will have FNP thanks to an apothecary, and 2w on their profile.


How easily would I convince people that typhus and 15 nurgle terminators are infact the elite of the deathguard, potent psykers and ferocious warriors, with FNP and 2w thanks to their allegiance to nurgle.

Everyone I've suggested it to has threatened to punch me in the face. Yet they'd be okay with me buying 15 of the new grey knight models.

am I being a git? I'd be building up and painting this army from scratch PURELY to use these rules.

Go for it, I think you'll find a lot of people open to it more than you may get the impression from some of the unimaginative FAAC nuts on the internet.

LoneSniperSG
23-02-2011, 00:35
First someone suggests a Khorne army made with GK rules in mind, now Nurgle?

What exactly would apply to Nurgle? How much resilience do they have?

the gribbly
23-02-2011, 00:40
Why not? I plan on using the GKs dex to represent my wood elves.

Mannimarco
23-02-2011, 00:41
Im offering a shiny new penny and all the internet kudos you can handle to the first person who justifies a totally fluffy Emperors Children army using the new GK dex.

Inquisitor Kallus
23-02-2011, 00:45
Im offering a shiny new penny and all the internet kudos you can handle to the first person who justifies a totally fluffy Emperors Children army using the new GK dex.

Because Fulgrim told me to......

Dreadgrass
23-02-2011, 00:46
Im offering a shiny new penny and all the internet kudos you can handle to the first person who justifies a totally fluffy Emperors Children army using the new GK dex.

well, 2W FNP Termies could just be incredibly kinky, plus all the units dancing around "warding poles"....

EDIT: wooops, forgot what I actually wanted to say here...

Any suitably converted army, represented by adequate models, would be fine by me, whether designed for 1 of the 4 ruinous powers, an Imperial variant (eg. Deathwatch), or any other concoction. If somebody built an extensively converted grot GK counts-as army that looked the part, I'd commend him/her, not harrass them.

Mannimarco
23-02-2011, 01:26
Oh yeah if some work has went into the army then yeah but if its the (infinitely more common) stock marine with no conversions whatsoever who may or may not even be painted but is just getting dropped on the table to use the newest shiniest (and more often than not) more powerful rules then I'll be damned if sombody is going to hassle me and make me out to be an unimaginative jerk just because I would rather not play against them.

The spectacle of 2 painted and/or converted armies is important to some so yes if you put the work in and make the army look decent then yes ok but dont go dropping this (http://www.gamesworkshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jspcatId=cat440273a&prodId=prod1060075) on the table and say "these are space marines....I mean space wolves....I mean blood angels.....I mean grey knights....hey your just unimaginative" and expect people to be cool with it.

What do I know about imagination? I will only put a model on the table if he is fully painted and based, my army has a background story I try to write new fluff for after each game, heck my LATD leader "Herak" actually has his own background story about his life in the PDF and his family before he fell to Chaos.

Ive said it before and Ill say it again: A good test of how broken or overpowered a codex is or is perceived to be is how many of these "fits the theme better" armies pop up after its release. Remember Space Wolves? Remember Blood Angels? Blood Angels is a good example, it can make Alpha Legion, World Eaters and Night Lords, none of these Legions are anything alike but the one book did them all, it even makes a decent Blood Angels army. Now we have the Grey Knights which is going to make a great LATD army, a great Inquisition task force, a great World Eater army (cos all those psyker powers are just gifts of Khorne to make you stronger), a perfect Thousand Sons and perhaps even a good Death Guard deathwing.....of course its the Black Legion that make wide use of terminator assaults so it will cover them as well! If any part of it doesnt fit the fluff or theme of the army then just put your fingers in your ears and shout over and over "I'LL MAKE IT FIT!!!!" and your all set.

dingareth
23-02-2011, 01:33
Go for it, I've been using my Iron Warriors as anything from Space Wolves to Blood Angels back to Vanilla Marines, and not once in real life has anyone said anything bad about it. The comment section of BoLS though... that's a different matter.

LoneSniperSG
23-02-2011, 06:23
Go for it, I've been using my Iron Warriors as anything from Space Wolves to Blood Angels back to Vanilla Marines, and not once in real life has anyone said anything bad about it. The comment section of BoLS though... that's a different matter.

... Even after a few beers, this makes zero sense.

Hendarion
23-02-2011, 06:31
First someone suggests a Khorne army made with GK rules in mind, now Nurgle?

What exactly would apply to Nurgle? How much resilience do they have?
Welcome on warseer. The next cheese-train will start from bandwagoning-platform 9 3/4.

On topic: There is a Codex already for Nurgle-stuff which is much more fluffy because of all the rotting/resistance/chaos stuff inside it than Grey Knights. I do not see the resemblance at all. However, if you feel cool with it, then go for it.

Charax
23-02-2011, 06:35
On topic: There is a Codex already for Nurgle-stuff which is much more fluffy

My Death Guard Lord is less resilient than the troops he leads (No FNP). Fluffy, you say?

