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PeraNekron
06-09-2011, 21:33
Golden Mask of Kharnut
Enchanted Item , 60 points

The model wearing this mask causes Terror. In addition, enemy units within 6'' of the wearer cannot make use of their general's Inspiring Presence special rule or their Battle Standard Bearer's Hold Your Ground special rule.

What are your thoughts on this Tomb Kings only magic item?

I for one have found it very useful, a steadfast block of Goblins ain't so steadfast when this masks comes along, on a swift chariot too. ;) It also helped me a lot when I had to deal with huge blocks of infantry, or the pesky Crown of Command wearing Damsel hiding behind a BSB in a big unit of knights. Plus the Terror special rule ain't too bad either. The only downside is the price, but still....it really does wonders when it's at the right place, at the right time.

Cheers. :)

Malorian
06-09-2011, 21:39
If I played tomb kings it would be in every army list I made.

Basically takes parts of 8th that most armies hold dear and takes it away from them.

Use it right against O&G or Skaven and you'll rip them apart.

friendsofrhomb
07-09-2011, 07:08
I haven't used it yet, because I cant fit it into the 2400 pt games my group has been playing( lvl 4 HLP) But I have been very tempted, it looks great in the right situation

ihavetoomuchminis
07-09-2011, 09:39
I agree with Malorian. If i played tomb kings, i would fit it in every list. It's useful against ALL armies, and increases the efectiveness of your chariot units and monsters in a 1000%, as these units tend to win combats, but must deal with steadfast. Use golden mask, problem solved.

grhino
07-09-2011, 10:53
The Mask does not remove steadfastness, so skaven (with their bonus from ranks to their Ld) do not break that easily. Also, units still use the Ld of any characters present in that particular unit. If it ignored steadfastness it would be the best item in the world for a chariot unit. Unfortunately it isn't...

Your average steadfast ld. you're facing will still be 7, so units will hold about 50% of the time... makes a straigtforward charge with chariots risky.

Although it does force the enemy unit to test twice - once on the charge for terror and once when the combat is lost...

CrystalSphere
07-09-2011, 11:05
The problem is that it leaves the tomb king completely exposed, unless you have him on a chariot where you can get a decent 3+ save with reroll. The terror is also wasted unless you run him on a chariot (not likely to charge much with tomb guard).

I prefer the king on foot in a unit of tomb guard, so i donīt use the mask much.

Kamenwati
07-09-2011, 11:18
I never leave home without the mask in my TK forces. I usually load out the King with Shield, Chariot, Death Mask, Biting Blade (Just in case of Ethereal), Glittering Scale and Dragon Bane Gem.

Put in my Chariot bus unit with the flaming banner and it has done very well against most things it's been thrown against.

That said it needs to be on a mounted character to get its' points worth. With it's short range you want it disrupting your enemies leadership fast.

PeraNekron
07-09-2011, 11:58
Thanks for the feedback.

My usual Tomb King wargear list is : Golden Mask of Kharnut, Sword of Anti-heroes (really useful, since everybody pack 2+ characters in units - I ran once into a goblin horde unit with a front rank of 6 characters....I charged with a sadistic grin. ;) ), Dragonhelm and a shield, on a chariot. 3+ armour save, 2+ ward save vs. flaming, it's quite enough. The mask really does wonders, especially when combined with my tomb guard block led by a tomb prince and a tomb herald, and a necrosphinx hopping around.

If my Tomb King is on foot, I can't resist giving him Destroyer of Eternities. :D

Algovil
07-09-2011, 12:32
I would use it a lot if I played Tomb Kings, 40 points should be enough for protection as well, and Tomb King characters are quite survivable already right?

Like Malorian said: Many armies rely on Steadfast with BSB rerolls and High Leadership from General, therefore this item could be very powerful if the list is built to depend on it.

ihavetoomuchminis
07-09-2011, 13:54
The Mask does not remove steadfastness, so skaven (with their bonus from ranks to their Ld) do not break that easily. Also, units still use the Ld of any characters present in that particular unit. If it ignored steadfastness it would be the best item in the world for a chariot unit. Unfortunately it isn't...

Your average steadfast ld. you're facing will still be 7, so units will hold about 50% of the time... makes a straigtforward charge with chariots risky.

Although it does force the enemy unit to test twice - once on the charge for terror and once when the combat is lost...

I think the main gripe with steadfast is the sinergy with the general and bsb. Steadfast alone is not that great. Ld7 is sucky sucky.

musical
07-09-2011, 14:00
Thanks for the feedback.

My usual Tomb King wargear list is : Golden Mask of Kharnut, Sword of Anti-heroes (really useful, since everybody pack 2+ characters in units - I ran once into a goblin horde unit with a front rank of 6 characters....I charged with a sadistic grin. ;) ), Dragonhelm and a shield, on a chariot. 3+ armour save, 2+ ward save vs. flaming, it's quite enough. The mask really does wonders, especially when combined with my tomb guard block led by a tomb prince and a tomb herald, and a necrosphinx hopping around.

