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nedius
16-08-2011, 16:20
Hi there,

I was being nostalgic and reading through my first tyranid codex (the one from 2nd ed 40k) - a great book in it's own right, and a time where tyranids really were a terrifying foe to face on the field.

It got me wondering... how would one codex fair against a different edition of the same codex? How would the latest nid codex stand up against a 2nd edition army at 1500 points? For that matter, in a battle of codexes, which edition of the tyranid codex would come out on top? How would ANY codex fair against it's younger siblings? Which would come out on top?

I sat and leafed through the current and 2nd ed books, comparing stats, special rules and so on. I started to think that the 2nd edition book could walk all over the current one - whilst units were more expensive, their upgrades were cheap and often very powerful.

Obviously, there are some tricky things to get over - psychic powers work significantly differently, and would require the old psychic power cards to function. There are a bunch of rules (Fear and Terror) which are no longer used. The biggest issue is with armour penetration - vehicle armour values used to be far higher, which is reflected in weapons with armour penetration that would open a 5th ed land raider like it was melted butter. But, I thought, if you class those rules as codex special rules, then it could work.

I'm not suggesting that this would be anything other than a exercise in interest - I don't think it would make any significant points about the state of the current or past game.

So, has anyone tried this? Have you ever played edition versus edition? Or which codex editions do you think would provide an interesting match up?

Mr Zoat
16-08-2011, 17:14
In 2nd edition everything cost about twice as much as it does now. Personally I would be more interested in seeing two armys with as near the same composition as possible fight with the book from each edition.

Grimbad
16-08-2011, 17:16
If possible, use the 2e vehicle armor values and the 5e damage charts.

I think most current codexes would stand up very well. Not only is everything cheaper, but there's an abundance of reliable multiple-shot weapons (as opposed to 2e's single shot or sustained fire). Another thing is that standard movement for 2e was 4"- Tyranids were scary fast being able to move 6", now that's just normal.

Today's Space Marine moves much faster than the second edition one. His bolter rapid fires at 12", not the full 24", and has no bonus to hit at short range. However, he will never suffer save mods, and will generally save on 3+ rather than the 4+ that most 2e weapons reduced him to. Conversely, he will not inflict his own -1 save modifiers in either shooting or close combat. But he also will not suffer to-hit penalties. He cannot throw his frag grenades.
All the advantages are minor, the disadvantages are insignificant. And most importantly, he costs about half as much.

massey
16-08-2011, 17:46
Depends what system you use. Does the 2nd ed guy use 2nd ed rules? Or does everyone use the current rule set? It depends entirely on how you set up your battle.

Scammel
16-08-2011, 17:51
3.5 Chaos vs current Chaos would be interesting. The former certainly had several truckloads of variety, but had to pay no mean amount for the options. I think the current one would clinch it actually.

thermopuke
16-08-2011, 17:55
This might work for 3rd-5th edition where the rules are pretty similar (and would be interesting from a 'codex creep' perspective), buy RT and 2nd were both different systems that resolved action in different ways making it impossible to judge exactly what version of marneus calgar was the most ultramarines

Not that calgar was more than a name in RT (those happy days of innocence)

totgeboren
16-08-2011, 18:11
I must say that a game between a 2ed codex and a current one is just silly. Though they share the same name, they really are totally different games. You could as well try and pit a 40k army vs a fantasy one.
However, games vs 3ed and 4ed using a current codex can easily be done, elegantly proving the phenomena known as 'codex creep', since it doesn't matter which edition of basic rules you are using, the 5ed codex will most likely win.

massey
16-08-2011, 18:41
I must say that a game between a 2ed codex and a current one is just silly. Though they share the same name, they really are totally different games. You could as well try and pit a 40k army vs a fantasy one.
However, games vs 3ed and 4ed using a current codex can easily be done, elegantly proving the phenomena known as 'codex creep', since it doesn't matter which edition of basic rules you are using, the 5ed codex will most likely win.

Well, part of this depends on the rules you're using. Many guys were priced according to the edition of the game they were in. For example, in the original 3rd ed SM codex, Assault Marines were like 30 points apiece. The reason for that is that back then, sweeping advance had nothing to do with initiative, it was based on your rolling 2 or 3D6 for follow up distance. Since Assault Marines rolled 3D6, and most people rolled 2D6, it meant they could move much further and had a much higher chance of sweeping you off the board. None of this D6" consolidate crap. They could also follow up into additional combats. "Oh look, I rolled a 15, I can charge that squad over there."