Hendarion
23-02-2011, 06:46
So, Eldar have Wraithlords with T8, 3+. Maybe that is the better Nurgle-choice then?

Charax
23-02-2011, 07:04
you'd run into the same issue WRT the HQ choice.

also you're being kind of childish.

Hendarion
23-02-2011, 07:13
I've only tried to point out that you can't compare different single entries of a Codex to another in order to justify or nullify any of my sayings.
But sure, go ahead and call me bad names.

Deus Mechanicus
23-02-2011, 07:17
Tzeentchian Grey Knights is the way to go!

Satan
23-02-2011, 07:22
To the OP - go for it. Sounds like a cool theme and a wonderful excuse to include a nurgle sorcerer/apothecary in every unit you can...

LoneSniperSG
23-02-2011, 07:35
Welcome on warseer. The next cheese-train will start from bandwagoning-platform 9 3/4.

On topic: There is a Codex already for Nurgle-stuff which is much more fluffy because of all the rotting/resistance/chaos stuff inside it than Grey Knights. I do not see the resemblance at all. However, if you feel cool with it, then go for it.

Welcome? ..According to my profile I've been a member here since 2007. And if I'm not mistaken, my Leman Russes blew up the last cheese-train leaving that platform.

Hendarion
23-02-2011, 07:36
I have seen it. It was a joke and I tried to make it sound like a loudspeaker announcement on a rail station. Nevermind.

SgtTaters
23-02-2011, 08:32
Im offering a shiny new penny and all the internet kudos you can handle to the first person who justifies a totally fluffy Emperors Children army using the new GK dex.
ok

CHAMPIONS OF CHAOS: all psychic powers stem from the warp, what can a weakling mortal hope to accomplish by wielding it against those who are championed by chaos? All psychic powers test at -1 leadership against chaos marines (Aegis)
BROTHERHOOD OF CHAOS: blessed by the ruinous powers, chaos marines units can channel psychic power as a single psyker (brotherhood of psykers)



BLASTMASTERS- the iconic weapon of the noise marines, these mighty instruments of destruction can emit bone crunching waves of sound. The axes are also weaponized with wicked cool blades or weighted to be swung and unleashing a deadly crash of noise. (storm bolter and nemesis force sword, halberd, hammer)

Noise Marines 'Opening Act' (GN Strike Team)
These chaos aspirants are the first wave of the Noise Marine attack and prepare the stage for the carnage to come.

MAKE SOME NOISE- The noise marines amplify the sounds of their thrashing metal to euphoric, ear shattering, bone pulping degrees. +1 strength (Hammer Hands)

WARP QUAKE- The noise marines rock so hard the border between reality and the warp buckles under their righteous metal. enemies deepstriking within 12" automatically scatter and suffer a mishap (warp quake)

Noise Marine Heavy Metals (purgitation squads)
Specializing in heavy instruments to set the beat to the carnage, up to 4 can take BLASTMASTERS (incinerator), BATTLE AXE(psycannon), WAVE THRASHER(psilencer)

WARP AMP- the noise marines warp reality to amplify the waves of destruction. Can shoot without LoS, but enemy always has cover. (Astral Aim)

Noise Marine Legends (paladins)
Amongst the mightiest of the noise marines, the scourge of the Ecclesiarchy, it is said with a single stroke they can send conscript platoons into a frenzy of disobedience and give commissars heart attacks. These living legends are total masters of sound, total slaves to the music.

Dr. Feelgood (apothecary)
Warp Maracas (nemesis falchions)
Warp Mic (nemesis warding stave)
Daemon Cello- daemonhammer

DEATH METAL: the legends direct their waves with such brutal force the air begins to blister and explode with chaotic fervor (Holocaust)




Noise Marine Wailers
METAL SCREAM: The Wailers harmonize their chaotic a capella with the force to powder bones and shatter panties in a 100 mile radius. All models in assault with the Wailers take a wound on a 4+ (saves allowed) (Cleansing Flame)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bH5gmbugmxM
(now imagine that with a half dozen warp amplified superhumans)


Groupies (warrior acolytes)
Noise Cult Skank (Death Cult Assassin)
Fan Club President (Inquisitor)
'Oh man, is that what I think it is? I'm totally trippin' (jokaero)
etc.

Here you go, a Noise Marine list with a variety of instruments, jam sessions with different effects, and all kinds of ways to Kill with Noise.

Baneboss
23-02-2011, 08:43
These paladins will have FNP thanks to an apothecary, and 2w on their profile.


Everyone and their dog must have FnP these days? With every next codex in line i am more and more disgusted with those rules.

On topic i dont think i would have much problems representing the army since Chaos codex is lacking in options to represent this army.

Dux
23-02-2011, 08:46
Stuff

Made me lol.

