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Easy E
14-03-2011, 14:42
Just curious if eveything in the new Mat Ward codex: Grey Knights has the word Psy in front of it?

You know; psycannon, psybolter, Psydread, psygrenades, Psymissiles, etc.

Bunnahabhain
14-03-2011, 14:49
No, some of it is 'doom' or 'nemesis' instead...

Griefbringer
14-03-2011, 15:21
At least psycannon and psyk-out grenades have been around since the RT days, so cannot blame sir Ward for those.

WildWeasel
14-03-2011, 15:28
Kinda like how most of the "wolf" stuff predates Kelly's SW codex. But yeah, the Nemesis and doom stuff breaks up the psi/psy things.

Skyros
14-03-2011, 15:30
You might as well say 'power' is the new blood. Power armor, power fist, power sword, power weapon, etc.

Lord Damocles
14-03-2011, 15:31
Nemesis Doomfist.

Best weapon name ever.

















Not.

Castigator
14-03-2011, 15:34
Kinda like how most of the "wolf" stuff predates Kelly's SW codex. But yeah, the Nemesis and doom stuff breaks up the psi/psy things.

Which proves, that if you consider GW's naming convention a sin, it's a sin dating back to guys like Andy Chambers and Jervis Johnson. Flame them for it. More likely than not, it's probably an explicit policy that any writer must take if he is to write a Marine-book these days.

And as mentioned many times before, the "generic" Marines bad-weather schtick with all the Lighting, Storm, Hurricane, Tornado, Whirlwind, Typhoon, etc.. hasn't ever been very subtle either.

Bunnahabhain
14-03-2011, 15:43
There is a difference between a theme which allows variation within it- the marine weather theme- and Woolf/blood/psy spam, of repeating the same word over and over again, just in case you didn't get it the first 17 times...

Griefbringer
14-03-2011, 16:15
You might as well say 'power' is the new blood. Power armor, power fist, power sword, power weapon, etc.

Not that new, all of these more or less date back to the RT rulebook - which also featured power axes and power boards (flying skateboards) to further power up the setting.

However, the term "blood" was not that prevalent in the naming back then, besides Blood Angels and (a bit later) Blood Axe orc clan. But angels were quite prevalent back then, with Blood Angels, Dark Angels and angels of death all featuring in the book.

Perhaps it would be time to revisit the angel theme, and to release a Space Angels codex for marines, featuring Angel Bolters, Angel Dreads, Angel Speeders, Angel Raiders, Angel Fists and Angel Swords.

Or how about blending every flavour of marine together, so we could have Revered Angel Psydreads, armed with Doomwolf Thunderfists and Angel-Nemesis Megapsycannons. And of course they should have some fitting psionic powers, like Claws of the Dark Blood or Lighting Thunder Hurricane Doom Vortex.

Lord Gabranth
14-03-2011, 16:20
Or how about blending every flavour of marine together, so we could have Revered Angel Psydreads, armed with Doomwolf Thunderfists and Angel-Nemesis Megapsycannons. And of course they should have some fitting psionic powers, like Claws of the Dark Blood or Lighting Thunder Hurricane Doom Vortex.

Wow, just wow

Oakwolf
14-03-2011, 17:02
Or how about blending every flavour of marine together, so we could have Revered Angel Psydreads, armed with Doomwolf Thunderfists and Angel-Nemesis Megapsycannons. And of course they should have some fitting psionic powers, like Claws of the Dark Blood or Lighting Thunder Hurricane Doom Vortex.

lol, Don't give them ideas, they could probably have a random name generator by now.

At least they didn't name digilasers "power fingers"

Castigator
14-03-2011, 17:06
lol, Don't give them ideas, they could probably have a random name generator by now.

At least they didn't name digilasers "power fingers"

Thunderfingers?

Stormdigits?

Wolfpointers?

Bloodpinkys?

Nemesis Doom Thumb?

Gatsby
14-03-2011, 17:07
lol, Don't give them ideas, they could probably have a random name generator by now.

At least they didn't name digilasers "power fingers"

OHHHHH i got a good response for that.... but I'd get banned...

Hint: It involves Sisters of Battle....

Griefbringer
14-03-2011, 17:22
lol, Don't give them ideas, they could probably have a random name generator by now.


Hmmm, perhaps we should write a random name generator for all home codex author. Something like the following tables, roll D6 for each table and then combine the elements together (if necessary, add in "the" or "of" as appropriate to make the name sound appropriate).

