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Szemi
02-08-2011, 09:14
Hello members of warseer! It has been a while since i have sended armylists at warseer, but it is that time again, This list will be used against friends and at some tournaments and here's the list.

Sorcerer lord = 335
Lv4, Charmed shield, Talisman of preservation, Spell familiar, Lore of heavens

Exalted hero = 224
Bsb, Shield, Halberd, MoT, Armour of destiny, Stream of corruption

20 x Chaos warriors = 390
Full command, Shield, MoT, Rapturous standard

15 x Chaos warriors = 315
Full command, Shield, Halberd, MoN/MoK

30 x Chaos marauders = 200
Full command, MoK, Gw

5 x Chaos hounds = 30

5 x Chaos hounds = 30

5 x Chaos knights = 260
MoN, Standard bearer, Musician

5 x Chaos knights = 260
MoN, Standard bearer, Musician

Chaos chariot = 150
MoK

Hellcannon = 205

Total points: 2399

Szemi
03-08-2011, 12:40
This list seems to be balanced i guess, becouse no one has been commenting about it at any point. Should i drop the hounds of and grow my halberd warriors up to 20?

Morax
03-08-2011, 16:56
Chaos hounds are way to useful to drop so nonchalantly. They protect what is behind them, threaten the largest threat to your force, help you contain your lunatics...all in all one of the best parts of being a Warrior of Chaos player.

There are some concerns with your list now that I am looking at it. The marauders are a little low on numbers. With such great hitting power and so low on protection, they are usually the prime target for small arms fire in a list like this. You can lose droves of them before they see combat and once there you will lose more before they get to swing. It is for these reasons that you will rutinely see units of 40-50 in army lists so that when they swing back they hit hard enough to matter.

The shield on the BSB is wasted, not sure if it is there just because you had extra points or not. Being that he has a halberd, which is classified as a special weapon, he must use it in combat. Also he will be in a unit and so will be avoiding the greater majority of shooting attacks that would permit an armor save. Things such as cannons and a direct hit from a stone thrower will mush him anyway, so I suggest save the points and invest them elsewhere.

The lore of heavens on your sorcerer lord is a bit of an unusual choice. While I applaud you for taking it I must ask why? There are certainly more damaging lores availabile to you and most would say there are lores with more synergistic hexes and augments.

The equipment on the lord is also a bit mysterious. Is he going into a unit or being placed on his own. The reason I ask is he seems to be equiped to be on his own with the charmed shield. But the talisman of preservation, while being a great piece of equipment, is overpriced if you will not be seeing combat. The golden eye of tzeentch would give you the same 4++ against ranged attacks while saving you some points. You also do not have argueably the best arcane item in the game in your list, the infernal puppet. Its usefulness is beyond question, and for the bargain price it is listed at is usually seen as a must have.

Just a few questions that may help you to think about a few things is all.

Szemi
03-08-2011, 19:39
There are some concerns with your list now that I am looking at it. The marauders are a little low on numbers. With such great hitting power and so low on protection, they are usually the prime target for small arms fire in a list like this. You can lose droves of them before they see combat and once there you will lose more before they get to swing. It is for these reasons that you will rutinely see units of 40-50 in army lists so that when they swing back they hit hard enough to matter.

The shield on the BSB is wasted, not sure if it is there just because you had extra points or not. Being that he has a halberd, which is classified as a special weapon, he must use it in combat. Also he will be in a unit and so will be avoiding the greater majority of shooting attacks that would permit an armor save. Things such as cannons and a direct hit from a stone thrower will mush him anyway, so I suggest save the points and invest them elsewhere.

The lore of heavens on your sorcerer lord is a bit of an unusual choice. While I applaud you for taking it I must ask why? There are certainly more damaging lores availabile to you and most would say there are lores with more synergistic hexes and augments.

The equipment on the lord is also a bit mysterious. Is he going into a unit or being placed on his own. The reason I ask is he seems to be equiped to be on his own with the charmed shield. But the talisman of preservation, while being a great piece of equipment, is overpriced if you will not be seeing combat. The golden eye of tzeentch would give you the same 4++ against ranged attacks while saving you some points. You also do not have argueably the best arcane item in the game in your list, the infernal puppet. Its usefulness is beyond question, and for the bargain price it is listed at is usually seen as a must have.

Just a few questions that may help you to think about a few things is all.

Yes i could grow them to 40 model unit, but where i could take those points?

Bsb:s shield is there for extra point usage.

Sorcerer will be inside units most of the time but sometimes i will wonder with it alone on the table. I took spell familiar for the extra spell, but i didn't have enough points for the puppet too, which is the best item on woc book atm, for my opinion. Many times has my sorcerer been in close combat and thats why i took tal of preservation. It has saved him manytimes.

Morax
03-08-2011, 20:35
If I were scrounging for points in your list and was thinking purely competitively I would drop the chariot gaining 150. The two units of knights as hard hitting flankers for your one anvil should prove more then sufficent.

I would take those points and get the banner of eternal flame for one unit of knights, the infernal puppet for the sorcerer, get another 10 marauders, and take the remainder to boost the unit of 15 warriors as high as I could. 18 would be best as that makes 3 ranks of 6. Mark of Khorne for the halberd warriors by the way, shooting will most often not float their way as they should be hidden behind hounds, and the -1 weapon skill doesn't do as much for you as +1 attack.

Szemi
04-08-2011, 07:36
If I were scrounging for points in your list and was thinking purely competitively I would drop the chariot gaining 150. The two units of knights as hard hitting flankers for your one anvil should prove more then sufficent.