But i would use Black Metal for the Space Marine Wailers.

jack da greenskin
23-02-2011, 08:53
[QUOTE=Mannimarco;5335144
The spectacle of 2 painted and/or converted armies is important to some so yes if you put the work in and make the army look decent then yes ok but dont go dropping this (http://www.gamesworkshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jspcatId=cat440273a&prodId=prod1060075) on the table and say "these are space marines....I mean space wolves....I mean blood angels.....I mean grey knights....hey your just unimaginative" and expect people to be cool with it.
[/QUOTE]

Probably will be death guard FW bits, plus normal terminators, plus greenstuff plus resin bases plus scythes and all kinds of pestilencey weapons.

I don't like bandwagoners, "my ultramarines are wolves today, and this librarian is my rune priest." But I have had a nurgley itch for a while, and I really dont like the rules in the chaos dex. I'd love to do a grey night terminator army aswell, but I fear a lot of people will be using them, and I always like to be different. (And the typhus model looks REALLY nice IMO.)

Hendarion
23-02-2011, 08:55
"... and this librarian is my rune priest." But I have had a nurgley itch...
You shouldn't have used that quote-sign there yet...

Tymell
23-02-2011, 09:11
As with most things, the more effort you've put into the conversions, the more likely people will accept it.

That said, personally I'm always a bit iffy about using a codex to represent something that already has it's own list. I can see where you're coming from on this particular idea, but the psyker powers don't fit so well IMO.

Depulsor
23-02-2011, 09:14
Finally we have it: One codex to represent them all. :evilgrin:

(Although I have to admit it begins to get dull, to hear the same joke again and again. :p)

Aedes
23-02-2011, 09:24
Actually, I thought I might create a THOUSAND SONS army with the Grey Knight Codex, using the egyptian heads, bits and shields from Scibor. I think of all the Chaos Legions, thousand sons would fit best.

Wishing
23-02-2011, 09:28
Yeah, thousand sons was the first legion to be brought up here to be fielded as grey knights, which I guess is why the joke on page one was about noise marines - slaanesh is now the only god that hasn't had a thread on here in the last week saying that their forces fit well with the GK codex.

LokkoRex
23-02-2011, 09:31
SgtTaters: i think i love you, although i thought noise marines played someting far more evil than metal, like...

(shudders)

...pop.

Whitehorn
23-02-2011, 09:41
Why not? I plan on using the GKs dex to represent my wood elves.

I found this funny, despite being a jab at the concept :)

Mixed crowd, mixed opinions.

I like the idea of using a different codex to represent a justified army that doesn't already have an existing codex. Sometimes I even like using the wrong codex for an army that has one, but it's always down to a good justification.

For the strengths of the book? bad.
For a nice concept, backed up by well thought out models and composition? good.

Personally, I am excited about adapting C:GK for a pre-Heresy Thousand Sons army and I couldn't care less what the competitive players think. I never do well at tournaments, I'm more interested in playing a flavoured army with a sporting opponent, that gets me my kicks.

scar face
23-02-2011, 09:44
Hmmmm, grey knights are grey knights.

Nurgle are Nurgle chaos marines, not grey knights.

Deal with it.

scar

MvS
23-02-2011, 09:45
I think it would be fine.

It fits with how I see the ancient Chaos Legions - very powerful, rare and in game terms quite expensive. I would only have one unit like that though.

scar face
23-02-2011, 09:50
I don't like the idea of anyone using an army represented by a different codex. If they hate their codex that much, they should stop warhammer or play a different army.

scar

Alaitoc
23-02-2011, 09:53
They really don't need all codexes nowadays....these are the only codexes that should be:

1 1337 army - Few models, really hard stuff, covering the hardest bastards in the galaxy...use whatever model you see fit...
2 Normal space marines - Covers 3 variants: Normal, close combaty or jumpy/dreadnoughty, (and a terminator variant), use whatever models you fancy: Chaos, imperial SM etc. etc.
3 Space elves - Covering good and bad eldar, use whatever models you want, but weaponoptions is WYSIWYG
4 Orks - ORKS
5 guards - containing inquisition and sisters statlines aswell
6 Slime aliens - tyranids, or whatever horde alien slimestuff you want to use
7 Advanced spacealiens - Tau, with statlines fitting for allies (guards, kroots or whatever models you fancy)

Wishing
23-02-2011, 10:07
They really don't need all codexes nowadays....these are the only codexes that should be:

1 1337 army - Few models, really hard stuff, covering the hardest bastards in the galaxy...use whatever model you see fit...
2 Normal space marines - Covers 3 variants: Normal, close combaty or jumpy/dreadnoughty, (and a terminator variant), use whatever models you fancy: Chaos, imperial SM etc. etc.
3 Space elves - Covering good and bad eldar, use whatever models you want, but weaponoptions is WYSIWYG
4 Orks - ORKS
5 guards - containing inquisition and sisters statlines aswell
6 Slime aliens - tyranids, or whatever horde alien slimestuff you want to use
7 Advanced spacealiens - Tau, with statlines fitting for allies (guards, kroots or whatever models you fancy)

Yep, that is the approach of counts-as players as far as I can tell. Look at the army lists not for what they are, but for what they can represent.

