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castlesmadeofsand
23-09-2011, 22:47
Am i correct in thinking it's a 6+ followed by a 6+? or do they stack to give a single 5+ (or, surely not, one or the other)?

This comes to mind specifically in relation to savage orcs with shields, which have lost frenzy. How does the parry save, which they now gain due to not being frenzied, work with their ward.

Falkman
23-09-2011, 22:49
If you have several ward saves you use the best one. They don't combine, and you can't take more than one. So if you have two instances of a 6+ ward, then you only get to use one of them.

pointyteeth
23-09-2011, 22:57
Falkman is correct (we can't all be Tzeentch...sigh) :D

Artinam
24-09-2011, 17:43
As pointyteeth indicated, the Mark of Tzeentch is an exception to the normal rules, and here the parry save stacks with the Wardsave given by the Mark of Tzeentch (and only this).

Kalandros
25-09-2011, 20:49
Am i correct in thinking it's a 6+ followed by a 6+? or do they stack to give a single 5+ (or, surely not, one or the other)?

This comes to mind specifically in relation to savage orcs with shields, which have lost frenzy. How does the parry save, which they now gain due to not being frenzied, work with their ward.

Shields for Savage Orcs does absolutely nothing except for a pathetic 6+ armor save in the shooting phase.

Harwammer
25-09-2011, 20:51
Shields for Savage Orcs does absolutely nothing except for a pathetic 6+ armor save in the shooting phase.

eh? I thought frenzy only prevented the parry (ward) save, they still worked for armour (as long as a requires two hands set up isn't being used). Have I made a gross oversight?

Edit: Oh is this about how shields don't feature on the armour save chart and are described by the rules to be a modifier? I think they are FAQed to work on their own as a 6+ save... will check be right back.

FAQ: Add “If a model has no armour save apart from a shield, it gains a 6+ armour save” to the end of the second paragraph.

musical
25-09-2011, 21:37
Shields for Savage Orcs does absolutely nothing except for a pathetic 6+ armor save in the shooting phase.

I think he means they get a 6+ ward save from war paint already.

Falkman
25-09-2011, 21:40
eh? I thought frenzy only prevented the parry (ward) save, they still worked for armour (as long as a requires two hands set up isn't being used). Have I made a gross oversight?

Edit: Oh is this about how shields don't feature on the armour save chart and are described by the rules to be a modifier? I think they are FAQed to work on their own as a 6+ save... will check be right back.

FAQ: Add “If a model has no armour save apart from a shield, it gains a 6+ armour save” to the end of the second paragraph.
I'm fairly certain Kalandros is referring to the fact that every sane person runs them with two hand weapons, thus they can't use the shield in close combat.

Kalandros
25-09-2011, 23:01
I'm fairly certain Kalandros is referring to the fact that every sane person runs them with two hand weapons, thus they can't use the shield in close combat.

This.
The system isn't balanced for each option available to units. Its a mess.

theunwantedbeing
26-09-2011, 13:05
This.
The system isn't balanced for each option available to units. Its a mess.

It works well enough for most units.
In anycase, the rules changed and if you want to use your hand weapon and sheild in close combat then you don't take an additional weapon option.

A lot of the time you'de not have ever used the non Hw&S option anyway, so it's a miniscule loss of effectiveness balanced by a points saving from not taking the special weapons.