I think the Rhino Rush guys from the 3rd ed Blood Angels codex, who could hop out of their transports and charge you, would be pretty competitive today. Minor psychic powers don't exist anymore, but if you let a 3.5 Chaos SirenPrince use it, he could demonbomb the snot out of you. And you don't want to face a Black Book 3rd ed IG gunline, with guys who were absolutely dirt cheap, especially when there was no such thing as outflanking.

2nd edition brings a whole host of problems. I'll take those 2nd edition Assault Cannons any day. And a Chaos Psyker with the Iron Arm power (making him Toughness 10), Terminator Armor (3+ save on 2D6), a Power Field (2+ unmodifiable against shooting) where he could take them both, and then Prescience power so he could reroll all his saves. Yeah, that's hard to kill. Virus grenades, ugh.

nedius
16-08-2011, 19:27
2nd and 5th are not as different as you might think.

Here are some 'nid examples:

Hive Tyrant
2nd - 164 pts (+1WS, +4BS, +1W, +3I)
5th - 170 pts (better save)

Upgrade examples:
2nd - Deathspitter 13pts
5th - TL Deathspitter 15pts

Zoanthrope
2nd - 120 pts (+1WS, +1BS, +1W, +1A, no save)
5th - 60 pts (has a save)

Upgrade examples:
2nd - none
5th - spore option

Genestealer
2nd - 28pts (+1WS, +2S, +1I, +2A)
5th - 14 pts

Upgrade examples:
2nd - none
5th - Broodlord, STs, AG, TS

Termagaunt
2nd - 6 pts (+1WS)
5th - 5 pts (+1Ld, 6+ save)

Upgrade examples:
2nd - Spike rifle 1pt (better range and strength)
5th - Spike rifle 1pt

Carnifex
2nd - 199 pts (+3WS, +1BS, +1S, +2T, +6W, +3Ld, 3+save on 2D6)
5th - 160 pts

Upgrade examples:
2nd - up to 2 biomorphs
5th - ranged weapons, up to 5 biomorphs



So, points wise, it's not that different; some more expensive, others cheaper. But the units are noticeably better.

Also, play style is not so different. The main gameplay differences would be psychic powers (2nd uses power cards), Movement values (not a big difference in game - 2nd ed uses their own movement values, 5th just uses the 6" standard etc), armour values for vehicle penetration, save modifers vs armour piercing.

Each side would just use it's own rules for movement, and rules that differ in each game would be treated in the same way as a codex which gives a special mechanic. For example, 2nd edition would have the special rules of 'Fear' and 'Terror', whilst 5th would have 'synapse'. As neither side has AVs, the armour value issue in this case would be meaningless. Alterantively, an old 'nid FAQ answered the question of what do biomorphs that grant special rules no longer valid in game - just ignore them. You could therefore just ignore fear and terror.

So it would be quite easy to do.


As for other codexes, I think the last 3 or 4 SM codexes would be useable against each other quite easily, at least.

totgeboren
16-08-2011, 21:13
Well, part of this depends on the rules you're using. Many guys were priced according to the edition of the game they were in.

I did think about this, but I can't think of anything that has gotten significantly more expensive points-wise since 3:Ed.
Either units have become better for the points, or cheaper to make em more appealing.

My idea was that you pick an edition, 3:ed, 4:th or 5:th, and those rules apply to both armies. In that scenario, I think a 5:ed army would on average beat its 3:ed or 4:ed counterpart no matter what edition you are playing.

A 5:ed codex vs a 3:ed using 3:ed basic rules for both would result in the 3:ed codex getting totally trashed for example.

And in the same way, if you use the same codexes as in the example above, but use 5:ed basic rules, the 5:ed codex would still win.

The only list I can think of that might compete in later editions is the BBB IG list, using only infantry, but that ones was quite extreme, and was not even a proper codex, so to speak.

Gorbad Ironclaw
16-08-2011, 21:14
Also, play style is not so different. The main gameplay differences would be psychic powers (2nd uses power cards), Movement values (not a big difference in game - 2nd ed uses their own movement values, 5th just uses the 6" standard etc), armour values for vehicle penetration, save modifers vs armour piercing.