Hendarion
23-02-2011, 10:10
Well, Wishing, that always seams a bit different. Most "counts-as" aren't using weak lists, but the most strong ones lately released.

Wishing
23-02-2011, 10:26
True, although I think in this case it has more to do with "shiny! new! exciting!" than actual power. The codex isn't even out yet, so we don't actually know how strong the GKs will be.

Dark Aly
23-02-2011, 10:28
I don't really understand why Typhus' retinue would have such an abundance of psycic ability? I prefer the idea of using GK to represent Thousand Sons although some things would have to left behind (asassins, Some henchmen and psycic powers)

Otherwise I don't relly see why not. Hell it doesn't matter if your grey knights are silver or green and mouldy looking, I rarely use GW colour schemes anyway and thats all it is in essence.

Lord Lorne Walkier
23-02-2011, 10:38
might as well say that an Ork nobs mob with mega armour is like the Grey Knights. They have Waaaaaag............

fataljd
23-02-2011, 10:43
Um, why Grey Knights and not Deathwing? :)

Khorneguy
23-02-2011, 10:52
Well i'm planning on using the 'dex as i've been using the current DH book, to represent pre-heresy thousands sons, based on the fact that:

-psychic powers define the thousand sons, even more so pre-heresy when even the citizens of Prospero had psychic powers

- if they have a suitably nasty character that suits him, i can finally field the Magnus the Red model i made from scratch

- Pre heresy marines were badass, hence the GK stats

PyroSikTh
23-02-2011, 11:44
I'm hoping to use the GK codex for my LatD, so some Nurgle Terminators in the form of Paladins will fit in like a treat, and I doubt anyone would complain (show me a codex already out where I can have guardsmen/mutants AND Terminators. Yeah, didn't think so).

Chiara
23-02-2011, 13:23
I don't like the idea of anyone using an army represented by a different codex. If they hate their codex that much, they should stop warhammer or play a different army.

scar

Okay, I will. I'll stop playing until my Chaos Space Marines have an opening army codex that is as overdone as every other codex that came out after the Lean Cusine orders were served. I knew Chaos should have waited in line instead of using Tzeentch's Senior Discount card to jump to the front of the line....Sigh.

Seriously though? If it is not a GT, a Tournament where you win a prize and in no shape or form is it meant to be the end all of all? Then by all means use whichever codex. Your Imperial Fist army works well with the SM codex, but you want to do all termies? Sure you can use the DA codex to represent the first company. Oh feel like showing off the fact IF can take teeth in hand to hand? Use the Blood Angels! Hey are your IF no longer feeling like yellow is cool and want to share their paint scheme up close and personal and say no to Librarians? Use the Black Templars.

This is the issue with the Marine Codexes being seperated. It will have a cause and effect where players will use their imaginations. Oh my god! HERETICS! Freedom of thought is bad! Do not freely think! Follow the rules and stick to the recipe. No Pirates here today.

Tymell
23-02-2011, 15:10
This is the issue with the Marine Codexes being seperated. It will have a cause and effect where players will use their imaginations. Oh my god! HERETICS! Freedom of thought is bad! Do not freely think! Follow the rules and stick to the recipe. No Pirates here today.

I think people are getting a bit forceful on both sides here, and the above post illustrates it well.

Someone who says "You shouldn't use a codex to represent an existing army" isn't some kind of anti-freedom nazi any more than someone who says "You can use a codex to represent another army". Indeed, surely criticising that first line of thought makes you guilty of the very thing you are condemning: telling people how to think.

The important point is players are allowed to (largely) do as they wish, but that doesn't mean everyone else has to like it. Player A isn't a bad guy because he wants to use the Grey Knights codex to represent his Chaos army, but nor is Player B a bad guy because he says he doesn't agree with that and won't play against it. As long as no one is outright trying to -stop- someone else making their army as they wish, the rest is up to them.

Chiara
23-02-2011, 16:26
Tymell, that was my intention behind posting that point. In no shape did I support it, but it was showing how equally it could be twisted around. Personally, I just like painting, converting and throwing dice while my lil grey men kill the other blue men. If you can explain it by your own fluff, then we have ourselves a game.

Depulsor
23-02-2011, 18:08
Now honestly... you people cant be serious?
I can understand every chaosplayer who isnt happy with his codex. But this is comedy. :eyebrows:

*Stormbolters and forceweapons + everyone is a psyker + they are badasses in powerarmor*, definies the GK rulewise.
All in all, this doesnt fit with chaos-spacemarines at all. It just doesnt.
And they dont fit with nurgle even in the slightest. They dont have T5 or feel no pain. They have a very expensive medic, thats it.

Ohh... wait... there is that badass part. Chaos is badass right? So it DOES fit. :cheese: As long, as that badass part is there, all the rest can be made fit. :eek:

LoneSniperSG
23-02-2011, 18:20
Dr. Feelgood (apothecary)

POINT NUMBER ONE. Thanks to you, I have this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHP6U5vQ3mU) song stuck in my head.



