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Tonberry
16-03-2011, 13:28
My regular opponent uses Queek in every game we play, and I would like advice on how to grind said annoying rat into the dust.

Queek is especially annoying vs. chaos with his boosts in challenges and my being forced to issue/accept challenges, and I just can't seem to kill him. Granted overall my chaos usually come out on top but Queek always rolls straight through whatver he comes up against (along with his uber stormvermin unit).

Army lists are something like this (1500 pts)

Chaos

Sorcer lord, lv 4, 4+ wardsave talisman, MoT

Chaos hero on juggerhorse, BSB, Collar of Khorne

15 Warriors, HW+shield, MoT, full command

15 Warriors, Extra HW, MoK, full command

10 Marauders, shields

5 Knights, MoK, full command


Skaven

Queek

Hero wizard lv.2 with lightning generator that zaps stuff

40 rats with hw+shield

20 rats with spears

20 upgraded Queekvermin

Flamethrower thing

Mortar thing

Doomflayer

The big lightning wheely thing

Plague catapult

Assassin guy


General order of battle is my guys march forwards as fast as possibly with hopefully enough not getting shot to bits to trample all over his rats, while he shoots as much as possible then watches as my guys stomp the rats.

Queek however, butchers whatver he fights, especially when he's in the big stormvermin block. Because I have to challenge, Queek will butcher the unit champion 5 times over, and then my guys run away.

Any ideas?

I know my unit selections aren't optimal but it's all the models I have atm.

Kevlar
16-03-2011, 14:16
He has no ward save and is toughness 4. Any high str attack will negate his armor save and wound him easily. Do that x3.

Even a chaos hero should easily dispatch him. Taking a chaos lord would be beyond easy.

Queek vermin are ok, but no match for chaos warriors. Especially hw&s tzeench warriors.

I honestly can't believe a chaos player could ever have close combat problems with skaven.

Havock
16-03-2011, 14:35
To answer the question, what does queek do? And his relevant stats/equipment

Tonberry
16-03-2011, 14:46
He has no ward save and is toughness 4. Any high str attack will negate his armor save and wound him easily. Do that x3.

Even a chaos hero should easily dispatch him. Taking a chaos lord would be beyond easy.

Queek vermin are ok, but no match for chaos warriors. Especially hw&s tzeench warriors.

I honestly can't believe a chaos player could ever have close combat problems with skaven.

Queek butchers chaos characters in combat combat most of the time though, as I'm forced to challenge, Queek strikes first with his crazy Initiative, and gets bonuses to hit and wound in challenges and ignores armour. I could tool up a chaos lord to take him out, but at about double Queeks point costs so that kinda seems futile.

Nate668
16-03-2011, 14:51
I don't think you can post stats and such, but basically he's a warlord with lots of attacks, gets +1 to hit and +1 to wound in challenges, ignores armor, has a 2+ save, and has to issue a challenge whenever possible. Seems to me that if you send a chaos lord his way you shouldn't have much of a problem. Or take death magic and snipe him since he doesn't have a ward save.

Leth Shyish'phak
16-03-2011, 14:59
Isn't Queek I7? Take a Chaos Lord with the Helm of Many Eyes and some sort of weapon and you'll struggle to not kill him. Even if he's I8, you still strike first hitting on a 3+ with at least 5 attacks, if you take a 4/3+ ward save you should be fine.

Havock
16-03-2011, 15:02
I don't think you can post stats and such, but basically he's a warlord with lots of attacks, gets +1 to hit and +1 to wound in challenges, ignores armor, has a 2+ save, and has to issue a challenge whenever possible. Seems to me that if you send a chaos lord his way you shouldn't have much of a problem. Or take death magic and snipe him since he doesn't have a ward save.

This says enough.

Take a bleeding good wardsave then. I have a BSB with a halberd and a 3+ wardsave, he would gut the little rat.

russellmoo
17-03-2011, 21:23
Try a chaos lord with the following- sword of swift slaying, potion of speed, talisman of preservation

Also good, glittering scales armor, talisman of pres., great weapon- even better- chaos lord, mark of nurgle (I believe this makes it -1 to hit you, glittering scales armor, great weapon)

You could also try gold sigil sword, tali of pres, and a healing potion

You get the idea, make it hard for queek to hit you or make sure you hit him first- and take a good ward save- the problem you are having is that Queek is too good for his points- and I don't think a hero can take him- he is the one skaven that fights well enough that he deserves Lord attention-

Havock
18-03-2011, 15:59
Fairly sure a halberd hero with a 3+ ward can paste him just fine. Assuming you do not botch your rolls.

Dante blackfur
18-03-2011, 16:09
but another problem is Queeks got a decent armor SV, and if he manages to block an attack, the attacker gets a S5 hit back for EACH wound saved. :p`

Havock
18-03-2011, 16:15
2+ becomes 5+ versus S6.

Then again that trick only works once, next time the skaven player will just wait until your challenge then either put queek on the unit champion or his champion versus your hero :)

macdaddy
18-03-2011, 19:03
according to his rules, queek must also accept any challenge, so you cannot send a champion against a chaos challenge.so an exalted champ with mark of tzeentch, talisman of preserv., halberd, and the word of agony gift will kill him every time. well maybe not every time but ...

Havock
18-03-2011, 19:57
Exalted cannot take word of agony. If the skaven player is unable to feed the exalted a champion then it is better.

Eta
18-03-2011, 20:20
2+ becomes 5+ versus S6.

Then again that trick only works once, next time the skaven player will just wait until your challenge then either put queek on the unit champion or his champion versus your hero :)

Queek only has a 3+ save according to my book. So he's even easier to dispatch.

An Exalted Hero of Tzeentch with shield, Talisman of Preservation and the Biting Blade should do the job. Or with a less allround build (you'd strike last against him anyway with an exalted), just take a greatweapon and the Talisman of preservation - Queek hasn't got an armour save vs that.

Gen.RifulasDykes
18-03-2011, 21:55
I'd personally go defensive and take the Chaos Runeshield + Tailsman of Pres. Runeshield negates Queek's magic weapon which is what allows him to ignore armour saves so after that he's simply a S4 rat with lots of attacks. :p Might take abit longer to kill him than if you tailored yourself to go super offensive but it'll save you if you fluff up your dice and he gets to strike back.

stashman
19-03-2011, 01:30
First trick: Get some new models :D

Get Wulfric (WS8, I7 and +2S and reroll vs. nominated opponent - Queek)

Get a unit of "cheap" Marauders with Greatweapon and mark of Khorne and NO CHAMP! Put them in horde formation and put all 12 S5 attacks on Queek. 40 Marauders with GW costs 230 pts, thats the same as Queek, if you put him to rest, you got the job done! ;)

6 Chaos Trolls and make vomit attacks on Queek!

And the expensive Queek Killer: Chaos Lord with Obsidian Blade, Tricksters Helm, Word of Agony, Shield and Mark of Khorne (6 WS8 S5 hits no save and d6 S4 no save with a 2+ armoursave and Queek rerolls to wound). Ok, its only 375 pts, but in a BIG unit of Marauders they will kick rat-butt! :cool:

Rake
21-03-2011, 14:53
Chaos runeshield + chaos mount + shield = 2+ save vs queek. or Tzeentch plus Talisman of Preservation = 3+ ward. or lore of death vs skaven = awesome...
it should not be hard for you to kill the rat.