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boli
14-10-2011, 14:04
Currently right now all I have is 20 slaves and 20 clan rats but this is what I am looking at to expand into a feasible small army.

It looks like my main opponant will be a dwarven army with what I'm told is "very shooty"; (cannon, bolt-thrower, thunderers, crossbows units); but even though they are dwarves would I have issues if I decide *not* to field any magic? (mainly as I can't realistically afford it :P)

Thoughts / Ideas / Suggestions ?


90 || Warlord
6 || - Great Weapon
-----
96

45 || Chieftain
25 || - Battle Standard
-----
70

112 || 28 Clanrats
14 || - shields
4 || - musician
8 || - clawleader
8 || - standard
65 || - Poisoned Wind Mortar
-----
211


120 || 30 Clanrats
14 || - spears
4 || - musician
8 || - clawleader
8 || - standard
-----
155

266 || 38 Stormvermin
5 || - musician
10 || - Fangleader
10 || - standard
55 || - Doomflayer
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346


120 || 60 Skavenslaves
2 || - musician
-----
122


= 1000

zielonkak
14-10-2011, 15:46
def gear your characters...they will die againts dwarf characters....

boli
14-10-2011, 16:06
Its quite hard to keep a viable army under 1000 as I've been finding out today; tbh my original idea was queek headtaker and upgraded stormvermin but that'll push the points easily to 1500.

I'm hoping he'll have the same issues with points restriction and my GW upgrade would be enough to break his toughness.

ftayl5
14-10-2011, 21:23
I like this list. Quite a lot.

Why? Because I'm an infantry guy myself and I love seeing lists with tonnes of models.

So:

Warlord - Drop the Great Weapon and take a Halberd. Great Weapon means he'll strike last and probably therefore get killed before he can attack at all. Take a halberd instead. Also I disagree with zielonkak. Yes, Dwarf characters will tear apart your Skaven ones: almost independently of what equipment they have. Whether you buy him 100pts of items, or 2pts, the result will likely be the same: a dead Warlord. So don't waste the points, just try and hide your Warlord.

1st Clanrat unit is good, 2nd one not so much. Spears aren't a good choice.

Compared to hand weapon and shield, you gain a rank of attacks (unless you charged) but lose a 6+ ward save.
When you consider the stat-line and role of Clanrats, it becomes clear that a 6+ Ward Save is infinitely better than 5 more S3 WS3 Attacks. So you're paying 1/2 a point to make your unit worse.
Unless it's just because you love spears or because your models have spears and you think you wont get away with fielding them as HW/S guys; DON'T take spears.

38 Stormvermin are a good unit, but the Doomflayer not so much. This is possibly the worst of the machines accessible to the Stormvermin and it's even worse against Dwarfs, as they can simply shoot it off the board without much hassle.
Drop the Doomflayer, and get the Stormbanner [!]for the unit.
You say you're fighting a very shooty list so, Y U NO TAKE STORMBANNER? It's probably the best anti shooting thing we have!

60 Slaves is good. Hopefully the shooting will be directed at that simply because it's so intimidating and huge! Even if not, this unit will still do well.

The lack of Wizard is not a problem at this points level, especially against Dwarfs where you don't need magic defence at all, and only large amounts of magic offence will actually get through.

But good list mate, well done.

boli
14-10-2011, 23:55
re: storm banner

Yes it is awesome... but I don't want to take it for the reason it *is* so good... I don't have many peeps to play with so I don't want to take a 50pt item which will nuilfy most of his army as it will ruin the game for him... if I ran in a compo I would use it but I wanna get lots of practice in with my skaven.

I know it sounds weird but I wanna win without it.

re: great wep vs halbard

good call I mainly took the gw to nulify the high toughness; but as you said a halbard prob a better choice so I could use my advantage of high inititive


re: spears vs shields/hw

I haven't made the models up yet, but I was thinking of having half my clan rats with spears and half with h/w+s and having the spears as flanking units and the shields as bunkers... are spears really that bad?

re: doomflaye

I haven't played in 8th edition yet but I thought this would work well as a "mini chariot" able to add punch to the storm vermin charge; would it be such a bad purchase? Since you can;t move and fire the guns or fire into combat any war machine would be wasted on the stormvermin EXCEPT the doomflayer... at least that was my reasoning.

ftayl5
15-10-2011, 03:52
Spears vs HW/S:
Yes they really are. Sadly you're paying half a point to make your unit less effective in it's role. Clanrats are not around to kill anything much, they're supposed to provide ranks and steadfast and survive while another unit does the damage (ie. Stormvermin or a Doomwheel if you had one)
And extra 5 S3 WS3 attacks does not help them do this at all and even if you're trying to be offensive with them, they wont help much in that role either. You're paying 14pts for that unit to get 5 more attacks. Not worth it.

Shields however, combined with the hand weapon, grant a 6+ Ward Save!!! That's a amazing! So even against things with incredibly high strength, you Clanrats have a chance of survival! Which inarguably, is what they're supposed to be doing.

Doomflayer

It's not *that* bad but it's not very good either. I think it puts out a fair amount of damage and it does compliment the Stormvermin very well. However the problem is in it getting shot. It's only T3, 1 Wound and with a 5+ armour vs shooting and a 4+ ward if near the parent unit. Sounds okay right? But 1 or 2 volleys of handgun or crossbow fire and it's gone.
Then again that's 1 or2 volleys of fire that aren't hitting the stormers themselves...
May as well keep it actually, seems you're trying to play friendly anyway :)
And I do quite like the model.