DEATH METAL: the legends direct their waves with such brutal force the air begins to blister and explode with chaotic fervor (Holocaust)

Here you go, a Noise Marine list with a variety of instruments, jam sessions with different effects, and all kinds of ways to Kill with Noise.

POINT TWO. This mid-length post does a better job with the noise marines than the damned Chaos Marine book did. Metal as a weapon. Hell yes.:chrome:

Col. Tartleton
23-02-2011, 18:39
Now honestly... you people cant be serious?
I can understand every chaosplayer who isnt happy with his codex. But this is comedy. :eyebrows:

*Stormbolters and forceweapons + everyone is a psyker + they are badasses in powerarmor*, definies the GK rulewise.
All in all, this doesnt fit with chaos-spacemarines at all. It just doesnt.
And they dont fit with nurgle even in the slightest. They dont have T5 or feel no pain. They have a very expensive medic, thats it.

Ohh... wait... there is that badass part. Chaos is badass right? So it DOES fit. :cheese: As long, as that badass part is there, all the rest can be made fit. :eek:

Neither does the Chaos Codex... Hurr Hurr Hurr.

If the upcoming "Codex Grey Knights" is like the leak (which I doubt but I'm humoring for all these threads) we're looking at the best representation of chaos space marines in general.

SPYDER68
23-02-2011, 18:47
I must be the only one that hasn't seen the rules...

All i know is some guy named Cortez lets you take Henchmen as troops.

Then i instantly saw i can do my Renegade Chaos army with FW renegade Guard models and FW termies.

I dont even know what a Henchmen is yet for stats, use weapons, cost.

Yep.. doin it for the power level. If i wanted to win id do IG :P

Korraz
23-02-2011, 18:58
Other things to do with Grey Knights:

-Dark Angels (They are fast and have TDAs and stuff!)
-Black Templars (They are CC and Knights too!)
-Space Wolves (Fenrisian Chainswords are better represented with NFWs!)
-Blood Angels (The mad art skills and psychic abilities!)
-Eldar (Wraithguard has a 3+)
-Tyranids (Henchmen as Gaunts, Knights as varying degrees of warriors, tanks as MCs!)
-Orks (Obviously Henchmen as Boyz and Knights as Nobs)
-Necrons (They are both silver)
-Sisters (Both have "hunters" in the name of their codizes)
-Imperial Guard (There are always Marines and Guardsmen on the battlefield Codex GK is way better at representing the forces of the IG too with the henchies.)
-Dark Eldar (If you don't see this, you don't belong here.)
-Tau (Please, it is obvious)
-Kroot, Zoats, Genestealer Cult, Squats, Hrud

jack da greenskin
23-02-2011, 19:26
Now honestly... you people cant be serious?
I can understand every chaosplayer who isnt happy with his codex. But this is comedy.

I am not currently a chaos player. I have thought about it, but have you seen the chaos dex?

I might do a grey knight army. The choice is generic GK, which might be fun, or lovingly convert 20 nurgle models, or buy 20 straight GK models and the only uniqueness in the army would be resin bases.


Um, why Grey Knights and not Deathwing? :)
FNP terminators, and not deathwing "one squad only can have FNP."

Col. Tartleton
23-02-2011, 20:22
Other things to do with Grey Knights:

-Dark Angels (They are fast and have TDAs and stuff!)
-Black Templars (They are CC and Knights too!)
-Space Wolves (Fenrisian Chainswords are better represented with NFWs!)
-Blood Angels (The mad art skills and psychic abilities!)
-Eldar (Wraithguard has a 3+)
-Tyranids (Henchmen as Gaunts, Knights as varying degrees of warriors, tanks as MCs!)
-Orks (Obviously Henchmen as Boyz and Knights as Nobs)
-Necrons (They are both silver)
-Sisters (Both have "hunters" in the name of their codizes)
-Imperial Guard (There are always Marines and Guardsmen on the battlefield Codex GK is way better at representing the forces of the IG too with the henchies.)
-Dark Eldar (If you don't see this, you don't belong here.)
-Tau (Please, it is obvious)
-Kroot, Zoats, Genestealer Cult, Squats, Hrud

Which in my mind is somehow totally fine because it's a game. Chess uses one codex with even less options for gear than necrons and even more worrisome, no dice. You also have fixed grid movement in chess.

In comparison everyone using the Grey Knight codex doesn't bother me at all... You have all the flexibility of measuring movement instead of a grid. You have terrain. You have various units and toughnesses and special rules and everything else. If people all want to use it let them. It's just a game, and it's certainly not balanced enough as is to warrant complaining about. Everyone using one book actually makes the game fairer.

Fable
23-02-2011, 20:32
I think my Grey Knights "counts as ulthwe" list will be great.

Warlocks as Paladins.
Wraithlords as Death Knights.
Henchmen as Guardians.
Wave Serpents as Storm Ravens.
Wraithguard as Terminators.
Aspect Warriors as Grey Knight Squads!