Table A
1: Blood
2: Dark
3: Terran
4: Assault
5: Nemesis
6: [leave empty]

Table B
1: Flame
2: Angel
3: Power
4: Space
5: Storm
6: Doom

Table C
1: Priest
2: Hound
3: Cannon
4: Gun
5: Trooper
6: Bolter

So by rolling 3-6-1 and 4-1-3 and 6-5-2, one would generate a Terran Doom Priest, armed with Assault Flamecannon and accompanied by his loyal Stormhound when going to battle.

Of course, by varying the number of elements (2-4 per name), adding more tables and using D20, one could provide more variety to the names - but do you really need that? :evilgrin:

NixonAsADaemonPrince
14-03-2011, 17:29
On the subject of Psymissiles, there was a thread on here a little while ago on guessing the prefix to said missiles. IIRC I guess Psy, so do I get a prize? :D

Or is the prize really the knowledge that I think like Mat Ward :eek:.

Saunders
14-03-2011, 17:32
Or how about blending every flavour of marine together, so we could have Revered Angel Psydreads, armed with Doomwolf Thunderfists and Angel-Nemesis Megapsycannons. And of course they should have some fitting psionic powers, like Claws of the Dark Blood or Lighting Thunder Hurricane Doom Vortex.

Those titles are too cool to NOT use! Fun stuff. :P

I really don't understand all the rage directed at the naming conventions. Sure, it's campy. But we play in a campy universe, and you can either laugh or cry over it (I prefer laughing)

Bunnahabhain
14-03-2011, 17:44
Those titles are too cool to NOT use! Fun stuff. :P

I really don't understand all the rage directed at the naming conventions. Sure, it's campy. But we play in a campy universe, and you can either laugh or cry over it (I prefer laughing)

Willing suspension of disbelief. It's what 40k runs on, and it relies on passable writing. Really bad writing, such as "Mega-psy-doom-fist-cannons of blood" (with milkshake and fries) breaks it.

WildWeasel
14-03-2011, 18:08
Willing suspension of disbelief. It's what 40k runs on, and it relies on passable writing. Really bad writing, such as "Mega-psy-doom-fist-cannons of blood" (with milkshake and fries) breaks it.

Or characters like the Inquisitor Obi-Wan Sherlock Clauseu. Or Tech-magos Williams Gatos.

Radium
14-03-2011, 18:13
Griefbringer: you are my new hero.


Nemesis Doom Thumb?

This is so awesome, it has got to be sigged.

Mannimarco
14-03-2011, 18:21
Hmmm, perhaps we should write a random name generator for all home codex author. Something like the following tables, roll D6 for each table and then combine the elements together (if necessary, add in "the" or "of" as appropriate to make the name sound appropriate).

Table A
1: Blood
2: Dark
3: Terran
4: Assault
5: Nemesis
6: [leave empty]

Table B
1: Flame
2: Angel
3: Power
4: Space
5: Storm
6: Doom

Table C
1: Priest
2: Hound
3: Cannon
4: Gun
5: Trooper
6: Bolter

So by rolling 3-6-1 and 4-1-3 and 6-5-2, one would generate a Terran Doom Priest, armed with Assault Flamecannon and accompanied by his loyal Stormhound when going to battle.

Of course, by varying the number of elements (2-4 per name), adding more tables and using D20, one could provide more variety to the names - but do you really need that? :evilgrin:

Already done. The RoC books had a big multi table list where you would roll (and roll and roll and roll more dice) to make a daemonic true name based on how many syllables were in your gods chosen number so Slaanesh would roll on the table 6 times, Nurlge 7, Khorne 8 and Tzeentch 9.

Each box on the tabble would have 2 letters so by rolling all these dice you would end up with a random assortment of letters to rearrange into your daemons first and second name.

After that there was a much larger table but you only had to roll on it twice to make your daemons "use name". Confusing isnt it but it added a whole new experience to the game and made your daemon unique.

For example rolling on the table you wouldnt have "Bloodthirster", you would have Rhug'guari'ihlulan (true name) but who would be known by mortals as *rolls dice on second table* Doomaxe bloodfeaster!

Griefbringer
14-03-2011, 18:33
Now that you mention, I have one of the original RoC books out there. Fancy meeting Slaaneshi daemon Carnal-sin Buttock-lick, more formally known as Ks'flzrho'eee? (Yes, those are real names from that table.)

Mannimarco
14-03-2011, 18:39
Its even worse when you see all the Gods use that table so its just as likely Buttock-Lick is a GUO or Lord of Change or even a Bloodthirster!

