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terradax
25-03-2011, 20:25
I'm currently writing an armylist (just for fun) for a traitor guard army. If I like the results, I might consider building the army :)

Ok, so the theme is traitor guard, and consists of a Primaris Psyker as HQ, about 4 squads of Penal Legions as Troops, each joined by a Priest with eviscerator, 2 Psyker battle squads in a chimera each, and topping it of with as many Leman russ battle tanks as I can fit in the list. In a 1500pts I think I can squeeze in 2-3 LR tanks.

So, what do you think of an army like this? I'm not playing in tournaments, mostly with friends. Can this list win any game?

Next question: How should I convert the traitor guard? I was thinking of using the Renegades from Forge World, that will be a simple sollution, but an expensive one. I was thinking of going with Cadians, smoothing down their helmets and adding a spike on top.

And what am I supposed to use for a Psyker battle squad...?

Suggestions, tips and criticism is welcome!

Navar
25-03-2011, 20:26
If you want some great inspiration/list help with traitor guard look at the IA books 5, 6 and 7 IIRC. They all have unique traitor guard lists (well flavors of the same list.)

Mannimarco
25-03-2011, 20:53
If you want some great inspiration/list help with traitor guard look at the IA books 5, 6 and 7 IIRC. They all have unique traitor guard lists (well flavors of the same list.)

Beat me to it.

If you are interested in running a traitor guard list you really should look at them, IA5 list is free to download from the FW site and the other 2 should be up before to long.

Be prepared to hear a lot of "Oh you play traitor guard? why not try Straken the CSM or a MechVet blood pact list" which is not to be confused with "oh you play imperial guard? try the MechVet list, its the best!" or the slightly less common "oh you play a genestealer cult? try Straken and a swarm of guardsmen or maybe a MechVet list to represent them stealing PDF supplies"

shadowhawk2008
25-03-2011, 21:14
IA9 also has a Tyrant's Legion list that you can use for the same. It also includes options for space marine units you could put in later down the line to represent some Chaos Space Marines who have joined up with you. IIRC there is also a PDF-ish type special character in there.

Col. von Dryden
25-03-2011, 21:17
First: GET RID OF/DEFACE ANY AND ALL AQUILAS! This is the first commandment of chaos it seems. Shaving the helmets down works to give you a "variant" helmet, but is time consuming and a pain.
Look into maxmini/westwind/ect... for some diffrent heads. The tox-guardsman, traitor ones from maxmini turn out good.

terradax
25-03-2011, 21:39
Thanks for the advice! First off, the traitor guard list is much like the old IG codex, making it less attractive than using the current one. Aquillas will be removed, thanks for that. I don't mind time consuming since I won't have a large army (to begin with). I'm actually thinking shaving down helmets and adding a faceplate (NOT bloodpact, but more like a knight-like helmet) made of grren stuff and/or plasticard. I'm trying to avoid renegade inspiration and bloodpact since I want to make an unique army with lots of home made fiction. The only problem remaining is the psyker battle squad... I am thinking of something like Pater Sin (http://davetaylorminiatures.blogspot.com/search/label/Pater%20Sin) from the Gaunt's Ghosts books. I like the idea of having a powerful psyker that acts as a focal point for a bunch of psychic slaves.

shadowhawk2008
25-03-2011, 21:55
You don't have to deface the aquilas at all. :) Simply paint them in the made chaotic colour scheme of your army. Sort of like the Lost and the Damned version of the Alpha Legion :D

Achaylus72
26-03-2011, 00:31
Or butcher the Aquilla's to show contempt like they have tried to hack off the Aquilla's.

For a Psycher Battle Squad, just use a normal Imperial Guard Overseer and 4-9 Sanctioned Psychers. As normal rules and points apply but they are considered Chaos.

As mentioned previously you can use whatever is in any Space Marine and Imperial Guard Codex Inventory for Chaos.