All units with psychic powers is much more fluffy for Eldar, and since so many Ulthwe models take the path of the seer, which is the longest path, they should have their bodies turning to crystal, hence the T4. It just fits better for how I see the army.

/sarcasm

innerwolf
23-02-2011, 20:33
FNP terminators, and not deathwing "one squad only can have FNP."

If by a model sniping rule or torrent of fire the apothecary dies, the terminators have no longer feel no pain. Why would the death of one Death guard Terminator take away the preternatural resilience from the other members of the squad?
They cry manly tears that cure their infinite illnesses and become purified marines? Nurgle takes away his blessing from them just because Billy the Terminator died?(obviously Nurgle wouldn't have cared about Bob).
Only if I heard a well thought, beleiveable explanation for it I would begin thinking on playing against that army.

kane40k
23-02-2011, 20:37
If it looks cool and has the effort put in to it then do it man. :) and message me with the project log?

im thinking of perhapse doing a unit of Tzeench Termies and Using them as GK termies in apocalypse for laughs. . . :)

Challenge Accepted
23-02-2011, 20:40
If the upcoming "Codex Grey Knights" is like the leak (which I doubt but I'm humoring for all these threads) we're looking at the best representation of chaos space marines in general.

Yeah, when I think Chaos, I think army-wide psychics with a preference for battling daemons.

I can't even tell if people are being serious about these "counts as" armies anymore. Some of them just sound hideous.

innerwolf
23-02-2011, 20:41
Yeah, when I think Chaos, I think army-wide psychics with a preference for battling daemons.

/highfivebro

BrotherCaptainS
23-02-2011, 20:47
This one's not a joke.

So we've all seen the dex, and we've all had the idea of the 16 man army in the back of our heads (15 paladins+draigo.)

These paladins will have FNP thanks to an apothecary, and 2w on their profile.


How easily would I convince people that typhus and 15 nurgle terminators are infact the elite of the deathguard, potent psykers and ferocious warriors, with FNP and 2w thanks to their allegiance to nurgle.

Everyone I've suggested it to has threatened to punch me in the face. Yet they'd be okay with me buying 15 of the new grey knight models.

am I being a git? I'd be building up and painting this army from scratch PURELY to use these rules.

No just No. The forums have been buzzing with this kind of talk. I want to count my Chaos as Grey KNights. Seriously that's like against the religion. Use the chaos codex and keep it there. They Have typhus. I garantee you there will not be one grey knight player saying i want to count my knights as chaos when that codex gets tricked out again.

SgtTaters
23-02-2011, 21:06
Yeah, when I think Chaos, I think army-wide psychics
Psychic powers come from the warp. To use psychic powers you have to test for 'perils of the warp'.
There are entire branches of the Imperium dedicated to hunting down rogue psychics and tracking psykers due to the huge danger of chaos corruption. Many in the Imperium believe that to be psychic means you are already tainted by Chaos. Chaos also grants psychic power.



with a preference for battling daemons.
Considering that many chaos marines summon daemons, live on daemon worlds, stuff daemons into swords, make them drive their rhinos, it is not entirely unbelievable that Chaos Marines would actually have the tools to deal with daemons.


Here's another one for you, if I told you there were a group of marines, and their powers are...

- one guy dwells entirely in the realm of chaos. He is beyond a mortal marine in power and can be summoned to the material world to crush his minion's enemies
- one guy is unkillable and always returns from the dead, nobody can explain how this happens.
- one guy can summon a spectral army to cut down his foes
- one guy can steal the luck of his own men to empower himself
- All of them are psychics
- All of them can channel the power of the warp through their bodies to infuse themselves with power

Honestly if I didn't know better I would think they were Chaos Marines. You know, the guys who live in the Eye of Terror, who gave themselves to Chaos, and who are tainted by the ruinous powers.


So to rephrase what you said, yes when I hear Chaos I think of army wide taint and domination of daemons

Challenge Accepted
24-02-2011, 03:35
Psychic powers come from the warp. To use psychic powers you have to test for 'perils of the warp'.
There are entire branches of the Imperium dedicated to hunting down rogue psychics and tracking psykers due to the huge danger of chaos corruption. Many in the Imperium believe that to be psychic means you are already tainted by Chaos. Chaos also grants psychic power.

How absurd.

Many people in the Imperium also believe the Emperor is a god, and Space Marines are unkillable angels - and that Roboute Guilliman is healing while in a stasis field. That doesn't somehow make them correct. Just because they think all psychic power is "Chaosy" and evil doesn't make it so.

The act of serving Chaos does not instantly give you psychic power. You are mistaken.

It's even more ridiculous when he mentions them being Death Guard, when Mortarion opposed psychics so much, that even having Librarians in his Legion was out of the question, and he was a key figure who spoke out at the trial of Magnus the Red.. but he just happened to have an army full of active psykers. What are the odds? :rolleyes:


Considering that many chaos marines summon daemons, live on daemon worlds, stuff daemons into swords, make them drive their rhinos, it is not entirely unbelievable that Chaos Marines would actually have the tools to deal with daemons.