Don't forget the close combat phase was done massively different as well. No kill zones, completely different mechanics for using WS/working out hits etc. It made for a very different dynamic in CC. Generally models, especially characters, would kill fewer models per turn, but they would often kill them very, very effectively.

nedius
17-08-2011, 08:59
Hmm... you're right, I'd forgotten about that. You broke the combat up into small group or pairs and fought several mini-combats within the main one. That is very different...

To be honest, I was thinking more playing 5th ed rules but using an older codex to match it's current one, so the 2nd ed codex would fight as in a 5th edition game. Rule differences would count as either codex special rules, or be ignored.

For example, a 2nd ed Venom Cannon is S8, Damage D10, Save modifier -3, Armour penetration D6+8+D10, Salvo Template.

Now S8 works fine, but that's it. Armour penetration is then just D6+8, as per 5th ed rules. The salvo template would count as a codex special template, as the foot of gork is in warhammer. Save modifier could be adapted to AP easily enough; -3 means it would negate any save of 4+, so AP becomes 4. Damage then only becomes the tricky stat - It means each model hit recieves D10 wounds - that's potentially alot of wounds... You could either accept that, or as Damage is not a stat in 5th ed ignore it.

However, I think by 3rd ed, most of these issues would be minimal.

massey
17-08-2011, 21:17
I did think about this, but I can't think of anything that has gotten significantly more expensive points-wise since 3:Ed.
Either units have become better for the points, or cheaper to make em more appealing.

My idea was that you pick an edition, 3:ed, 4:th or 5:th, and those rules apply to both armies. In that scenario, I think a 5:ed army would on average beat its 3:ed or 4:ed counterpart no matter what edition you are playing.

A 5:ed codex vs a 3:ed using 3:ed basic rules for both would result in the 3:ed codex getting totally trashed for example.

And in the same way, if you use the same codexes as in the example above, but use 5:ed basic rules, the 5:ed codex would still win.

The only list I can think of that might compete in later editions is the BBB IG list, using only infantry, but that ones was quite extreme, and was not even a proper codex, so to speak.

4th ed Tyranids would probably beat 5th ed Tyranids. The monstrous creatures were significantly cheaper. I don't have the 3rd ed codex any more so I can't say as far as that goes. There's some stuff in the 5th ed codex that really is significantly better, but the good old Nidzilla list from 4th would still kick ass today.

I think you'd have the same thing with a handful of other books. Across editions, 5th is definitely powerful. But there's probably a handful of earlier books that were top tier for their day that have aged well. The old Dark Eldar codex might be able to beat the new one. And honestly the old Space Wolves pamphlet was an absolute ass-kicker.

2nd edition is harder to compare, and I don't think it's fair to just shove them into 5th and eliminate anything that doesn't work properly. "Oh, there are no sustained fire dice now" doesn't work. I think Venom Cannons that do D10 wounds are just things you have to live with when you do the conversion. Try to make it work as close to the original method as possible. Remember, 2nd edition power fists struck on initiative, but they only did one wound.

Mr Zoat
17-08-2011, 21:25
No, Power Fists did their damage stat in wounds. I don't remember what it was exactly... D8 maybe? Less than a Lightning Claw. And they didn't strike at initiative unless combat was drawn and the fist user had higher initiative.

massey
17-08-2011, 21:49
No, Power Fists did their damage stat in wounds. I don't remember what it was exactly... D8 maybe? Less than a Lightning Claw. And they didn't strike at initiative unless combat was drawn and the fist user had higher initiative.

I misspoke, initiative didn't determine when you struck in close combat back then. But they absolutely did only one wound.

Gir
18-08-2011, 03:46
2
Carnifex
2nd - 199 pts (+3WS, +1BS, +1S, +2T, +6W, +3Ld, 3+save on 2D6)


Take that, Hierophant!

Inquisitor Engel
18-08-2011, 04:29
This is actually (mostly) doable by using 3rd Ed Codexes onwards, they can all use the 5th Edition rules.

MajorWesJanson
18-08-2011, 05:46
Take that, Hierophant!

Yeah, that Carnifex is ridiculous for 199 points.