FashaTheDog
26-03-2011, 01:19
Actually, I run Servants of Slaughter all the time and love it more than the regular Codex. Renegades and Heretics are fun too, but Servants of Decay are my number two choice. The Renegades and Heretics list has been updated to be closer to the new Codex, so if that is your hang up, there is a solution to be downloaded. I encourage you to give those lists a try, Khornate Guardsmen (be sure to identify your unit as the Red Rivers) are epic win smothered in awesome sauce. Twenty Beastmen with a packmaster are a cheap and wonderfully disposable unit that you can get results out of, but if not you only lost 126 points, whoop-de-doo. The artillery barrages are wonderfully fun, call them down with your vox and enjoy the fireworks; it's like the Tom Lehrer song, "once zee rockets are up, who cares where zey come down, that's not my department, says Werner von Braun." Sure you will find the bombard strike falling on your own lines if you take three of them, but chances are the enemy will be there too, so all in all, a net gain. Then there is the option of adding in a few Alpha Legion/Khorne Berserkers/Plague Marines depending upon you flavor of heresy. A single unit of these guys with a Dreadclaw or Rhino can really fix that hole in the line when they're needed most and Militia's random leadership is actually quite fun. My command squads are always leadership 5, maybe 6 if they get lucky, but the squads under them are quite often 9 or 10. The Ogryns are also far more fun than their Codex counter parts, and Hounds of Xaphan are a hoot. So once more I implore you to give them a try before you pass on them, Forgeworld did a wonderful job with these lists, even with the codex creep.

If you insist on remaining Codex, then I recommend adding in Witch Hunter allies. Before the Heresy Meter starts its high speed spin, hear me out on this. You can pair up the Psyker Battle squads with a Culexus modeled as a Daemon while the Inquisitor Lord is just a favored psyker or mortal Chaos champion with his sycophantic retinue. You could even use the Sisters of Battle as those blessed by Chaos mutations of an iron hide and powerful warp fire occasionally capable of manifesting psychic powers. I have also been converting up some Sisters of Slaanesh who are my Noise Marines (took the Noise Marine weapons and put them on Sisters of Battle heavy weapons models and puttied the sloppy parts), but one day I hope to be able to run a stand alone army of them. Best part is that when you tell people you have Chaos Sisters of Battle, someone always screams out "that's extra heretical!"

Mannimarco
26-03-2011, 01:30
Problem is he wants to go psyker/priest heavy and as great as the FW lists are for representing a traitor guard/LATD type army you cant go psyker heavy with them.

The models are nice enough but the rules are garbage, at least theyre cheap.

FashaTheDog
26-03-2011, 01:36
I was just entreating him to give them a shot and not write them off so quickly since I do quite well with them much to the surprise of some people who figure that since they are based off the old rules they are auto-lose. Because I figured my words probably would not sway him, especially if he really wanted to push the psyker theme I made the suggestion of the second paragraph.

Mannimarco
26-03-2011, 02:14
Thats cool, personally I play with the Servants of Decay list which is IMHO the strongest of the 3, also helps that Im a major Nurgle fanatic.

That using SoB allies is a really good idea, Ive seen many a LATD army using that combo.

Pacific
26-03-2011, 05:14
Beat me to it.

If you are interested in running a traitor guard list you really should look at them, IA5 list is free to download from the FW site and the other 2 should be up before to long.

Be prepared to hear a lot of "Oh you play traitor guard? why not try Straken the CSM or a MechVet blood pact list" which is not to be confused with "oh you play imperial guard? try the MechVet list, its the best!" or the slightly less common "oh you play a genestealer cult? try Straken and a swarm of guardsmen or maybe a MechVet list to represent them stealing PDF supplies"

Haha thanks for that, really made me laugh :p

+1 on the FW books, one of GW's best kept secrets, and the answer to so many prayers if people only knew they existed.

ShodansOwn
26-03-2011, 09:32
I'm playing as Tormentors, all stock IG. Virtually every squad that can take a Commissar has one. The twist is that every Commissar is represented by a Daemonette model. Utter domination over the squads, killing those who resist. I'm also running Seekers of Slaanesh as Roughriders.

The idea is that they're more permanently hypnotized, rather than properly traitor, so they believe they are still fighting for the Imperium. They look pretty much like normal Cadians, with a paint scheme that compliments the Daemonette paintjobs. The fact that they still wear the Aquila and the uniform is a deliberate insult by the leading Daemonette towards the Imperium.

I even have a standard bearer hoisting one of the Slaanesh banners:evilgrin:

So anyways, my point is that you can find a fluffy way to explain why your army looks the way it does no matter what that is. You might consider Catachan bodies with alternate heads...without those heads, they dont really look too jungle-y. Any IG model with an alternate head is a quick and easy mod, which changes the appearance quite a bit.