Many possessed are overwhelmed by the creature within them, and they actively seek out the company of warp monsters to live in their flesh. Every single guy in your army just happens to be a Jack Hanna of the the Warp? This is absolutely stretching it.


Here's another one for you, if I told you there were a group of marines, and their powers are...

- one guy dwells entirely in the realm of chaos. He is beyond a mortal marine in power and can be summoned to the material world to crush his minion's enemies
- one guy is unkillable and always returns from the dead, nobody can explain how this happens.
- one guy can summon a spectral army to cut down his foes
- one guy can steal the luck of his own men to empower himself
- All of them are psychics
- All of them can channel the power of the warp through their bodies to infuse themselves with power

Honestly if I didn't know better I would think they were Chaos Marines. You know, the guys who live in the Eye of Terror, who gave themselves to Chaos, and who are tainted by the ruinous powers.

So to rephrase what you said, yes when I hear Chaos I think of army wide taint and domination of daemons

Active psychic gifts and an innate skill at battling Chaos is not the traits of the fallen Legions. I'm sorry, but you're flailing here, trying to justify new codex syndrome.

If you're arguing for a Thousand Sons style list, possibly. As it is, these "Khorne, Nurgle" etc threads are a joke. Just call it what it is - "I want new toys. Make me feel good about it."

New Cult King
24-02-2011, 03:53
I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm playing against the army's rules, regardless of if the minis are shiny and silver, or green and rotting. Get creative, go for it, and show us pics!

Private_SeeD
24-02-2011, 04:16
I'd have no problems as long as every model was half decently converted, and doing a 1k Sons list... If they chose another god i'd have more of an issue with it

Damien 1427
24-02-2011, 08:50
I honestly don't care one way or another. If the list is codex-legal, and the models are painted, I'm fine with it. Then again, I like to think in matters like this I'm a laid back player.

Those who're doing it to get an edge over the rest of us will drop back in a few months, anyway, when the book is no longer the new hotness. Those who actually are doing it for an interesting modelling or gaming experience will still be using it as count-as long after the metagaming crowd have dismissed it as "unviable".

I do hope GW are paying attention to the trend for Chaos players to leap onto anything in Power Armour and try to twist the list to represent their army. There is a reason why people are doing it, and I doubt every single one of them are in it for the unbeatable super-list.

Baragash
24-02-2011, 09:43
I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm playing against the army's rules, regardless of if the minis are shiny and silver, or green and rotting. Get creative, go for it, and show us pics!

^Word (and other letters)

Asuron
24-02-2011, 12:41
No
Why you ask?
Because this game only works because of the background it comes from
Lets face it the rules aren't exactly the best around, so the only strength it has to rely on is the background
If you do stuff like this, you take away from the only real strength the game has
The most compelling part of the game is the background and doing crap like this goes against the spirit of it

For the record, I don't mind counts as as long as the army in question resembles the theme your going for at least somewhat
But in a case like this its just stupid

I think its only topped by the World Eaters as Grey Knights suggestion

Col. Tartleton
24-02-2011, 13:21
Have you read any of the more recent codexes?

The background is no longer as important to the company. :D

Now we have rules and models and some flavor text which says which rules go with which models. Which is fine, because it's a game. But we can use the models for other rules.

I mean tbh the Paladin Grey Knights are roughly where a Marine would be fluffwise regardless of affiliation. Five Stats and two wounds with terminator save is basically how I've done Marines in fandex. As there is now an option for that, I think lots of people will find that attractive. 55 point marines (before upgrades) is roughly where the fluff places them, ten times as good as a guardsman. Ten Marines vs a hundred guardsman ought to be a draw...

So if you want "movie marines" or "fluff marines" or "justified truescale" Grey Knights are the Codex of choice.

Bob Hunk
24-02-2011, 14:35
If by a model sniping rule or torrent of fire the apothecary dies, the terminators have no longer feel no pain. Why would the death of one Death guard Terminator take away the preternatural resilience from the other members of the squad?

How is this any different from the icon bearer in a C:CSM terminator squad dying and the squad losing Nurgle's blessing that way? :)


They cry manly tears that cure their infinite illnesses and become purified marines? Nurgle takes away his blessing from them just because Billy the Terminator died?(obviously Nurgle wouldn't have cared about Bob).
Only if I heard a well thought, beleiveable explanation for it I would begin thinking on playing against that army.

Does that mean you wouldn't play against terminators with an icon in a normal chaos marine list? ;)

Go for it OP, good idea. :)

PyroSikTh
24-02-2011, 14:49
I mean tbh the Paladin Grey Knights are roughly where a Marine would be fluffwise regardless of affiliation. Five Stats and two wounds with terminator save is basically how I've done Marines in fandex. As there is now an option for that, I think lots of people will find that attractive. 55 point marines (before upgrades) is roughly where the fluff places them, ten times as good as a guardsman. Ten Marines vs a hundred guardsman ought to be a draw...

So if you want "movie marines" or "fluff marines" or "justified truescale" Grey Knights are the Codex of choice.

