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Zeroth
18-06-2011, 23:39
Hello guys

I've just recently started with fantasy and bought an army in one go, the following list is what models I have, put into the army which I've played a few games with.

It's a bit odd request, but I was hoping for more tactical advice rather than what to add/remove/buy, because I won't be buying more models in the near future.

Anyway here is the list

LORD

Bloodthirster
-Collar of Khorne
-Armour of Khorne
-Immortal fury
-Spell Breaker

HEROES

Herald of Khorne
-Battle Standard Bearer
(Standard of Chaos Glory)
-Armour of Khorne


Herald of Tzeentch
-Master of Sorcery
-Spell Breaker

Herald of Khorne
-Armour of Khorne
-Juggernaut of Khorne
-Soul Hunger


CORE

50 Bloodletters
-Musician
-Champion
-Standard Bearer
-Icon of Endless War

SPECIAL

3 Screamers of Tzeentch

RARE

5 Bloodcrushers of Khorne
-Musician
-Bloodreaper
-Standard Bearer

3 Flamers of Tzeentch
-Pyrocaster

3 Flamers of Tzeentch

The idea is to put all my eggs in one basket. The BSB with the huge unit of Bloodletters and one herald with the Bloodcrushers. The Bloodthirster can in many cases fight for himself, but if not he'll support my two units. The flamers thin down my opponent with shooting.

Now anyone got any suggestions on what lore? So for I've been playing with Lore of Life, because it got some clear choices that aren't so hard for a newbie to pick. The idea is that he also joins the bloodletters, or maybe stay behind the unit if my enemy have no way to snipe him.

So any experienced fantasy players that are on both side of the fence when it comes to Daemons that can give me a few tips & tricks? What are my weaknessess, how can I minimize them?

dragonet111
19-06-2011, 07:19
Well first thing you are above the 25% of rare choices in 2500 points. You have to drop one unit of flamers is you want to field the bloodcrushers with your herald of khorne.
Another thing I think the Banner of Unholy Victory or the Great Icon of Despair are simply better than the Standard of Chaos Glory IMO.



Finally I know you said you are not going to buy anything but your herald of Tzeentch is very vulnerable. Give him Winged Horror to flee any danger or if it was a classic army list thread :) I would say drop the screamers and use the points of the unit of flamers that bring you over the 25% of rare and give some horrors to the herald.

Concerning the Lore question Life or Shadow are good. Beast can be funny too.

thesheriff
19-06-2011, 09:33
He's not over rare. Two units of flamers = 210. Bloodcrusher = 400. He gets 625 to spend.

Now, I am going to suggest some drops;

*Drop the pyrocaster.
*Give the bloodthirster; obsidian armour, firestorm blade, infernal fury.
*Give the khorne herald; armour of khorne, firestorm blade, juggernaught.
*Give the BSB khorne herald; great icon of despair, Daemonic robes, armour of khorne.

Lore of life is great. T7 regen bloodletters? yes please! Dwellers is also arguably the best spell in the game.

Again, if this was a traditional list thread, I'd say drop the screamers and 10 bloodletters and grab some horrors for the herald as bodyguard.

thesheriff

Zeroth
19-06-2011, 11:31
Thanks a lot for the feedback.

As you probably noticed I've maxed up on points, that's mostly so I'll be able to get to 2500 at all :p

The screamers are there because I have the points, and sometimes they've performed really well by killing units that are suppose to harass, like those annoying high elf eagles etc.

The reason I went for that banner is because I've never tried it before and I got one or two fights where my bloodletters actually lost combat badly first turn and then kept on going because of their numbers. Most of my casualties was because of combat resolution. Figured a 12" stubborn bubble would be neat, my 'Crushers and 'Thirster could also benefit from that.

But I'll take your advice and try the despair one instead, thanks ;)

Now changing to firestorm blade is a hard one for me, in our meta game over half of the players take some kind of magic item, I really don't know which, that gives a 2+ save against anything that is flaming. Now that's a tough nut for the Bloodthirster to break.

I remember attacking some hero and with a smile my opponent says "You probably have a flaming sword don't you? ;)" and he told me how much fun that little cheap item can be.

Besides isn't a reroll to wound argueably very similar to 1+ strength?

Now daemonic robes is interesting choice, I've been thinking a lot about that one. I suppose my BSB does have a weak spot in only having two wounds and a low toughness. Is this gadget generally worth it? I'll try that out too :D

The pyrocaster is there just to max points out. Can drop him if the points go elsewhere.

I have to repeat myself when it comes to removing or adding models. Keep the feedback coming, it's great because I know what changes to make, when they are to be made. But as it's not in the first coming months they are not as helpful as other advice.

About the Tzeeentch herald, isn't he fairly safe in the big unit of letters? Most of my army will be near that block so he can cast augment spells on nearly all my units, besides dwellers do require him to be pretty close by.
Removing a scroll for some wings is also a tough choice for me, the fact that daemons can have two scrolls is almost too awesome.

I've heard good things about Lore of Metal, any thoughts on that? Enchanted Blades of Aiban on bloodletters, hello hitting on 2+ :D
Not to mention giving bloodletters an armour save wouldn't be too bad?

Or what about fire, after the FAQ it can do nasty things for my bloodletters. Flaming Sword of Rhuin and they now hit (mostly) on 3+ with a reroll and wound automatically:eek:

Does regeneration do anything on bloodletters though? They already have a 5+ ward save, does it stack?

thesheriff
19-06-2011, 11:50
You can't put the tzeentch herald in a Bloodletter unit.

I wouldn't go with lore of fire. You are plenty offensive. You need to add to your durability. Flesh to stone is great for this.

RMacDeezy
19-06-2011, 12:02
But I'll take your advice and try the despair one instead, thanks ;)

Now changing to firestorm blade is a hard one for me, in our meta game over half of the players take some kind of magic item, I really don't know which, that gives a 2+ save against anything that is flaming. Now that's a tough nut for the Bloodthirster to break.

I remember attacking some hero and with a smile my opponent says "You probably have a flaming sword don't you? ;)" and he told me how much fun that little cheap item can be.

Besides isn't a reroll to wound argueably very similar to 1+ strength?
the firestorm blade is generally a good buy on the herald but if your group has less things with regeneration and more flaming wards, leave it at home. and soul hunger can be good, statistically it is better than +1 strength but is only for the first round of combat. it also gives you a chance to turn those failed rolls to wound into killing blows which is nice.


About the Tzeeentch herald, isn't he fairly safe in the big unit of letters? Most of my army will be near that block so he can cast augment spells on nearly all my units, besides dwellers do require him to be pretty close by.
Removing a scroll for some wings is also a tough choice for me, the fact that daemons can have two scrolls is almost too awesome.
read your army book p. 30 again, he can't go in the bloodletter unit. since he doesn't have a bunker to hide in, he needs wings to stay out of trouble in your list.



I've heard good things about Lore of Metal, any thoughts on that? Enchanted Blades of Aiban on bloodletters, hello hitting on 2+ :D
Not to mention giving bloodletters an armour save wouldn't be too bad?
its awesome, light and metal are my favorite lores with bloodletters



Does regeneration do anything on bloodletters though? They already have a 5+ ward save, does it stack?
no it doesn't stack, you must choose one or the other. but if you have throne of vines up, it becomes a 4+ regen which is good for obvious reasons.

dragonet111
19-06-2011, 16:41
Yes I saw flamers and I thought 210. So use to units of 6 flamers

Sorry.