The Clairvoyant
18-08-2011, 07:28
Power fists did 1 wound, lightning claws did d3, chainfist d4 and thunderhammer d6 (and autopenetrates vehicles)

Porting 2nd ed to 5th is fairly simple. Like was said earlier, a -3 save mod is AP4.
In terms of extra damage dice, you can ignore this as you have the instant death rules. Afterall, a venom cannon at S8 is going to instant death any characters it hits so i'd use it as S8, AP4 and use the thudd gun template.
Move or Fire weapons are simply 'heavy' in 5th.
Basic weapons you could use as either assault or rapidfire weapons. Here its best to look at what the modern equivalent is.
I'd use the 5th ed vehicle rules (and armour values)

A carnifex in 2nd is much scarier than the current version. It could have 2 biomorphs (generally i took regen, though can't remember what else i gave him, possibly a voltage field)

Where 2nd ed codex vs 5th ed codex doesn't work is marines vs marines.
A tactical squad (like anyone took those!) was 300pts, plus 45pts for the missile launcher (i forget the cost of the special weapons but probably around the 7-10 mark) and your rhino cost 50pts and came from the support allowance. However, 2nd ed Calgar would make a mess of 5th ed version, despite the armour difference as 2nd ed calgar had a 3+ unmodified save (you did take the displacer field, right?!)

In terms of the Orks, i think it'd be close. 5th ed orks are combat monsters (they're like genestealers!) whereas a 2nd ed ork army knowing it was facing 5th ed orks would take a shooty list i suspect (proper warbikes, wazdakkas bike with the battle cannon(!), lootas, smasha guns and put enough gretchin on the board that you never reach the juicy stuff with your combat troops.

nedius
18-08-2011, 12:09
The 2nd ed carnifex was one of the scariest things ever to set foot on the tabletop.

I'll have to find someone willing to give this a whirl and test it out...

Vaktathi
18-08-2011, 12:46
Trying to stack up anything post 2E to anything from 2E won't work, too many missing stats and system changes. That said, if you were to try and jury rig it, you'd run into much the same problem with 3E vs 5E books.

If you took a 5E codex and had it fight its 3E equivalent, even using 3E core game rules & missions, the 5E codex would trounce it hard in all likelyhood. Unit costs have come *way* down in most cases (lol 28pt Assault Marines...) and most units now have more options and special rules than they used to.

In 2E many weapons had more damage potential, but generally armies were much smaller as well, about 25-50% of the size they are now. Having 3 tanks in a 1500pt 2E army was often fairly tank heavy, having 5 would be spam. Most 2E armies would have 20something-40something infantry. Having 17 independent AV12 tanks with the current IG codex and 80 infantry isn't by any means impossible, and Marine lists routinely will have half a dozen or more tanks and 40-70 infantry.

Gertjan
18-08-2011, 13:15
The 2nd ed carnifex was one of the scariest things ever to set foot on the tabletop.

I'll have to find someone willing to give this a whirl and test it out...

Hmm, dunno, I never found the 2nd ed. carnifex that impressive, usually one or two lascannon hits would reduce it to a smoldering pile of flesh and bones.

The biggest trouble would be with to hit modifiers, as the current armies have nothing to compensate that the same way they had in 2nd (targeters etc). Also the damage is so utterly different now that it's just to much hassle to compare them really. Most stuff in 2nd was lethal, a lot of weapons had truly frightening potential for damage, way more than they do nowadays (assault cannons had krak missile stats for example aside form the save modifier, though they usually jammed on turn 1). Current weapons are less dangerous and destructive imho. The thing is that back in 2nd you could stack such a ridiculous amount of to hit modifiers that even a space marine with targeter would be hardpressed to hit something, you don't have that anymore nowadays. A 2nd army would reduce even a squadron of 5th land raiders to nothing but a pile of molten metal in a heartbeat whereas most of the current 5th weapons would not even be able to glance some of the 2nd tanks.

And all of this isn't even considering the save modifers or the plethora of utterly weird and reandom specialty weapon/grenades/artillery quite a few armies had acces to.

totgeboren
18-08-2011, 16:44
The biggest problem with for example the Carnifex is how damage works.
Ok, so it's got a 3+ save on 2D6. Are you just gonna port that over, and Ap 3 still ignores its save? If that is the case, if will basically be immune to anything with Ap4 or worse. Or find the equivalent, which is a 2+ save. But then you are not playing by its 2:ed rules anymore.
And look, it's got 10 wounds!!! That's a lot, but not when a lascannon does 2D6 wounds.
In 2:ed, the Carnifex was not really all that. Big target so easy to hit, a Land Raider with it's two twin-linked lascannons and twin heavy bolters could often drop it in one round, two at most.

