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Silvertongue
19-06-2011, 02:40
Hi there. This may be a stupid question, but given how the rules for the CoB got FAQ'ed, how do challenges work? I mean, do you attack with the C0B whole profile (that is, with the extra attacks from the Acolytes), or only with the Hag Priestess'?
Also, if the Priestess has bought an upgrade, say the klling blow one, do all the CoB attacks get killing blow?

Thank you in advance, and forgive me if it's a stupid question.

GodlessM
19-06-2011, 02:54
It's a tough one; since the whole thing counts as a war machine she only counts as war machine crew, and with characters not normally being able to join war machines, this becomes a mess. It may be the case that she can't challenge anymore while on the Cauldron.

AMWOOD co
19-06-2011, 03:26
I would treat this the same as a challenge against any character who is mounted. This seems similar to a Dwarf mounded on shieldbearers or to Thorgrim Grudgebearer himself. One could also draw parallels to a Goblin Great Shaman on an Arachnarok or a character on a chariot: it will be the character, all the crew and the mounting as one model (even if they are 2 targets within that one model). In this case, we have 1 model that is one target, but you have a few parts that can die off before the actual character bits.

On a similar note, how does the Anvil of Doom say to handle challenges, if it does? If I don't have it consistant, use its method.

Yrrdead
19-06-2011, 05:57
It is a war machine, she becomes crew. The Hag cannot issue or accept challenges because war machines crew cannot. Same with the Anvil and previously the Casket.

You may not allocate attacks against the Hag/Runelord, combat is abstracted.

As far as your last question. Only the Hag's attacks would benefit from any upgrades she has purchased. Though in the case of characters being in the other unit I have no idea how you would allocate them since it is abstracted similar to combat inside buildings. Unfortunately unlike buildings I can't find any rules regarding character attack allocation.

Silvertongue
19-06-2011, 11:55
Thank you all for your answers! It is quite a complicated situation, and it's a shame she can't participate in challenges.
Anyway, thank you lot :)

Haravikk
19-06-2011, 11:59
War Machines cannot have proper champions or characters; for unusual warmachines the champion/character is treated like an upgrade, improving the stats, including Wounds and Attacks. Any equipment that the "character" has will apply to the entire war machine.

Basically no matter what the crew is comprised of, the whole thing is only ever one model for game purposes, with the crew only ever acting as Wound counters. Quite simply before the game begins you take the best stats out of all available crew, and add the Wounds into a single profile, with the Toughness value being the crew's best in close combat, or the war machine's versus ranged attacks. Attacks are based on individual crew members as if there separate (as before), FAQ's will specify what order in which to remove crew and when.

tmarichards
19-06-2011, 12:54
You can't add the attacks into a single profile because they have different WS, I and S values. You also lose the attacks from the crew each time one is killed, as per the rules.

Tregar
19-06-2011, 13:07
Yeah, a lot of Haravikk's post isn't in the rules (frontage, what?). How things like a Bully upgrade (An additional Orc crewman for Goblin warmachines) are never really explained in terms of toughness.

But for the main question asked in the thread, no, you can't challenge with a Cauldron of Blood. This came up in a recent tournament for me when an Anvil of Doom Runelord challenged a hero of mine (in quite a killy unit), and I scoured the FAQs until I found the one I knew had read, which told us that characters/champions that are part of warmachines can't issue or accept challenges. Quite a change from 7th edition when a Bloodthirster would have to get through the challenges from both Hags before he could finally kill the Death Hag...

Blkc57
19-06-2011, 18:38
HI guys, it states it clearly in the FAQ

Q: Can a character or champion that is part of the crew of a war machine issue or accept a challenge? (p102)
A: No.

So characters such as the Death Hag on a cauldron and the Rune Priest on top of an Anvil of Doom are forbidden from accepting or issuing the challenge to begin with. it is fought merely as a normal war machine where you choose your 6 models and fight it out.