I would take those points and get the banner of eternal flame for one unit of knights, the infernal puppet for the sorcerer, get another 10 marauders, and take the remainder to boost the unit of 15 warriors as high as I could. 18 would be best as that makes 3 ranks of 6. Mark of Khorne for the halberd warriors by the way, shooting will most often not float their way as they should be hidden behind hounds, and the -1 weapon skill doesn't do as much for you as +1 attack.

Yes i could drop that chariot off. Banner of eternal flame could be good, but it won't stack with knights magical weapons. I will look to these succestions.

Morax
04-08-2011, 12:13
Banner of eternal flame could be good, but it won't stack with knights magical weapons. I will look to these succestions.

The banner gives the unit with it flaming attacks, no where does it say that the unit loses the properties of their existing weaponry. In short you would have a unit with 10 strength 5 flaming magical attacks. Excellent for hellpit abom/war hydra/cairn wraith/treekin/treeman/any other smarmy monsterous creature hiding behind their regen save.

puckus10
05-08-2011, 02:05
I took spell familiar for the extra spell, but i didn't have enough points for the puppet too, which is the best item on woc book atm, for my opinion. Many times has my sorcerer been in close combat and thats why i took tal of preservation. It has saved him manytimes.
Take lore of fire so you dont need the extra spell since everyone is great. Yay now you get a puppet!

col
05-08-2011, 05:49
First off I really like the list. I think you'll find heavens works great with warriors. Good at modifying to hit rolls. It can make kb and poison pretty ineffective, not to mention effectively giving your knights rerollable saves against st4 or less. If your looking to scrape up points I'd cut your unit champions and possibly the standards on the knights. Also, look at where you'll put your characters. If you were going to put them into the tzeentch warriors you could cut the unit size by 2. Doing all that saves you 94pts!

Szemi
06-08-2011, 07:21
Here is the updated list with some minor changes.

Sorcerer lord = 370
Lv4, Charmed shield, Talisman of preservation, Spell familiar, Infernal puppet, Lore of heavens

Exalted hero = 219
Bsb, Halberd, MoT, Armour of destiny, Stream of corruption

20 x Chaos warriors = 390
Full command, Shield, MoT, Rapturous standard

20 x Chaos warriors = 435
Full command, Shield, Halberd, MoN, Banner of rage

30 x Chaos marauders = 200
Full command, MoK, Gw

5 x Chaos hounds = 30

5 x Chaos hounds = 30

5 x Chaos knights = 260
MoN, Standard bearer, Musician

5 x Chaos knights = 260
MoN, Standard bearer, Musician

Hellcannon = 205

Total points: 2399

Chaos257
06-08-2011, 11:29
ur army is suffering from weak infantry blocks and from coming at too many different directions.

you have effectively wasted points on the CK and the chariot which could be spent strengthening the infantry and ranged potential.

armies which can effectively use cavarly are either cavarly based, or have significant shooting to back them up.

the knights and chariot are going to get plucked off far too easily leaving you with half an army to fight with. CK are just too expensive for their purpose.

For the points you could get 2 massive marauder blocks and have 150 points left over. 1 unit of CK absolute max and you need to protect them.

also get rid of the dogs too, they're useless.

Morax
08-08-2011, 19:50
Chaos hounds are way to useful to drop so nonchalantly. They protect what is behind them, threaten the largest threat to your force, help you contain your lunatics...all in all one of the best parts of being a Warrior of Chaos player.



As I said earlier, hounds are awesome, keep em.

Your warrior blocks could be optimized a bit more if that is what you are looking for. First you would drop the MoN unit down to 18 and field them in 3 ranks of 6. Also drop the unit champion and shields out of the unit. The mark of Nurgle and the hard cover from the hounds will protect them enough to get them to the fight in good order. Take these points and beef up the other warriors unit to 23 or the marauders to how ever many you can get.

I'd drop the musician's off of the knights as well and take more marauders.

For your BSB you would be better served with a biting blade, enchanted shield, and a talisman of endurance. The 2+/4++ will protect you far better then a 5+/3++ in most cases and the biting blade keeps most of the hitting power of the halberd it would be replacing and is magical so you can kill ethereals.

col
08-08-2011, 20:03
You've got 2 arcane items on your sorceror. An alternative to your bsb could be:-
Tzeentch exalted bsb
Book of secrets
Spell familiar
Dragonhelm
Shield
Pretty durable with the 2+/5++ in close combat and has access to 2 spells of yoir chosen lore. This build has served me really well in the past.

Szemi
09-08-2011, 06:00
I will look into this list more carefully when i get home from work and i will update new list here after i have finished it up and running. I might get to playtest it this weekend , but we shall see it.

Noght
10-08-2011, 12:38
The banner gives the unit with it flaming attacks, no where does it say that the unit loses the properties of their existing weaponry. In short you would have a unit with 10 strength 5 flaming magical attacks. Excellent for hellpit abom/war hydra/cairn wraith/treekin/treeman/any other smarmy monsterous creature hiding behind their regen save.

Hmmm...I was under the impression that models with Magical Weapons (Characters) in a unit with the Flaming Banner DID NOT get the flaming effect on that weapon. Maybe there is a rule that supercedes it for the Rank and File guys.

Noght

Eta
10-08-2011, 13:29
Hmmm...I was under the impression that models with Magical Weapons (Characters) in a unit with the Flaming Banner DID NOT get the flaming effect on that weapon. Maybe there is a rule that supercedes it for the Rank and File guys.

Noght

No, there is no rule that supercedes it. It is the last sentence of the paragraph about Flaming Attacks. No flaming effect for your magical weapons.

Morax
10-08-2011, 16:02
Learn something new everyday. I would still include the banner in the force but with the halberd warriors for roughly the same effect.