Saunders
14-03-2011, 18:52
Willing suspension of disbelief. It's what 40k runs on, and it relies on passable writing. Really bad writing, such as "Mega-psy-doom-fist-cannons of blood" (with milkshake and fries) breaks it.

Maybe with Doomwolf Thunderfists (pick of the litter there) but I'm not about to sell my Eldar and quit the hobby because there are a few too many "rune"-titled pieces of wargear. I know that's a bit hyperbolic, but I can't help but think that most of the people involved in these many, many pages of threads denouncing the excessive use of "blood," "wolf," and "psy" in equipment prefixes are expecting a little too much from their choice of hobby.

I'm as zealous about 40k fluff as the next guy, but it's an old trend and not nearly worth the amount of ire that some people hold for such things.

Hendarion
14-03-2011, 18:53
Actually that naming-trend seems to be ported everywhere. Even DoW II has it... Singing Spear of Ulthwe, Shuriken Catapult of Alaitoc, Power Sword of Ulthwe, Witch Blade of Alaitoc, Sniper Rifle of Alaitoc and of course the Staff of Ulthwe... meeeeh, I felt treated like a 12-year-old who never before had *any* contact with the Warhammer 40.000 universe. So boring, so bad.

TheMav80
14-03-2011, 18:54
I need a copy of that table in order to create all my RPG character names forever.

Both PC and NPC!

TheMav80
14-03-2011, 18:56
Actually that naming-trend seems to be ported everywhere. Even DoW II has it... Singing Spear of Ulthwe, Shuriken Catapult of Alaitoc, Power Sword of Ulthwe, Witch Blade of Alaitoc, Sniper Rifle of Alaitoc and of course the Staff of Ulthwe... meeeeh, I felt treated like a 12-year-old who never before had *any* contact with the Warhammer 40.000 universe. So boring, so bad.

Yeah, but that game is FOR people who have never had contact with Warhammer 40K. That is sort of the point of the game. It pulls people in.

At least DoW1 did for me.

Saunders
14-03-2011, 19:00
Indeed, it remains identifiable for players of the game who aren't necessarily steeped in the lore of 40k. Such a person might know the name of the craftworlds, and be excited when they pick up a wargear item from their favorite one--seriously though, I've played through the Eldar campaign a few times now in DoW2, and it sounds like you're just looking for a reason to nitpick like the legions of other folks :P (What is wrong with picking up a weapon belonging to a Craftworld?)

Inach
14-03-2011, 19:02
In 1/2 year the Cron dex will have mainly 'Gauss' or sometimes 'Phase' in front of everything.

Lets not hope for: Phase wolves...

Hendarion
14-03-2011, 19:05
(What is wrong with picking up a weapon belonging to a Craftworld?)
Nothing, except that there is not a single higher grade item which is not named after a Craftworld. You know, they could be named after Gods, Heroes, Planets and so many more things.


In 1/2 year the Cron dex will have mainly 'Gauss' or sometimes 'Phase' in front of everything.
You mean like 'Gauss Phasers'? XD

Saunders
14-03-2011, 19:08
Hendarion, have you even played the Eldar campaign for Retribution? If you like, when I get home I can start taking screenshots of the equipment.

What you're saying is not only wrong, it's a gross misrepresentation of the wargear that shows up in the game.

theJ
14-03-2011, 19:28
Ain't gotten to the Eldar campaign yet, but the IG campaign has "Cadian pattern carapace armour" and "Mordian pattern Sniper Rifle". It's not so bad. Although it'd be a lot better if the dude with the Mordian pattern equipment actually looked like he was wearing/carrying Mordian stuff in the game :shifty:

Also keep in mind that those things are just the "low tier" stuff. The "legendary" items are still properly named. These things are just a replacement for the "improved", "advanced", "master-crafted", "relic", and so on that we got back in ye' ol' Blood Raven campaigns.
And really, what would you call 'em? it's not perfect, but it feels more interesting than "bettah' armour +1". Could be improved upon, sure, but it's not bad thinking in and off itself.

Griefbringer
14-03-2011, 19:36
Really bad writing, such as "Mega-psy-doom-fist-cannons of blood" (with milkshake and fries) breaks it.

I would think that some of the over-the-top naming might also have been slightly influenced by 2000AD, which had quite a lot of impact in the early days of 40K. At least Judge Dredd features some quite personally named things every now and then - though usually in a rather tongue-in-cheek manner that might have been a bit missing with the 40K authors lately.

ewar
14-03-2011, 21:28
Lightning Thunder Hurricane Doom Vortex.