If my Tomb King is on foot, I can't resist giving him Destroyer of Eternities. :D

You know if you take enchanted shield and a dargonbane gem instead you get the same effect but save 3pts, not a big deal but I thought I will share.

Dragonhelm 10pts +normal shield 3 pts = 13pts
3+ armour save on chariot/2+ ward save vs flaming

Dargonbane gem 5pts + enchanted shield 5pt = 10pts
3+ armour save on chariot/2+ ward save vs flaming

PeraNekron
07-09-2011, 14:02
I'm well aware of that, but I also field a Tomb Prince on foot to lead the Tomb Guard, and I give him Dragonbane Gem. ;)

musical
07-09-2011, 14:07
Yeah I thought of that just 1 second later. My set up as a bit like that to start with but after a few games I think to be honest we TK players may be a bit too paranoid about flaming attacks. Unless you played a tailored list most armies will not have that many flaming attacks and it is very difficult to direct them again the TK/TP.

Spiney Norman
07-09-2011, 14:13
Golden Mask of Kharnut
Enchanted Item , 60 points

The model wearing this mask causes Terror. In addition, enemy units within 6'' of the wearer cannot make use of their general's Inspiring Presence special rule or their Battle Standard Bearer's Hold Your Ground special rule.

What are your thoughts on this Tomb Kings only magic item?


Its a great item, especially when worn by a chariot King. As others have observed its probably not worth its pts on a foot King because Terror is no only effective on the charge.

The only reason I don't use it more often is because I rarely play games large enough to contain a chariot King and a L4 Liche High Priest, and without the L4 priest Tk just don't work.

Von Wibble
07-09-2011, 20:06
I agree with the above - great item, but my high priest comes first then a tomb king. A chariot king with mask plus a high priest comes to more than 500 points, and I haven't played a game at above 2000 pts as yet.

Gaargod
07-09-2011, 20:46
Terror is of limited use. Amusingly, its of distinctly 'more' use when wearing the mask. Actually, random rules question - when is the terror test? I have a feeling it's when you declare the charge, thus you'll probably be out of range of the Mask's effect (so LD9 with a reroll, likely).


Note, the mask only stops use of the Inspiring Presence - if a character is in the unit, you can still use their LD. In other words, charging the general's unit with the mask only stops the BSB working.


Its still crazily good however. Auto-include.

barontuman
07-09-2011, 21:44
I fielded this last weekend in a tournament.

Game 1 Against Ogres. I had a stand-off against the new Ogres mammoth-thing. Neither of us risked getting charged by the other. Nullified the mask, general and chariot unit.

Game 2 Against Dwarves. His scouting big block of dwarves & bsb came in on a side and I could do nothing to stop him. Eventually in sheer desperation I charged the king by himself into said unit hoping he'd fail his terror check on Ld 9. No such luck. With his massive dispelling capabilities, I could not get any movement spells off.

Game 3 Against High Elves. Teclic and Banner of Sorcery and a dispel scroll.
This time I figured I'd not put the unit on the flanks and instead put it centrally. I charged a unit of White Lions, he made all of his checks, and eventually I lost the chariots and the king.

Roughly, my list was

king, mask chariot
5x chariot + flaming banner

20 archers banner, musician

10 archers, musician

10 archers, musician

48 skeletons hw/s full command
Prince w/ glistening scales
Necrotect

2x SSC

Hierotitan
Casket

lvl 4 liche high priest

In the end, I found that the chariots weren't fast enough when placed on a flank, and not tough enough when placed in the middle.

I thought I'd have good synergy with the SSC's, but by the time I could get the chariots into HtH, I was in combat with the enemy. I have to say, I'm not sold on the usefulness of the Golden Mask.

PeraNekron
07-09-2011, 22:21
My (one of many) 2500 points list is as follows :

Tomb King - Golden Mask of Kharnut, Sword of Anti-heroes, Dragonhelm, shield, chariot
Tomb Prince - Great weapon, Glittering Scales, Dragonbane Gem, Ironcurse Icon
Tomb Herald - Great weapon, Armour of Destiniy
Liche Priest - Level 2

20 x Skeleton Archers (musician, banner)
20 x Skeleton Archers (musician, banner)
10x Skeleton Horse Archers
4x Skeleton Chariots (full command, flame banner)

29x Tomb Guard (full command, Banner of the Undying Legion)
3x Sepulchral Stalkers

2x Screaming Skull Catapults
Casket of Souls
Necrosphinx

2500 points exactly. I like the whole idea of having everything different in the army. I loathe the copy/paste trend these days. Mask worke quite well in this setup, especially with a nasty hard block of tomb guard with Tomb prince and herald, with Necrosphinx hopping around and Stalkers lurking about (they are real good at crippling steam tanks and knocking out warmachines). Only trouble is against other Undead or Daemons, since break tests don't work exactly as I planned, but it works like a charm against "living" armies. ;)

barontuman
08-09-2011, 00:37
I forgot about the 3 stalkers. Yes, it does seem like it should work, and I'm glad that it does work for you. My list is 2200, which just about covers the price of the upgrade to Tomb Guard.

