PDA

View Full Version : Skaven Strength in Numbers - Not affected by disruption?



spikedog
04-07-2011, 23:28
OK this might seem really obviously to everyone but me so I figured I would ask.

Skaven book states under the Strength in Numbers rule that you get to add your rank bonus to your leadership score (p.33) but lose the leadership bonus it if you lose your rank bonus for any reason.

The rulebook states that when disrupted "A unit does not receive combat result points for extra ranks" (p.52).

Now maybe I am missing something or perhaps I understand it correctly and just my gaming group doesn't but, it doesn't say in disruption that you lose your ranks or their bonuses, only that you don't count it for the combat points it would normally give.

So does this mean Skaven still count their ranks for Strength in Numbers even when disrupted?

Balerion
04-07-2011, 23:40
The rulebook states that when disrupted "A unit does not receive combat result points for extra ranks" (p.52).

I thought this WAS the rank bonus. So if you lose this, you lose the rank bonus, because it doesn't exist in any other form (meaning SiN stops working).

Could be wrong, could be relying on the 7th edition definition of rank bonus, could just be playing my own instinctual RAI, but that's how I feel.

spikedog
04-07-2011, 23:49
In 7th I would totally agree with you since I am pretty sure it said you don't count as having any ranks when in combat in a flank or rear from an enemy with unit strength 5 or greater. However in this edition I am not sure as the words used seem to muddy the point somewhat, they seem to say that you still have your ranks only that they are not counted when working out combat results.

I am not arguing one way or the other (despite being a Skaven player) I just want to make sure what the correct ruling is so I know for myself and anyone else I might play that asks. With a point such as this I would rather have a rule or sentence to point to when declaring it works one way or another rather than just RAI.

decker_cky
05-07-2011, 00:30
It's not muddied at all. Rank bonus is referred to only in that reference. If you disrupt the ranks, there's no rank bonus to add to leadership.

Kalandros
05-07-2011, 07:57
In this thread: Another player trying to gain a huge advantage from wrongly interpreting the rule in his favor by trying to twist the wording of a 7th edition armybook.

Stop abusing this already terribly abused game system.

Claim 'RAW' all you want, its obviously not how it would ever be intended if there is no actual way for you to lose your rank bonus due to a "small wording issue" (which you very carefully nitpicked from the rest of the rules).

Disruption means no Strength in Numbers.

m1acca1551
05-07-2011, 08:35
As I play skaven, i don't use SIN when i'm disrupted, skaven have already got enough perks they can live with out this :P

theunwantedbeing
05-07-2011, 10:52
You lose it when disrupted. (http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1610149a_FAQ_Skaven_V1_4.pdf)
As per the latest Errata.

spikedog
05-07-2011, 11:00
I can't seem to find it in the errata theunwantedbeing, please could you point me to the page/section it is in?

Rhellion
05-07-2011, 11:20
I can't seem to find it in the errata theunwantedbeing, please could you point me to the page/section it is in?

Page 33 – Strength in Numbers
Change the second sentence of the first paragraph to “Units
with the Strength in Numbers special rule add their current
rank bonus to their Leadership value for any Leadership test.”

spikedog
05-07-2011, 11:30
I see, OK well again I am not arguing this point however it seems to me all that sentence change is doing is changing the text from saying "All units in the Skaven army" to "Units with the strength in number rule". This change I am guessing is to change the rule so that it doesn't conflict with Skaven units that don't actually have the SIN rule.

It doesn't actually change the wording of the point I raised which was "rank bonus" vs "combat result points for ranks".

That all said I think it is obvious which way it is supposed to work so even if that is the only clarification I have my answer. Thanks all!

Lex
05-07-2011, 14:20
It seems people want to imply Rank Bonus where it is simply a rank bonus. There is only one bonus in WHFB for having extra ranks, which you lose should you become disrupted. If you want to argue that there is no Rank Bonus mentioned in 8th, then you receive +0. You can't have it both ways.

popisdead
05-07-2011, 18:51
If you disrupt the ranks, there's no rank bonus to add to leadership.

Yeah pretty much the norm locally on this.

spikedog
05-07-2011, 21:44
OK well thanks everyone. I have my answer.