I have no idea what it does, but I want one. If I ever invent a vacuum cleaner to challenge Dyson, this is what I'm going to call it.

p.s. agreed with the naming conventions, for some reason it's more prevalent these days. I know it has always been slightly ham-fisted, but maybe just the volume of it now makes it stick in my throat a bit more.

Damien 1427
14-03-2011, 21:37
I think the worst offender is the Psilencer.

He should be beaten with stout sticks for that.

Novrain
14-03-2011, 21:57
The Gatling Psilencer is worse.

ago syb
14-03-2011, 22:09
Nemesis doomfist is pretty rough. I still consider blood fist unforgivable. Its a DCCW, we all knew what that was -_-

J-rock
14-03-2011, 22:35
You might as well say 'power' is the new blood. Power armor, power fist, power sword, power weapon, etc.

But in this case 'power' is being used as an adjective.

Power armour - armour that is powered, i.e. doesn't just rely on the user's strength to move it about.

Power sword - a sword that is powered, i.e. doesn't just rely on the user's strength to cause damage.

At least some non-literal adjective makes sense. For example,

Hellfire missile - evokes the idea of a missile that causes explosions/fire/general burniness.

Some don't make sense. For example,

Bloodstrike missile - always wrong, all the time. (I thought space vampires were supposed to drink blood, not it in it missiles and throw it at people.)

Kjell
14-03-2011, 22:45
I think the worst offender is the Psilencer.

He should be beaten with stout sticks for that.

It doesn't even silence psykers! If it suppressed psychic powers that'd be one thing, but it's just a gun.

dancingcricket
14-03-2011, 22:53
In 1/2 year the Cron dex will have mainly 'Gauss' or sometimes 'Phase' in front of everything.

Lets not hope for: Phase wolves...

Phase wolves? Nah, we go with the insect theme.

Phase Spyder Riders.

HRM
14-03-2011, 23:40
And as mentioned many times before, the "generic" Marines bad-weather schtick with all the Lighting, Storm, Hurricane, Tornado, Whirlwind, Typhoon, etc.. hasn't ever been very subtle either.

LAWL. I never noticed this.

noirceuil
15-03-2011, 06:30
Or characters like the Inquisitor Obi-Wan Sherlock Clauseu. Or Tech-magos Williams Gatos.


LOL. dayam.

ja_warria19@yahoo.com
15-03-2011, 07:38
I don't understand everyone's grief with the word "wolf" in the space wolves codex!

Unlike "blood" being a prefix for everything in the Blood Angles codex for no real reason other than they are "blood" angels, there is a reason wolf precedes claw, or lord or priest. It is because of tribal affiliation with the wolf as an ethereal spiritual being that the fenrisians deify. And the desire to structure societal and military ranking systems after the wolf packs that permeate Fenris environment.
Or it could simply be that the subject in question IS a wolf, or was a part of a wolf. Case and point the wolf tail talisman: IS A WOLF TAIL XD!!! Wolf claws are so named because the iron priests (shocking how there is no wolf in their title ;) ) copied observed attributes of fenrisian wolves and altered the lightning claw to reflect those attributes.

I can understand the frustration with the BA codex as there is no real reason why the blood talons should be named so, or the bloodstrike missle, or the many other bloody items and gear/ psychic powers, they possess/ utilize. Other than the fact that blood angels use them. But even then I think there is proper justification that could be made quite easily to support even THESE names.

Meh I dunno, maybe one of you brilliant people who whine about this could explain to me exactly why it is so ridiculous that a culture that emulates and deifies the wolf, would name some of their wargear after wolfs, wolf parts... or just plain wear parts of wolfs... or possibly, emperor forbid, even RIDE a bus sized one if they managed to subdue it.

Novrain
15-03-2011, 09:59
I think it is the case that it seems as if every little piece of wargear has to have the suffix wolf- in the SW 'dex, blood- in the BA dex etc

Overuse of a term means it quickly becomes a cliche... and that is when it gets annoying.

Bunnahabhain
15-03-2011, 12:53
I don't understand everyone's grief with the word "wolf" in the space wolves codex! .....snip...
Meh I dunno, maybe one of you brilliant people who whine about this could explain to me exactly why it is so ridiculous that a culture that emulates and deifies the wolf, would name some of their wargear after wolfs, wolf parts... or just plain wear parts of wolfs... or possibly, emperor forbid, even RIDE a bus sized one if they managed to subdue it.

Highlighted the relevant word for you.

The issue isn't the presence of Wolf XYZ, it is the presence of Wolf A, Wolf B Wolf C,.... Wolf Q, when it could so easily have been broken up with a few more identifiers, such as
Rune, Frost, Ice, Kraken, Clan, Pack, Hunters...that do for a start?

