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blackraven
03-08-2011, 21:50
exalted greater daemons, greater daemons, daemon princes... im a little stuck on what to take to the field at 3000 points. can anyone help me out with the pros and cons of each

thanks alot

Odin
03-08-2011, 23:25
Well, Daemon Princes is easy

Cons - they're rubbish.

blackraven
03-08-2011, 23:36
yea i guess so but at 3000 points i tag team then with a 3+ save 5+ ward and killing blow each... how good are the exalted greater daemons?

Rogzor87
03-08-2011, 23:40
Get a Daemon Prince and give him mark of tzeentch and put it on a fulcrum. Watch them try to get rid of him. mhmm

blackraven
03-08-2011, 23:53
marks dont exactly do anything in the daemon book :/ they just give access to the greater daemon equipment

Evil Hypnotist
04-08-2011, 08:03
Unfortunately you can't fit an Exalted Greater Daemon into a 3000 point force, their cost of 775pts is just over the allowance, purposely so I'm sure! :)

Bodysnatcher
04-08-2011, 08:09
Lord of change with a puzzle box on a fulcrum is an absolute monster.

blackraven
04-08-2011, 10:41
what does a puzzle box do?

Von Wibble
04-08-2011, 12:02
I thought daemons couldn't have the artefacts from the SoM book?

Its hard to see beyond lord of change for SoM really. They have access to a lore of your choice, and are fast enough to threaten fulcrums from afar.

The alternative is a siren song koS. This can pull a unit away from a fulcrum.

thesheriff
04-08-2011, 22:12
Kairos, knowing all the 8 lores of magic Cataclysm spells is obviously pro.

Failing that, a Lord of Change would do well.

And, on a side note, tzeentch heralds with master of sorcery are cheap and decent wizards. With loremaster, you can get multiple duplicates of spells such as dwellers, okkams mind razor and other valuable spells.

thesheriff

EDMM
04-08-2011, 22:17
I thought daemons couldn't have the artefacts from the SoM book?

They do.

You buy the item for your army.

Then, before the game, you simply give the item to a character in your army that doesn't already have a magic item of that type.

Since Daemons never have magic items of any other type, feel free to give the artifacts to any Daemon character you see fit.

GUO with Balesword and the Dawnstar Sword is pretty nifty, though there are many other good combinations.

blackraven
04-08-2011, 23:14
in my list ive 3 heralds of tzeentch with the lore master and a dispell scroll each just spoilt for choice wen it comes to choosing a lore

snottlebocket
04-08-2011, 23:41
yea i guess so but at 3000 points i tag team then with a 3+ save 5+ ward and killing blow each... how good are the exalted greater daemons?

Not that good. Their stats are higher but a regular greater demon can usually choose a better items / powers selection. On top of that a lucky unbind cantrip can't get rid of a regular greater demon.

Contrary to regular 8th edition I've found that a greater number of smaller units and creatures beats a armies with a small number of large units. There's too many spells (and creatures) that can completely remove or cripple a unit in one go. Spread the risk by increasing the number of units in your army, if something big and nasty shows up you got the magic to deal with it. In the end you win a game of SoM by how many fulcrums you occupy. Fulcrums can be emptied in any number of ways, most of which don't require huge units or titanic monsters.

For my SoM allowance I'd take a number of smaller creatures over the titanic ones any day.

blackraven
05-08-2011, 16:50
so instead of a greater daemon go for more heralds of tzeentch?

Von Wibble
05-08-2011, 16:59
Snottlebocket's advice is good, and in general I would look for 4-5 monsters with your 750 allowance.

However, in terms of taking a greater daemon, they, or a huge unit of horrors are your only way to get a level 4 wizard. The bonus to dispel cannot be underestimated. I would certainly avoid the exalted GDs, but a level 4 LoC or KoS is worthwhile. 3 heralds plus this seems OK for magic but at your points level you might want another herald just to make sure - extra heralds can just camp with horrors (imoproving their ward save) until they are needed on the fulcrum.

snottlebocket
05-08-2011, 19:11
so instead of a greater daemon go for more heralds of tzeentch?

You want at least two mages to occupy your own two fulcrums. Preferably more to result the inevitable casualties. And then you need more to start occupying enemy fulcrums that you free up.

I'd say bring at least four mages. Either to replace casualties on your own fulcrum or to occupy formerly enemy fulcrums. Remember that they don't all have to be demon mages. You could use your SoM allowance to bring lammasu, dark emmisaries, zoat, fimir and so on.

If you're not mono chaos I'd select heralds from various gods to further increase your lore selection. Those dispell powers might be wasted since SoM spells can't be dispelled by a scroll.

sulla
07-08-2011, 22:44
1 naked lord of change is probably a good start for SoM. Very hard to shift him off a fulcrum. If you want to be really mean, I suppose you could take Kairos instead for access to every single lore's cataclysm spells. He's well enough protected that he doesn't need to go up on a fulcrum either, leaving them for the heralds.

Bun Bun
07-08-2011, 23:43
Lord of change with a puzzle box on a fulcrum is an absolute monster.


in my list ive 3 heralds of Tzeentch with the lore master and a dispel scroll each just spoilt for choice wen it comes to choosing a lore

Daemons do not normally have access to magic items, it says so in their army book, so how is it that a daemonic herald, greater daemon or daemon prince take the mythical items in Storm of Magic?

Last time I checked the mythical items in the Storm of Magic book still follow the rules for magical items so for example you cannot take a item that falls into the magic weapon catagory from the Storm of Magic book if you already have magic weapon from either an army book or main rulebook. I think this is something that needs to be bought up in the next FAQ.

EDMM
08-08-2011, 21:49
daemons do not normally have access to magic items, it says so in their army book, so how is it that a daemonic herald, greater daemon or daemon prince take the mythical items in storm of magic?

Last time i checked the mythical items in the storm of magic book still follow the rules for magical items so for example you cannot take a item that falls into the magic weapon catagory from the storm of magic book if you already have magic weapon from either an army book or main rulebook. I think this is something that needs to be bought up in the next faq.

this is how:

they do.

You buy the item for your army.

Then, before the game, you simply give the item to a character in your army that doesn't already have a magic item of that type.

Since daemons never have magic items of any other type, feel free to give the artifacts to any daemon character you see fit.

Guo with balesword and the dawnstar sword is pretty nifty, though there are many other good combinations.

ijoinedchaos4the$
08-08-2011, 23:12
great unclean one on a fulcrum would b hard to shift wouldn't it ?

Lester
09-08-2011, 00:11
this is how:
This. It is also why Dwarves can use the Mythic Artifacts, albeit, Arcane Items are a no go for Dwarfs (unless you got a Mage in a Scroll of Binding I guess).

sulla
09-08-2011, 01:34
great unclean one on a fulcrum would b hard to shift wouldn't it ?Any of the GD-mages are.

LoC is even more cruel IMO. He still has dragon stats and the fulcrum 3++, but more importantly, he knows all spells from his lore and 2 of thoses are awesomely game winning. 1) Boon of tzeench; 4+ to sumon d3+1 power dice.
2) Glean magic. Best.Spell.In.SoM.Games. 7+ to cast one spell the target caster (anywhere on the field) knows. Can't summon new units, but it does pretty much anything else you could ever want. With most players taking diverse mages to maximise the chances of getting a useful roll on the spinner, the LoC has a fantastic amount of choice for this ridiculously low casting spell. Who wouldn't want 20+ cataclysm spells cast on a 7+, especially if the spell was cast with essentially free dice from a Boon of Tzeench in the first place.