I never even though of that. That's pure genius.

Movie Marines are now codex legal :D

VeritasMortis
24-02-2011, 15:32
I whole heartedly indorse this idea, I believe you would have the only accurate depiction of Death Guard Terminators allowed by the rules, given the current state of the chaos dex. -blegh

Depulsor
24-02-2011, 15:56
How is this any different from the icon bearer in a C:CSM terminator squad dying and the squad losing Nurgle's blessing that way? :)


Not at all... but the icon-thing was a BAD idea. So you basically go from one bad idea to another bad idea ... so where is the logic behind that? :eyebrows:

Ivellis
24-02-2011, 16:04
Almost everything in the game is weak compared to their fluff if you base your reasoning off a guardsman.

If you think a normal space marine should be a grey knight paladin, then here's a eldar dire avenger: WS5 BS5 S4 T3 W1 A3 I6 Sv3+ Catapult with R18" S5 AP5 Assault 2. 4++ dodge save in close combat.

DuskRaider
24-02-2011, 16:10
So guys, I just picked up a Dark Eldar army, but their codex is really old and doesn't represent the army in my fluff... Think I would be able to use the Grey Knights codex as a counts-as?

Depulsor
24-02-2011, 16:27
So guys, I just picked up a Dark Eldar army, but their codex is really old and doesn't represent the army in my fluff... Think I would be able to use the Grey Knights codex as a counts-as?

If the upcoming "Codex Grey Knights" is like the leak (which I doubt but I'm humoring for all these threads) we're looking at the best representation of Dark Eldar in general.

DuskRaider
24-02-2011, 16:41
If the upcoming "Codex Grey Knights" is like the leak (which I doubt but I'm humoring for all these threads) we're looking at the best representation of Dark Eldar in general.

THANK GOD. That means I can free up my Dark Eldar codex for my Squats.

Draconis
24-02-2011, 16:41
Dear OP:

I love you. I'm aplogizing ahead of time. I am however, stealing your idea : ) At least for a game or two.

Draconis
24-02-2011, 16:58
I wouldn't have a problem with it. I'm playing against the army's rules, regardless of if the minis are shiny and silver, or green and rotting. Get creative, go for it, and show us pics!

Seconded. If they had a problem with it, I'd reply. "Well, this is my Grey Knights army, and codex. My GK just look different is all. I like these models more"

innerwolf
24-02-2011, 17:30
How is this any different from the icon bearer in a C:CSM terminator squad dying and the squad losing Nurgle's blessing that way? :)

Does that mean you wouldn't play against terminators with an icon in a normal chaos marine list? ;)


Icons are for regular marked CSM. They carry a Nurgle icon and the god show his pleasing giving them extra resilience. If they lose it, Nurgle gets angry and remove it from them.

Death Guard marines are mutated and transformed far beyond that. They are basically something completely different from a CSM. I don't think Nurgle would be able to revert them to their original state if displeased.

Anyway, as Depulsor said, it was a bad idea for Icons and it would be a worse idea for Cult Terminators.

Vedar
24-02-2011, 19:49
I'm going to use the Grey Knight Codex to represent my Daemons. Nurglings with Psycanons for the win.

innerwolf
24-02-2011, 19:55
I'm going to use the Grey Knight Codex to represent my Daemons. Nurglings with Psycanons for the win.

You fail at count-as, man. Nurglings are clearly better represented by Dreadknight rules ;)

Mannimarco
24-02-2011, 20:28
Codex Grey Knights as DarkMech: Just look at thee jokero with all kinds of weird and wonderful crazy weapons and tell me that doesnt just scream DarkMech.

.....Oh god Im doing it myself now!

ja_warria19@yahoo.com
24-02-2011, 21:29
I too dont mind your idea OP, in fact I love it. ESPECIALLY as typhus and Nurgle are HANDS DOWN the coolest HQ, and chaos god in 40k fluff. As far as the noobies who are power listing, I say what I have always said, bring it on and let me thrash your ill behaved spoiled hide on the table. But for those who genuinely enjoy this hobbie.. I still say pretty much the same thing hahah XD minus the descriptive words of course XD

Justicar_Freezer
24-02-2011, 21:54
Would I play against it sure, would it irk me some yes because of the background clash.

To be honest I kinda miss back in the days of 2nd edition when the whole counts as idea wasn't quite as common place or even as widely thought of as it is now and each army was that army. No cross overs no cameos. An ork was an ork a blood angel was a blood angel, a chaos marine was a chaos marine and an eldar was an eldar. -shrugs- It's just amusing to see how the game and the mind set of players have changed I guess is all I'm saying.

Lord Kalhadron
24-02-2011, 22:21
I could not care any less what models you use to represent an army, nurgle gray knights? Sure! Itīs not like the fluff is getting any worse either, just read the draigo crap!

I would actually prefer you using the gray knight rules over the chaos marine ones since they suck when using a bunch nugle termies. Whats the fun in facing a crappy army?