I notice you don't have much in the way of magic. How do you deal with the fact that your troops are virtually designed to need summoning?

sulla
08-09-2011, 08:23
Its a great item, especially when worn by a chariot King. As others have observed its probably not worth its pts on a foot King because Terror is no only effective on the charge.

The only reason I don't use it more often is because I rarely play games large enough to contain a chariot King and a L4 Liche High Priest, and without the L4 priest Tk just don't work.Wouldn't the foe just kill the chariot out from under the king, meaning he is isolated after the target unit is defeated? I'd trade a unit for the TK general.

PeraNekron
08-09-2011, 11:06
I notice you don't have much in the way of magic. How do you deal with the fact that your troops are virtually designed to need summoning?


The Tomb Guard have their own bound spell, recovering D6+2 models.
Casket of Souls has Light of Death + it grants D3 power dice.
Liche Priest has 2 spells, he can cast them using 3+ dice per spell.
If he dies due to some horrible mishap (beaten to death, explodes into chunks of dried flesh etc. :D ), no worries, he costs 105 points, and crumbling ain't so bad like It used to be.
It's truly wonderful how people tend to ignore the low-cost mage. Every time I fielded a Liche High Priest, he never managed to survive the battle, and he didn't make much difference (from my humble experience). By fielding a common Liche Priest, I used the points to buy some neat stuff for other units, and to invest in bigger blocks. The moral of this is - you can't have it all. :D And I'm a big fan of shoot em up, then close & personal. Magic is just there for fun/support.

EnternalVoid
09-09-2011, 07:16
Wouldn't the foe just kill the chariot out from under the king, meaning he is isolated after the target unit is defeated? I'd trade a unit for the TK general.

Pretty sure the tomb king actually has a rule that if their chariot is destroyed, they can actually stick with the unit till they decide to leave it. So getting his chariot kicked out from under him will not remove him from the unit and possible not even slow him down.

KimikoPT
09-09-2011, 12:04
Pretty sure the tomb king actually has a rule that if their chariot is destroyed, they can actually stick with the unit till they decide to leave it. So getting his chariot kicked out from under him will not remove him from the unit and possible not even slow him down.

The unit doesnīt have to move at the lowest movement value (king on foot) ?

Enigmatik1
09-09-2011, 12:56
The unit doesnīt have to move at the lowest movement value (king on foot) ?

I think it would. There is nothing in the AB that I can see that would override the unit continuing to move at it's original MV value. Then again, there may be rules interactions that I'm not seeing nor taking into account.

Now it would be funny if TK characters had a special rule that allowed them to hijack chariots out from under RnF charioteers...:D

sulla
09-09-2011, 21:31
Now it would be funny if TK characters had a special rule that allowed them to hijack chariots out from under RnF charioteers...:DEvery character should have that rule.

It should be called, "A horse, my kingdom for a horse!"

Enigmatik1
09-09-2011, 22:01
Every character should have that rule.

It should be called, "A horse, my kingdom for a horse!"

Or "Your Chariot awaits..." for Tomb Kings.

On a lighter note, why am I having bad GTA flashbacks now?

sulla
10-09-2011, 00:42
Or "Your Chariot awaits..." for Tomb Kings.

On a lighter note, why am I having bad GTA flashbacks now?Only if your tomb king can get a MAC10 for chariot drivebys.

PeraNekron
10-09-2011, 11:07
I see you are all having fun with this thread, but I'd hate it to get off-topic.
As for the funny rule of hijacking a chariot, my tomb king is a vain,conceited megalomaniac, who is very, very fond of his own custom-made chariot :

http://img834.imageshack.us/img834/8080/pharaohc.jpg

Plus he is almost never seen without his entourage :

http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/8373/chariots.jpg

(more of my stuff can be found on the Fantasy Project Logs subforum, aptly titled "Tomb Kings".)

So no, hijacking is not an option. His Majesty will rather walk on foot, like a commoner, than sully his feet with a lowborn chariot, lest it tarnishes His illustrious presence.

My alternate build for the general is Ogre Blade, Dragonhelm, and Talisman of Preservation, to make it a lot more resilient + killy. But still....that mask really helps a lot..

Enigmatik1
10-09-2011, 16:14
Awesome job on that chariot, Pera!

My problem with the Death Mask (and it is minor) is that I love the Sword of Bloodshed on my Kings. As most of you already know, the SoBloodshed Chariot King is BAD news on a silver platter.

I think the Golden Mask is more match dependent, but I think I'd take the Sword more often than the Mask in an all-comers list.

WarlockLoki
12-09-2011, 11:03
I thought those hits are divided between driver and chariot? Well, i might be wrong ;)

warplock
12-09-2011, 11:45
I think it would. There is nothing in the AB that I can see that would override the unit continuing to move at it's original MV value. Then again, there may be rules interactions that I'm not seeing nor taking into account.

Now it would be funny if TK characters had a special rule that allowed them to hijack chariots out from under RnF charioteers...:D

So the King can't jump onto another chariot, and the unit is slowed down - why on earth is the rule called 'And the Tomb Kings Rode to War'?