Porting its profile over to 5:ed would produce a monster, but that profile was made for a completely different game. You could as well plonk some Warzone models down and use their rules vs some 5:ed models and see how it goes.

Though it must be said, me and a friend played 2:ed about a month ago, Eldar vs Chaos, using our old 2:ed Codexes and wargear cards. Damn, that game sucked. It totally blew all my nostalgia away. It was slow, hard to manoeuvre, annoying psychics (his Farseer died to a Daemonic attack card :wtf:), and generally we both just felt we wasted a perfectly good afternoon of gaming.

Mr Zoat
21-08-2011, 20:04
Sorry, you were quite right about the Power Fist.

Regenerate cost 10 points per wound. On a Carnifex it would set you back 100 points. Personally I preferred Voltage Field and Adrenaline Sac to run and fire Bio Plasma. Which was a heavy weapon at the time.

A Tyranid creature running with hard cover between itself and whatever was shooting at it would impose a -3 to hit. A Space Marine with a missile launcher would hit it on 5+.

Scaryscarymushroom
26-08-2011, 19:24
Sorry about the minor threadmancy here.

New WD Sisters vs. Old WD Sisters...?

Back in the day *Before Witch Hunters*, Sisters of Battle had a white dwarf army list. I love SoB! :D It was published in WD 235 and again in chapter approved 2001. In an act of defiance, I'm gonna start making an army list based on these rules.

The way faith points worked:
You get 1 faith point for every squad of seraphim, Celestian Superior(HQ), Sister Dialogus, or preacher included in your army. You get 2 faith points for every Canoness, Missionary, and Confessor in your army. When a faithful model or squad dies, it gives its 'faith value' to the army's total faith points yet again. Any squad which included a faithful character was considered faithful. A faithful unit could use an act of faith by reducing the total available faith points by one, and passing a leadership test. BTW, basically everything is LD9.

The acts of faith were as follows:
Spirit of the Martyr: Test after armor saves have failed. If successful, the squad may shrug off these wounds on a 4+ as if they had the FNP special rule. It may be used several times per phase, just not against the same enemy unit.
Divine Guidance: Test after rolling to hit and before rolling to wound. If successful, rolls to wound of a 6 ignore armor saves.
The Passion: The unit gains the Rage and Fleet USRs. They must run towards the nearest enemy. In addition, they fight at +2 initiative and +1 attack in close combat this turn.
Light of the Emperor: Test at the beginning of your/an ally's turn. Every single faithful unit on the table which is fleeing and below half strength but otherwise meets the requirements to regroup automatically does so. All with 1 test of faith.

Battle sisters were BS3 and 10 points instead of [=I=]. They were taken in squads of 5-10. Seraphim were BS3, I4, and 16 points instead of [=I=]. Celestians were BS4, I4, and 12 points instead of [=I=]. Priests ranged in point value from 10 to 45. One could be attatched to any squad except for seraphim and redemptionists. For battle sisters and celestians, up to 2 flamers could be purchased at +3 pts apiece. Meltaguns were +10 pts apiece. Retributors could take up to 4 heavy bolters for +10 pts each, 4 heavy flamers for +15 pts each, or 4 multimeltas for +25 pts each. Dominions could be given meltabombs for +4 pts a model. They could take up to 4 meltaguns at +16 pts a gun, or flamers at +12 pts a gun.

Redemptionists could be used as cheap horde troops (5pts per model) with a 6+ armor save, a las pistol, and a close combat weapon. They were similar to repentia, except that 2 per squad could be given heavy bolters, plasma guns, autocannons, heavy stubbers, grenade launchers or meltaguns, and only 1 in 5 could have eviscerators. For +3 points a piece they could take one-shot weapons that were (strangely) used in CC. They went off at I8, were s4 ap5, and had a chance to hit everyone fighting a redemptionist in CC. The chances of the attack hitting were based on how many redemptionists there were. If there were 5 or less, you hit on a 6. 6-10, hit on a 5+, 11-15, 4+ and 16-20, 3+. They were led by a faithful character.