And what am I supposed to use for a Psyker battle squad...?


I suggest these guys (http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod10006&rootCatGameStyle=). I got a few sprues in a random bulk deal, and they look great, especially if you swap out a few parts and make them more imperial looking.

Ulrig
26-03-2011, 09:41
Servants of Decay here.
Will be playing IA7 with heavy on the zombies
and will be playing it as IG with heavy on the mech

AlphariusOmegon20
27-03-2011, 17:01
LOL I did it the easy way. I use the Traitor 9th, which is there is little info on them, so I assumed they were from Cadia, because the name almost sounds Cadian to me!

I shaved off every eagle off of every model to start (which was a LOT of eagles), and replaced all of their flags with Chaos Glory Icons (I did use the regimental flag as just that, but used a small backpack spike from the Chaos marine kit to "chaos-ify" it), and used as many Chaos special weapons as I could to "chaos-ify" them (obviously I couldn't do that with the grenade launchers, but every plasma, melta and flamer has been converted to use it's counterpart from the Chaos Marine box.) Vehicles got the "Chaos Star" treatment thanks to all the ones that come in each chaos vehicle box.

I then painted them in the normal Cadian green and beige scheme and Tanks got the normal green armor treatment

Voila! Traitor Guard.

Easy peasy.

I just use the normal IG codex, as I run an undivided traitor guard. I really don't need special rules for my army.

blooddragon
27-03-2011, 18:12
Special weapons team with demolition charge = suicide bombers

Ogryns = psychic abominations (converted from spawn; shooting warp lightning as the ripper gun)

HUGE blob squad of conscripts led by a primaris psyker = plague zombies.

There's no reason why penal legion should represent your basic troops - make them Hive Militia, Mutants or Khorne-obsessed renegades.

Standard infantry platoon with autocannons and grenade launchers looks like trench warfare.

Rough riders = daemonic steeds

All banners/regimental banners are Chaos Icons or broken/burning Aquilas.

Psyker battle squad - cultist choir. Deploy them in a circle and imagine that they're busy summoning daemons.


Hellhounds are a must. Very thematic for traitors I think.

Sentinels could be heavy-duty mechanised lifter-loaders from a forgeworld. Take your cues from the dreadknight, but smaller. Just don't scout them (not very fluffy).


You could use Marbo's rules to represent a daemon summoned by your primaris psyker/cultists (psyker battle squad)

CushionRide
27-03-2011, 19:01
i revamped the whole traitor guard list, basicly my traitor guard comes from the current imp guard codex i just added some of the things that were in the IA books, im going nurgle. so im adding to my elites plague marines, plague ogryn, for fast attack i added chaos spawns, zombie hoards as troops, renamed some of the normal stuff, like disciples of xaphan were easy conversions to veteran guard squads.

madprophet
27-03-2011, 20:35
You can make a decent traitor guard army with the current codex - use lots of psykers but no commissars (they would have been killed when the unit turned traitor). Ogryns are good choices (big mutants).

For veterans, I used beastmen as the basis of my conversions (big, strong, hairy mutants)

I also used my old warzone figures to represent the traitor troopers (makes them look different from my regular IG guys, and mixing the Imperial and Bauhaus figures gives them that "we just looted the local armory" look)

I went light on the heavy weapons (a few mortar teams but that's it) since the more powerful weapons would have been unavailable without adeptus mechanicus support (of course, you can always add them - I have lots of Cadian bits if I chose to upgrade a few guys)

Using a primaris psyker as the general or as a 2nd HQ choice seems fluffy for me.

If you can get your opponent's permission to include some of the units from the IA list, go for it, but twisting the current codex means you can even take your traitors to tournament if you wish :D

AlphariusOmegon20
28-03-2011, 03:36
You can make a decent traitor guard army with the current codex - use lots of psykers but no commissars (they would have been killed when the unit turned traitor). Ogryns are good choices (big mutants).



See, I didn't think I could justify any Ogryns in a Cadian Army, as I tend to associate them more with Catachans than I do Cadians, so they seemed a bit out of place in my force.

But I did go with 0 Commissars. I avoided the Pysker as my force commander as being Cadians, I think even though they are now Chaos, they would still hold onto some form of regimental chain of command (It tends to be bred into them from day one.) I do have a pysker, but he's just not my overall force commander.

