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Highlander
31-07-2011, 16:22
Hi everyone.

I played with high elfs, but my country (Brazil) has a small comunity of players. Our tournaments has about 18 people . I readed some forums and i noted that very few people using Teclis, and i wounder why ? What is the dungerous of using him, that make everyone give up to use him ?

Here the only great risk is, taking the last spell of lore of life in troop where Teclis is, but i protect him in a troop of 13 phoenix guard and a BSB with banner of world dragon, what makes my Teclis imune to magic.
Snipers of empire is another risk to, but i can manage it atacking them fast. and let teclis troop away as i can.

And in the other hand, i think Teclis with lore of Shadows a terrible enemy.
With last spell, you can make simple core troops like Seeguard a terrible troop take fight in 3 or 4 ranks with strengh 8, and swordmasters with 9 if strengh.

Also, the lore hads a porwerfull combo. Yesterday playing with Lizard, i be able to kill 2 stegadons on Second round. I simple decrease his initiative with one spell and cast pit of shades.

Thank you

vinny t
31-07-2011, 16:34
Well, many people don't use Teclis because he is seen as "broken", in that using him giver your opponent a less fun game, and cheapens the experience overall. However, I would have no problem playing against him in a unit of 13 PG, as that unit is fairly easily killed. The problem arises when it is Teclis in 30+ Phoenix guard

snottlebocket
31-07-2011, 16:40
It's teclis, not much strategy there. Just throw a lot of dice at a lot of spells and hope nobody brings a feedback scroll. After the game, check if you still have friends.

Highlander
31-07-2011, 17:39
Well, i was talking about tournaments. People here use to have what they have of best, so why dont use Teclis ? I readed army list from tournaments, i i see few Teclis, and now i wounder why so many
Teclis apeared in tournaments list.

Thanks

The bearded one
31-07-2011, 17:42
It's teclis, not much strategy there. Just throw a lot of dice at a lot of spells and hope nobody brings a feedback scroll. After the game, check if you still have friends.

This covers all aspects of Teclis. He's broken.

And he's an elf.. which is just as bad.




Also many tournaments ban special characters and items that are deemed broken.

ftayl5
01-08-2011, 06:57
What's this? Teclis and tactics being used in the same sentence?

Lord Inquisitor
01-08-2011, 07:57
In no-comp competitive play Teclis isn't that bad. In terms of tactics, he isn't as simple to use as people make out. Because he needs to roll a lot of dice typically to cast and anything he casts that isn't IF will be dispelled with prejudice, it means he can only guarantee one, maybe two spells a turn. In practice, this means he can usually only buff/debuff to protect one part of the high elf line. Particularly facing a mobile enemy, but really any combat force, this means the elf player needs to be able to control the movements of the enemy force. An effective method is to use eagles to block enemy movements other than funneled into your buffed unit. While teclis armies are usually 2x spear elf blocks, a bunker for teclis, a bunch of eagles and the rest spent on the elites (SM, WL, PG), this army is quite reactive (apart from the eagles) and can be beaten quite easily by an experienced player. Other variations are the shadow-boosted elf bowline, which relies on massed bowfire and reduced enemy toughness, and a cavalry-based deathstar that can be boosted by Teclis, but this has the usual problems all deathstars face. The other issue is of course Teclis' fragility. Caradryan is a good bodyguard and banner of the world dragon is useful to protect him from magical sniping. However, this eats into your points for a single unit that is going to hide at the back of the board and further reduces your ability of the rest of your army to fight the enemy.

Teclis is certainly not uncommon at uncomped tournaments, but is frequently banned at most GTs, either through a blanket "No Special Character" rule or specifically Teclis. Out of my 9 games at Ard Boyz this year, 5 were against High Elves and every HE list I saw at all three rounds (including both the ones I played and others) had Teclis. Pretty much a default choice where allowed.

Is he good? Yes. He undoubtedly is an absolute must when playing competitive High Elves. He's far too cheap for his abilities but this is somewhat offset by the general overcosting of the HE infantry. Does he require tactics? Oh yes. Stick him on the board without a plan and you'll lose to a competent opponent. Is he unbeatable? Well, as I said, I played Teclis 5 times in that tournament and I killed him and massacred his army every time. :o

Goldenwolf
01-08-2011, 23:37
Teclis is good, and I think a must for any competitive High Elf Army. The HE suffer from high cost infantry, that is T3, and has a 5+ save. Anything you can do to optimize your units helps. I admit that ASF works great, but a unit of 20-30 guys who get shot at, and magic spelled will soon be reduced to almost worthless.

I know some areas find the HE to be great, but we usually horde up, and the HE suffer in that situation a lot of the time.

Highlander
02-08-2011, 01:23
I liked the answer of Lord Inquisitor. I agree with him that Teclis is a very powerfull caracter, but he dont win the game by himself. Here in Brazil all tournaments permit special caracters. And also, Teclis is powerfull if you user tactics. I liked use him with banner of sorcery, at least one spell per turn is garanted, usually i do two spells. I prefer Lore of shadows.
And tought i dont use caradryan, i need to make movements thinking in protected Teclis every turn, because he is very weak and is a Lord of 3 wounds. He is not like SLAN, that is very hard to beat in close combat. In my opnion, slan mage priest is so powerfull as Teclis. HE cannot cast with all Times but his skill of take one dice and have two, usully, makes him the skill to make two spells at turn also.
I guess that people dont use Teclis because it has something that simple crush him every easy.
Thank you all for answers

russellmoo
02-08-2011, 04:15
The thing about Teclis is what he does for the amount of points he costs-

And against some armies lore of Shadow Teclis is just way too powerful-

These armies are Tomb Kings, Dwarfs, O&G, and Lizardmen- the poor initiative of these armies, combined with slower movement make Teclis immensely difficult to beat and leave them with few ways of dealing with a Teclis list-

On the other hand- Skaven, Dark Elves, and WoC can handle Teclis just fine- Really it comes down to Teclis not being fun to play against because he exploits the rules of the game (purposefully done of course by GW, as they wanted him to be the best mage in the game- they just went a little too far)-

So feel free to take him to tournaments you will do well, but you will eventually get bored and use something more challenging

abdulaapocolyps
02-08-2011, 19:31
Bloody Teclis.
I have never met a high elf player who didn't moan about something without there battering RAM that is Teclis.
I think high elves are competitive without him,so with him he pushes it over the edge,but then most books have someone...
I'm completely against special characters in competitive games,th books may be slightly off balance but when you add your characters...

enyoss
03-08-2011, 01:05
I guess that people dont use Teclis because it has something that simple crush him every easy.


Elsewhere in the World though, he is taken quite a lot by the most successful players, and that appears to be because while being easy to squash, he is also immensely powerful. Way too powerful for his points in my opinion, and I'm a High Elf player.

I know the phrase gets bandied about a lot, but really it's a question of whether you want to win at all costs. Taking Teclis is a conscious decision to utterly maximize your chances of winning, while probably making the game more boring and less enjoyable for your opponent. For me, the need to win doesn't offset that cost to myself and my opponent, so I leave him out of my lists.