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Jennifer
03-08-2011, 13:41
If a Beastman shaman takes the shard of the herdstone magic item, do they have to represent this on the battlefield with a suitable terrain piece?

I ask as I recently played against a Beastman player who made his own herdstone shard terrain which he said was impassable and was large enough to hide all his three Shamen behind all game. I couldn't find this rule myself, can anyone clarify it?

This was a tournament game not a friendly so I assume I wasn't being cheated.

Thanks

laribold
03-08-2011, 14:04
The rules simply say to place an appropriate terrain piece to represent the herdstone in your deployment zone.

The description of the item states that a mighty, jagged herdstone will burst from the writhing soil.

So it seems that a large piece of impassable terrain could be seen as appropriate.

If however your opponent was hiding his shaman behind it, it would be worth noting that nearly all spells (except direct damage spells) must have line of sight. So standing a bunch of wizards behind it would probably be totally counterproductive...

Falkman
03-08-2011, 14:53
If however your opponent was hiding his shaman behind it, it would be worth noting that nearly all spells (except direct damage spells) must have line of sight. So standing a bunch of wizards behind it would probably be totally counterproductive...
Quite the opposite, Magic missiles are the only spells that require line of sight. Direct damage, Hexes, Augments and Vortexes can all be cast without seeing your target.

Tregar
03-08-2011, 15:02
Tis legal, yes. Your opponent had to put a big, impassable rock in his deployment zone, around which several characters had to remain clustered. It's not entirely advantageous.

shakedown47
03-08-2011, 16:16
Not to mention you know exactly where his magic-using heroes will be deployed before he puts a single model on the table.

popisdead
03-08-2011, 21:13
Sadly people took the fluff of the item (springs into a giant herdstone) and made that the rules.

However,.. GW (in typical fashion) has let people play as they see fit. Mark Wildman's Shard of the Herdstone is obnoxiously big IMO and he's gone through the tournament circuit with it.

My Shard fits on a 60 mm Epic round so I coulde hide one shaman behind it.

So,.. the Beastmen player you described is playing within reason and consensus.

However if he were to place the Shard, then move his unit forward he would have more range casting spells (I assume he's just spamming Miasma?) and benefit from Wissan's Cast with free power dice as well. So what he is doing is give/take.

Also you can 'unmake' the Shard. Read the Beastmen FAQ.

Lord_Byron
04-08-2011, 00:04
I'd assumed as well that the herdstone is impassable, but I can't seem to find any references in the rules stating as such. What is the basis for the herdstone is impassable argument?

decker_cky
04-08-2011, 03:40
Sadly people took the fluff of the item (springs into a giant herdstone) and made that the rules.

However,.. GW (in typical fashion) has let people play as they see fit. Mark Wildman's Shard of the Herdstone is obnoxiously big IMO and he's gone through the tournament circuit with it.

My Shard fits on a 60 mm Epic round so I coulde hide one shaman behind it.

So,.. the Beastmen player you described is playing within reason and consensus.

However if he were to place the Shard, then move his unit forward he would have more range casting spells (I assume he's just spamming Miasma?) and benefit from Wissan's Cast with free power dice as well. So what he is doing is give/take.

Also you can 'unmake' the Shard. Read the Beastmen FAQ.

You can unmake the shard, except that the only spell that can currently do so can't unmake it. :P

Cernz
04-08-2011, 12:01
On the GW website there is a picture of a Shard of the Herdstone which is giant skull mountain with trees around it, so yes it is legal.

popisdead
04-08-2011, 17:33
You can unmake the shard, except that the only spell that can currently do so can't unmake it. :P

Oh really? I didn't follow up on the FAQ for this by looking for items I just thought of Vaul's Unmaking and the Stone of Spite. Neither work? Kinda good as I've started taking the Shard these days :p

EnternalVoid
05-08-2011, 05:21
Ya, while you can't destroy it with stuff like Vaul's Unmaking I have heard of it being moved in a Storm of Magic game at least. I would have paid to see that player's face when I was told about that, having it magically moved to the other side of the table.

decker_cky
05-08-2011, 06:39
Shadows can't move it though, since it's (generally) impassable.

Tregar
05-08-2011, 13:10
Can Goblins Nikkit in Storm of Magic?

Mr_Rose
05-08-2011, 21:46
Can Goblins Nikkit in Storm of Magic?
Based on the logic evident in the decision behind “unmaking” RE: the folding and floating fortresses I'd say no. They might be able to nick the now-useless inert item used to summon/create the thing but it appears that the actual herdstone/fortress/whatever is independent of the “item” used to put it on the battlefield.