TimLeeson
28-03-2011, 03:50
If you want to make your traitor-guard unique, I'd suggest considering going with Tzeentch or Slaanesh since most Traitor-guard seem to always be either khorne or nurgle.

madprophet
28-03-2011, 03:53
See, I didn't think I could justify any Ogryns in a Cadian Army, as I tend to associate them more with Catachans than I do Cadians, so they seemed a bit out of place in my force.

But I did go with 0 Commissars. I avoided the Pysker as my force commander as being Cadians, I think even though they are now Chaos, they would still hold onto some form of regimental chain of command (It tends to be bred into them from day one.) I do have a pysker, but he's just not my overall force commander.

If it works for you, then it its all good! :D I was just talking in general.

That's what I like about the current codex, it's very flexible - you can do pretty much what you want with it.

herostoaces
28-03-2011, 04:01
Could Goblin's be traitor guard?

DuskRaider
28-03-2011, 05:44
I've played all three Vraks forces, however being partial to Nurgle (and Death Guard) I prefer IA7. I usually field a list with Necrosius as the HQ, two squads of 10 Plague Marines, a squad of 3 Plague Ogryn, and then the rest being Plague Zombies. Not very competitive, but it's a lot of fun nonetheless.

terradax
28-03-2011, 06:04
Thanks for all the helpful advice (especially Blooddragon, I found your post very intresting). I will have to stay with GW bits ONLY(so no pig Iron heads or warzone figures for me :( ). Alpharius: Using Chaos SM special weapons is a simple, nice touch, good thinking! :)
And Madprophet, I might use Commisars, but under another name. Since renegades have Enforcers I might have punishers or motivators ;) . My Guard won't be as much Traitor Guard as they will be Chaos Guard. So it won't be a Guard army turned traitor, but more of a founded chaos guard.

Mr Feral
28-03-2011, 10:54
Ah, so you would prefer the Chaos human warband approach then?

Have you read anything up on the Blood Pact? They are described as a Chaos Warrior-Cult which might be more up your street.

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Blood_Pact

That might give you some ideas. :)

AlphariusOmegon20
28-03-2011, 16:04
Thanks for all the helpful advice (especially Blooddragon, I found your post very intresting). I will have to stay with GW bits ONLY(so no pig Iron heads or warzone figures for me :( ). Alpharius: Using Chaos SM special weapons is a simple, nice touch, good thinking! :)


Thank you for the compliment.

A piece of advice though. I found it was easier to "half" the weapons in question, as the back half of the receiver looks the same on both weapons.

I cut right at the back edge of the plasma/melta coil on both weapons and then pinned the chaos front to the guardsman back receiver. It works the same for flamers too. If you get a really good even join between the two halves, you almost can't tell it wasn't scuplted that way to begin with.

CushionRide
31-03-2011, 03:48
one of the things i kept in my traitor guard ..... "dex" was the rogue psykers. i felt that the normal imperial psyker squads were just a bit to beefy, however cool they happen to be. the rogue psykers for me just added a bit more flavor to my army. i also updated alot of my "dex" with more current rules as they come, for example, the plague zombies make an apearance in apocolypse. so im using those rules for them now. im at a toss up with them as i posted in other threads, but im starting to like the apoc versions better.

in one game i basicly started with my 2 units of vets with thier transports empty, i had the zombies board the transports (i had 2 units of 12) and i would run the chimeras around the board untill they blew up, after that the zombies would poar out and attack any infantry that was near, i was lucky enough to get them close to a unit of eldar guardians and tied them up for 3 turns, as i was rolling uncharacteristicly well for the will be back rolls that they get. not to mention i actually killed a bit of guardians also. lolz

so ive been finding interesting ways to play this army, and its been alot of fun for both me and my opponents.

madprophet
31-03-2011, 03:54
And Madprophet, I might use Commisars, but under another name. Since renegades have Enforcers I might have punishers or motivators ;) . My Guard won't be as much Traitor Guard as they will be Chaos Guard. So it won't be a Guard army turned traitor, but more of a founded chaos guard.

Oh, okay - sort of like the Sons of Sek. Neat idea! Then yes, commissars as Chaos enforcers or lay priests of the Chaos gods makes sense. I would still go with lots of psykers unless you are doing a Khornate force which would make them unfluffy.

Are you intending this for tournament play or friendly play or both?