Rhinos could not repair themselves and were 40 pts instead of [=I=]. Mounting BSS in rhinos made them fast attack.
Immolators contained 1 firing point, could move 12", fire the heavy flamer, and the heavy flamer hit everything under the template twice. Alternatively, you could pay +20 pts for a twin linked multimelta. They were 70 pts instead of [=I=]. They could be taken as transports for retributors or celestian HQ squads that numbered 6 or less. So sadly a max of 5 per army. :(
Exorcists had the same armor value as a rhino, and their guns were AP3 and were 100 pts instead of [=I=].

There were also decent wargear options for all characters, but I'm not gonna get into that now.

How do you think this list would fare against the new SOB list? Because of Faith and all the cheap flamers and heavy flamers that have an 83% chance to be rending, I think it would do better. Exorcists are fragile and compete for a Heavy Support spot with the retributors, and meltaguns are too many pts for BS3 models. Anti-tank would be awful.

nedius
26-08-2011, 20:26
so you think old SoBs would top new SoBs?

Scaryscarymushroom
26-08-2011, 20:45
so you think old SoBs would top new SoBs?

I bet they just might.

13 year old rules Vs. 1 month old rules.

Definitely in lower point games. With the newer rules, everything can be in vehicles. With the older rules, very little can. Especially if you want to use seraphim. So in a 2,000 point game, the advantages of tanks in 5th edition might swallow an old sisters list. But at the 1,000 point range it wouldn't be a problem. At 1,500... there may be issues. Not sure.

Phyros
27-08-2011, 02:44
In 2:ed, the Carnifex was not really all that. Big target so easy to hit, a Land Raider with it's two twin-linked lascannons and twin heavy bolters could often drop it in one round, two at most.


Maybe not 1...but 5 with Toughened Exoskeleton and Voltage Field could cause some grief.

Excessus
27-08-2011, 14:19
hehe, 2nd ed chaos codex vs 4th ed CSM codex would be a blast!

khorne lord in termie armour has 2+ save on 2d6, he would be totally immune to anything that isn't ap2! :D

Plus MoK DOUBLES his attacks and assault distance, mohohahaha!

But wait, lets give him MoS(because lords could have all marks at the same time back then) and gaze of slaanesh as well so every model that wants to attack him gets -1 attack(not to a minimum of 1)

...and ofc MoN with +1T and a few daemonic gifts that makes everything close -1WS and at the end of the assault phase everything in contact with him takes a wound on a 6 with no saves allowed(even invul ones)

Put him in a LR with a few termie friends and call it a day! :D

Mr Zoat
27-08-2011, 17:19
Except that any 4th ed power weapon will completely ignore his armour. Since he'll be T6 he'll only take 1 wound but he could still be killed by a couple of powerfist sergeants.
MoK triples his charge distance to 12", exactly the same as what every unit in 4th can move and assault normally.
The lowest AV of the Land Raider on the other hand is 17, so it only needs to worry about melta and monstrous creatures.

Excessus
28-08-2011, 01:43
well, he has WS7 so he'll be slaughtering those sergeants since he'll be hitting all of them one by one...

Overlord Krycis
28-08-2011, 05:29
3.5 Chaos vs current Chaos would be interesting. The former certainly had several truckloads of variety, but had to pay no mean amount for the options. I think the current one would clinch it actually.

Actually...me and a mate did exactly this when the 4th ed chaos codex came out with a 1500pts game.
I tabled the 4th ed codex army despite it's composition of Lash Princes and Oblits.

Tried it again a couple of months back using the 5th ed rulebook...tabled again.

The 3.5 dex was just sooo much more customisable, meaning that it was a lot easier to make an army that could be a true "all comers" list. :D

Mr Zoat
28-08-2011, 08:04
well, he has WS7 so he'll be slaughtering those sergeants since he'll be hitting all of them one by one...

Unless they are not in base to base contact, in which case he can't hit them at all.

I don't remember how you worked out which combat to resolve first but a Marine Veteran Sargeant will only need 2 people to go before him before he is WS5 +2 for subsequent attackers.

When you said he got 8 attacks I assumed you were using the combat rules of the system where 8 attacks didn't benefit your opponant more than you.

nedius
28-08-2011, 09:47
When I posted this, I imagined using the older codexes in the current game - So the Chaos Lord would fight CC just as in 5th edition.

However, you do make an interesting suggestion... If each side used their own edition rules... So in the 2nd ed turns, you'd fight CC as per 2nd ed, but in the 5th ed turn they fight as per 5th ed... Intriguing.