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Kalivos
05-08-2011, 09:39
Hello,

This is my first attempt at making any Warhammer list and Im really looking for feedback on what I should be using, buying, and changing as well as how to organize my units. I made this list based on two Island of Blood boxsets, 2 boxes of Spearmen, and a box of Archers. This list is purely based on what I own right now. Any suggestions (of any sort really) would be greatly appreciated.


LORDS

Alith Anar 245 Points

HEROES

Mage (Shadow?), Level 2, Silver Wand 145 Points

Noble, BSB, Razor Standard, Heavy Armor, Long Bow, Additional Hand Weapon 173 Points

CORE

Archers x16 Full Command, Light Armor - 217 Points

Spearmen x30, Full Command 295 Points

Lothern Sea Guard x19, Full Command, Shields x19 - 272 Points

SPECIAL

Sword Masters of Hoeth x 10, Full Command, Talisman of Loec, Banner of Swiftness 205 Points

Sword Masters of Hoeth x 10, Full Command, Amulet of Light, Banner of Ellyrian 210 Points

Ellyrian Reavers x10, Swap Spear for Bow x9 218 Points

RARE

Great Eagle 50 Points

TOTAL 2000 POINTS

Alith Anar and the Mage will go with the Spearmen and the BSB will be with the LSG.

Oberon
05-08-2011, 10:00
Going from the top:
-Alith Anar, really? Sure, he shoots good but that's about it. Points could be better spent in upgrading your heroes or something.
-Shadows is a great choice of lore, silver wand is a good arcane item, at this points level you'll really need an archmage though->Alith goes back to the woods and you mage grows a beard?
-WOW! Now *that* is a random kit for a BSB :D Razor standard is nice, rerolls from BSB are great, but one extra S4 attack from the sword is less so, and hiding behind just 5+ armour save is horrible. Drop the banner, invest in armour of caledor, keep the longbow if you want (10p for a single s3 shot is very expensive, you could almost buy a dude with that), maybe consider a GW or a sword of might?
-Core is OK, if you do take out Alith Anar, you might want to consider banner of discipline for the unit that is going to hold your archmage general (for LD10 general-aura), otherwise (or even with the archmage) banner of flames or banner of MR2 would be great for spearmen/LSG.
-10-man smaster units are veeery vulnerable to all kinds of shooting, and you have even bought double command groups with magic items. How many points would you save if you combined the two units, took out the extra banner and musician models, stuck the extra champion in the third row as the 18th guy, and picked just 2 items for the unit? Answer= a lot. I'd go with either loec or light (light if you have VC/WE in your area) for the champ, and either flames or lion for the banner.
-I *think* you have to swap for the whole group and not for only some of the guys in the unit. Anyway, I'd split the unit in 2, 2x5 can be double the nuisance as one 10-man unit can. Without spears (or even with them) reavers are not a combat unit, and you are pretty low on great eagles so you will need harassment (sp).
-More eagles :D

I think you can work with my suggestions (if you want to) with the models you currently have (except the eagles). Future investment suggestion would be: elite infantry=white lions or PG.

Kalivos
05-08-2011, 10:13
Aha, that noble was actually a mis-read in rules on my part, actually. I read it as that if I carry a magical standard I can't carry any other magical items, including the AoC. That and I completely screwed up the math a few times and ended up just being frustrated and went "He's just a damn flag carrier who cares!" and then gave him items that fit mathmatically. Also I thought for some reason I needed an actual magical banner to get the benefit of Hold Your Ground! And the +1 combat resolution.

I picked Alith Anar because he was a gift, lol, that's the only reason why (And I kinda like the idea of a ninja bolt shot). I suppose I'll run him as a noble then. I do agree that I need a more powerful mage as well. My major plan is hoping to get Mind Razor to make those spears downright dangerous. Though Shadow seems to be filled with good spells.

I can see right now that a lot of the strategy in this game comes in well before you even put a model on the table in determining ranks, items, and set-ups. I have so much to learn!

I mainly face Skaven and Daemons, if there is a proven unit(s) that works against them.

Thanks for the feedback yet again! :D

Oberon
05-08-2011, 10:22
I'm not really sure how you are reading the BSB rules, but: you can't take a magic banner and other magic items at the same time. BSB does grant rerolls and combat resolution without a magic banner (the "pole" is all that matters apparently, magic cloth is just extra). This means: you buy the 25pts BSB upgrade for the rerolls, you buy a magic banner for the extra benefits, but if you do you're left with just your mundane protection and it is not enough (on foot).

Against daemons I'd definately take the other trickster's shard instead of talisman of loec for the SM champ, they'll go through daemons that much faster. Against skaven, anything that can kill masses of low-grade enemies is great, so bows and SM. Bows are good VS daemons as well, as are spears and SM.

Kalivos
05-08-2011, 14:09
Okay here is another attempt. I again have all these models (sorta). Reavers have magically transformed into Dragon Princes and I may have ordered a few eagles. I plan on using Prince Althran model on the griffin as the BSB on the Great Eagle (that works out nice).

LORDS

Archmage (Shadow), Level Four 260

HEROES

Noble, BSB, Armor of Caledor, Great Eagle, Great Weapon, Guardian Phoenix 218

CORE

Archers x16 176

Spearmen x32, Standard Bearer 298

Lothern Sea Guard x20, Standard Bearer, Shields, Banner of Arcane Protection 295

SPECIAL

Sword Masters of Hoeth x20, Bladelord, Standard Bearer, Talisman of Loec, Banner of Eternal Flame - 344

Dragon Princes of Caledor x5, Standard Bearer, Banner of Sorcery 220

Dragon Princes of Caledor x5, Standard Bearer, Razor Standard 215

RARE

3x Great Eagles 150

TOTAL - 2000


I hope I'm catching on to what you're trying to say here... It's late for me (Night shift).

Oberon
05-08-2011, 15:19
Right, again from the top down, but first I'll say this looks at least <----> this much better, IMO
-some equipment might be good here. Silver wand isn't that important anymore as you have 4 spells already, but staff of solidity (ignore first miscast) is pure gold in terms of insurance, and if we had more points to spend I'd suggest either one of these: book of hoeth OR folariath's robes+talisman of saphery. Just the staff works nicely, jewel of dusk is nice too, as is the dispell scroll. HE has LOTS of good arcane items to choose from.
-I approve on the BSB, but IMO there is still a bit of room for improvement. Now you have 2/5+ saves and s6 all the time, how about changing armour of caled for helm of fortune and buying shield&dragon armour, changing GW to lance while doing so? This would A: get a you a better wysiwyg situation as Althran carries a lance and B: give your BSB a 2+ rerollable and the 5+ ward. You'll end up losing S6 on the turns you don't charge, but I've found this 222pts flying brick to be pretty much immortal if not shot at by cannons and such. Your BSB is good, I just think after ~30 games that mine is better ;)
-Core is still good. You will want to take the musician in your LSG too, swift reform is a powerful ability with missile troops.
-Loec is good, but the other trickster's shard is better, if you're facing daemons or units with hand weapon&shield.
-I wouldn't invest in the razor standard, maybe ellyrion instead? Much cheaper (->gear for your wizard) buy for such a small regiment. Combining them wouldn't be bad idea either, and these would also like to have their musicians.

Even without these changes your list should be <----> this much better than the first one IMO, the only change that will effect your games in a tangible way almost every time would be the staff for your mage.