So wolf claws could have been 'Hunters claws', and a wolf tail talisman could have been a 'pack Talisman'. This means that the Wolf pelt cloak now fits a theme, rather than overloading us with the same one word.

GreenDracoBob
15-03-2011, 16:52
There are some stupid ones, but I think the Grey Knights are not too over the top with the names. Nemesis shows up a lot, but it also indicates special rules common to all Nemesis weapons. Doesn't really explain the Nemesis Dreadknight, but there you go.

ja_warria19@yahoo.com
16-03-2011, 13:38
Highlighted the relevant word for you.


The issue isn't the presence of Wolf XYZ, it is the presence of Wolf A, Wolf B Wolf C,.... Wolf Q, when it could so easily have been broken up with a few more identifiers, such as
Rune, Frost, Ice, Kraken, Clan, Pack, Hunters...that do for a start?

So wolf claws could have been 'Hunters claws', and a wolf tail talisman could have been a 'pack Talisman'. This means that the Wolf pelt cloak now fits a theme, rather than overloading us with the same one word.


I think it is the case that it seems as if every little piece of wargear has to have the suffix wolf- in the SW 'dex, blood- in the BA dex etc

Overuse of a term means it quickly becomes a cliche... and that is when it gets annoying.


You honestly think "hunters claws and "pack talisman" Sound better than wolf claws (named because they look like wolf claws), or wolf tail talisman (named because its a WOLF TAIL)? If thats the case, with all do respect, I dont ever want you writing a codex by yourself. And if we do a comparison with the vanilla dex, I think you can see that the theme names are just as pandemic, everything being named after a storm product. So things like Runic armour, Frost blades, Grey hunters, Bloodclaws, Dreadnought, predator, bolter, stormbolter, cyclone missile launcher etc.. werent enough for you? I could see if they were like wolf frost blade, wolf runic armour, wolf predator. But I challenge you to show any gratuitous unecassary or nonsensical use of the prefix wolf in the codex.

SquigBoy Extraordinaire
16-03-2011, 13:56
Or how about blending every flavour of marine together, so we could have Revered Angel Psydreads, armed with Doomwolf Thunderfists and Angel-Nemesis Megapsycannons. And of course they should have some fitting psionic powers, like Claws of the Dark Blood or Lighting Thunder Hurricane Doom Vortex.

Or just create a special type of Marine called the Chuck Norris, which would include all of the above and a lot more! :p

Bunnahabhain
16-03-2011, 14:02
You honestly think "hunters claws and "pack talisman" Sound better than wolf claws (named because they look like wolf claws), or wolf tail talisman (named because its a WOLF TAIL)? If thats the case, with all do respect, I dont ever want you writing a codex by yourself.

Actually, there is a better option that wolf claws or hunters claws, or Kraken claws... Lightning claws. I don't like the not needed, change for the sake of change, renaming and minor tweak of wolf claws at all.

And does Pack Talisman sound better that wolf tail talisman? No, but it is no worse, and it reduces down the Wolf, wolf, wolf spam.

Memnos
16-03-2011, 14:12
Thank you for a conversion idea.

I am now going to make sure that the Darkspace Cannon that you have helped create now must look bloody brilliant. I'm going to use it for Dark Eldar. Now, I just need to figure out what it'll represent.


Hmmm, perhaps we should write a random name generator for all home codex author. Something like the following tables, roll D6 for each table and then combine the elements together (if necessary, add in "the" or "of" as appropriate to make the name sound appropriate).

Table A
1: Blood
2: Dark
3: Terran
4: Assault
5: Nemesis
6: [leave empty]

Table B
1: Flame
2: Angel
3: Power
4: Space
5: Storm
6: Doom

Table C
1: Priest
2: Hound
3: Cannon
4: Gun
5: Trooper
6: Bolter

So by rolling 3-6-1 and 4-1-3 and 6-5-2, one would generate a Terran Doom Priest, armed with Assault Flamecannon and accompanied by his loyal Stormhound when going to battle.

Of course, by varying the number of elements (2-4 per name), adding more tables and using D20, one could provide more variety to the names - but do you really need that? :evilgrin:

Havock
16-03-2011, 14:54
For example rolling on the table you wouldnt have "Bloodthirster", you would have Rhug'guari'ihlulan (true name) but who would be known by mortals as *rolls dice on second table* Doomaxe bloodfeaster!

And for Slaanesh it would be Boobass Cockteaser!