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snake-eyez
15-05-2011, 14:17
Hey, just wondering what people think of Heavy weapons teams with lascannons vs the Vendetta.

For 105 points, you get 3 models, each with a lascannon and 2 wounds with just a 5+ save and toughness 3. Not very resiliant

For 120 points, you get a fast transport which has 3 twin linked lascannons, though not fantastic armour.

Obviously its easier to find cover for your lascannon teams, but if they move they cant shoot. Against certain targets, you can give them the order to have their shots twin linked, but that relies on a company commander using an order.

Overall I'm asking, would you bother with heavy weapons teams rather then just using Vendettas if it wasnt for the high money cost of buying the Vendetta?

Zanzibarthefirst
15-05-2011, 14:22
Vendettas are one of THE best units in the 40k universe simple as. gW should have left the flyers as they were previpusly. av11 was fine for flyers and 3 TL lascannons for its pointcost doesnt make sense especially whilst keeping its transport ability. Few units natch the Vendetta in anti tank. Just compare it to a Ravager, another great tank killer and the Vendetta surpasses it in justabout every single category.

NixonAsADaemonPrince
15-05-2011, 14:24
Vendetta every time. You'd be surprised how resilient vehicles are, the Vendetta work out about the same against Missile Launchers and their like compared to Heavy Weapon teams. It's also can move and fire, has a transport capacity and has better damage output.

keatsmeister
15-05-2011, 16:05
Even if your Vendetta doesn't rack up many kill shots, I've seen players throw huge amounts of firepower at it, purely because of what they know it might do. Pack a pair of them into your force, and you can really create some conundrums for your opponent in their shooting phase. The fact that they also offer grav-chute insertment for a transported unit, even when the Vendetta is flat-out is just the cherry on top

Ville
15-05-2011, 18:05
Hey, just wondering what people think of Heavy weapons teams with lascannons vs the Vendetta.

For 105 points, you get 3 models, each with a lascannon and 2 wounds with just a 5+ save and toughness 3. Not very resiliant

For 120 points, you get a fast transport which has 3 twin linked lascannons, though not fantastic armour.

Obviously its easier to find cover for your lascannon teams, but if they move they cant shoot. Against certain targets, you can give them the order to have their shots twin linked, but that relies on a company commander using an order.

Overall I'm asking, would you bother with heavy weapons teams rather then just using Vendettas if it wasnt for the high money cost of buying the Vendetta?

Vendetta is 130 points, by the way.

I actually like to use both several Lascannon teams and a Vendetta in my lists. Teams are simple to plonk into cover and yell BID and FOMT at them. LD 7 means that about half the time they are wondering why on earth that Daemon Prince is so important to kill:wtf:, unless there's a Commie Lord nearby.

Vendetta seems better on paper, but it's a big, cumbersome model that is almost impossible to hide. If using a lot of terrain, it is also quite easy to immobilise it because of terrain tests. But yes, it is great for its points.

Hmm, taking Lascannon teams frees those FA slots for more Sentinels and Rough Riders. They might be just as useful as those pretty birds.

Grimtuff
15-05-2011, 18:14
Thing is, there's no contest here, HWT are just rubbish compared to Vendettas, mainly as they turned them into a single 2 wound model.

There's a simple fix to make HWT better, give them the USR's Eternal Warrior and Vunerable to Blasts. Both easily represent the fact it's 2 seperate guys.

NixonAsADaemonPrince
15-05-2011, 18:23
There's a simple fix to make HWT better, give them the USR's Eternal Warrior and Vunerable to Blasts. Both easily represent the fact it's 2 seperate guys.

Don't use such common sene thinking in relation to GW, that won't get you anywhere. ;)

Maarten K
15-05-2011, 19:39
Thing is, there's no contest here, HWT are just rubbish compared to Vendettas, mainly as they turned them into a single 2 wound model.

There's a simple fix to make HWT better, give them the USR's Eternal Warrior and Vunerable to Blasts. Both easily represent the fact it's 2 seperate guys.

There is an even simpler fix: make them two separate models again, just like they were since 2nd edition.

keatsmeister
15-05-2011, 20:25
There is an even simpler fix: make them two separate models again, just like they were since 2nd edition.

Works fine for me. I do miss the days of 2nd edition, being able to split the heavy weapons teams from the infantry squads. As Marines etc have access to Combat Squads again, it wouldn't be hard to reinstate it. Perhaps make the Heavy Weapons platoons specialists with perhaps an additional skill or perk to prevent them being redundant, but I'd be happy to give it another go.

Anyway, to get back to the OP, I love my Vendettas, but I do use HW platoons quite a lot as well. Points wise, sure a Vendetta is a bargain tank-hunter, but I've had great success fielding a platoon decked out solely with missile launchers. They haven't got the punch of the lascannon, but when things haven't quite gone to plan for me, having the option of throwing some frag missiles into the mix has proved to be a game winner, or even help put a respectable face on what would otherwise be a crushing loss. For me, the main differences that inform my decision on which to field are two-fold.

One - do I need to aggressively hunt units, or do I need to draw units in?

Two - am I likely to need to ignore terrain at the risk of LOS?

If I need to go on the offensive, I bring the Vendettas. Skimming over the rooflines, trying to get the best angle on my targets. If I need to either let my opponent come to me, or even make him/her think twice about moving into a particular area in my LOS, then I'll bring the HW Platoon. For cityfights, I tend to use the Vendettas, largely as trying to get LOS with the HW Platoons is going to be a long and torturous process against most of my opponents, who will use the cover wisely. The Vendetta can at least use it's skimming ability to hunt down the units I want to snipe at, thought that does bear its own risks

Karlosovic
16-05-2011, 07:49
There is an even simpler fix: make them two separate models again, just like they were since 2nd edition.Na they'll have to leave it as a single model for a few editions until they're sure everyone has bought 60mm bases... then they can go back to single models so they can resel everyone their 2x25mm bases again