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mob16151
15-08-2011, 02:53
All Space Marine chapters are required to tithe like ten percent of thier Geneseed to the Adeptus Mechanicus. As a reserve for new chapter creations, and to make sure the gene seed was pure.

My question is many parted,firstly at what stage does the AM set up and say, "Erm the Space Weasels, gene seed is no longer pure".

How would they be able to tell?

Can a chapter's apothecaries tell when their gene seed becomes corrupted?

Who would then be tasked with "purifying" a corrupted chapter?

And if you were a Chapter master and knew your gene seed had issues, would you try to harvest some from a purer chapter.

Navigator19
15-08-2011, 03:46
1) The Mechanicum would probably step up and say "This chapter is too corrupt" whenever the dangerous occurrences (Like the Black Dragons Ossmodula corrupting their bones) exceeds the 'safe' mutations. So, whenever you have more abberations than Space Marines, you're impure.

2) The Apothecaries can tell. They're supposed to examine the gene-seed on a regular basis, and, since they help 'create' the new marines, would be aware whenever something goes wrong. I.e., Black Dragons, whenever a recruit shoots bones out of every orifice, and it occurs often enough to be a problem, then they should suspect it's impure.

3) I would say Grey Knights and any chapter associated with them (Exorcists and such), as the Imperium would be too paranoid to deal with it otherwise. Though, in some instances, I think chapters of the same parent legion (Think Imperial Fists to Soul Drinkers) would deal with it, as a way of keeping the 'blood line' pure.

4) That's a tricky question. I know that some chapters are composed of composite gene-seed. There's one at least that has part Dark Angels part Ultramarines. It's hard to say.

DantesInferno
15-08-2011, 05:29
My question is many parted,firstly at what stage does the AM set up and say, "Erm the Space Weasels, gene seed is no longer pure".

It's largely a political question.

Note that the Space Wolves and Blood Angels have been passing their gene-seed stability tests for 10,000 years. This says more about the stringency of the tests than the quality of the SW and BA gene-seeds. I'm sure there's a whole heap of political pressure on the testers to make sure that the BA and SW gene-seeds pass their tests. The BAs and SWs are two of the most well-loved and respected Chapters, with 10,000 year histories of loyal service to the Imperium and loads of favours gained with military units across the galaxy. Can you imagine the mess if it was declared that they were actually genetically deviant, and needed to be purged?

No doubt, therefore, there's an immense amount of political pressure exerted to make sure the results are in the best interests of the Imperium as a whole. Best not to think of the testers as the sort of impartial drug testers you get in modern sport, this is the Imperium we're talking about. This isn't a 20th century regime which prizes openness in government, with impartial agencies each to keep the other in check. This is the Imperium, a regime which has managed to survive 10,000 years on the back of overwhelming pragmatism. It consists of a bunch of warring factions each driven by self-interest. The Adeptus Mechanicus can't afford to provoke a massive controversy by declaring that the BAs and SWs have deficient gene-seed. It's not like purging some new and unknown Chapter with no friends (cf. Flame Falcons). You'd have hundreds of Chapters declaring their support for the BAs and SWs, not to mention other organisations. It's really not in anyone's interests to have such a mess, so I'm sure the AM keep their test results very very confidential.


How would they be able to tell?

"Gene-markers" I think are the standard explanation.


Can a chapter's apothecaries tell when their gene seed becomes corrupted?

Not always - the Flame Falcons viewed the flames which sprang from their bodies, harmful to their enemies but not to themselves, as a blessing from the Emperor. The investigating Inquisitor took a different view. Declaring mutation, the Inquisitor summoned the Grey Knights, who purged the Flame Falcons' homeworld of Lethe.


Who would then be tasked with "purifying" a corrupted chapter?

The above indicates that the Grey Knights are an option. It may depend on how exactly the mutation manifests.


And if you were a Chapter master and knew your gene seed had issues, would you try to harvest some from a purer chapter.

There are hints that the Black Dragons do exactly that. They send flawless gene-seed as part of their tithe. This is even though the Black Dragons' Ossmodula zygote has mutated, producing bony crests on their heads and blades from the forearm and elbow.

thearchiver
15-08-2011, 05:55
1. The AM wouldn’t they would past the information onto the inquisition to avoid the problem of having an angry marine chapter coming after them.

2. My guess would be looking at the dna make up of older samples to look for any change, and also by making up a test batch of zygote just to see what happens they they have cause for concern.

3. If the change was a slow one the yes, but there are examples of the happening chapter wide is a short period of time.

4. The Inquistion, which would use what ever forces they deemed best suited for the job.

5. It would depend on the mindset of the Chapter master some would try to keep there chapter alive no matter what, some bend the rules at bit, some aim for the chapter to die with honour before anyone else found out.

shadowhawk2008
15-08-2011, 15:09
All Space Marine chapters are required to tithe like ten percent of thier Geneseed to the Adeptus Mechanicus. As a reserve for new chapter creations, and to make sure the gene seed was pure.

My question is many parted,firstly at what stage does the AM set up and say, "Erm the Space Weasels, gene seed is no longer pure".

How would they be able to tell?

Each gene-seed possesses certain genetic markers which are used to observe the genetic drift of the given samples. These are measured against all the other genetic markers of previously submitted samples.

Can a chapter's apothecaries tell when their gene seed becomes corrupted?

Almost always yes. But the word corruption needs clarification. Are we talking Chaos corruption or genetic corruption as in mutation? What is the extent of said mutation? The Raven Guard and the Space Wolves both possess mutated gene-seed to a varying degree for example.

Who would then be tasked with "purifying" a corrupted chapter?

In the case of the Soul Drinkers, it is the Imperial Fists who stepped in. In the case of the Flame Falcons, it was the Inquisition with the Grey Knights who stepped in. It largely depends on various factors such as who knows about this "corruption" and who even cares.

And if you were a Chapter master and knew your gene seed had issues, would you try to harvest some from a purer chapter.

This is a big no-no according to the Codex. Since the end of the Heresy, there is to be no sharing of gene-seed between chapters. The Traitor Legions and the Red Corsairs actively don't pay this any heed of course.

mob16151
15-08-2011, 22:01
When I say harvesting btw I'm thinking more bolter to the face,bang, thanks for the geneseed punk.

Wasn't there a rumor of one chapter running harvesting squads, during a conflict?

Harwammer
16-08-2011, 01:52
The BAs and SWs are two of the most well-loved and respected Chapters, with 10,000 year histories of loyal service to the Imperium (The BA) remain (one of?) the most feared and least trusted of all space marine chapters from the blurb of Angels of Death. I guess that's a ret con (or their feared and loved, which I guess The Prince would approve of).

shadowhawk2008
16-08-2011, 05:56
When I say harvesting btw I'm thinking more bolter to the face,bang, thanks for the geneseed punk.

Wasn't there a rumor of one chapter running harvesting squads, during a conflict?

The scythes of the emperor during kraken i believe? There is a short story related to that in the legends anthology. I've never heard of a 'loyal' chapter ever doing that, unless you count the astral claws before the end of the badab war,