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mozart
04-11-2011, 13:36
I am building a new Empire army and have come to unexpectedly own 10 crossbowmen that I had not planned on having due to a trade. So I am trying to figure out what to do with them. Given the low model count, it occurred to me just to use them as an attachment to my unit of 20 Greatswords.But my thought was is this utterly pointless? It seems the whole point of having Crossbows is the increased range. By using them as an attachment, primarily for charge response I may be just wasting them. But I'd like to make use of them somehow.

So what do you guys think?

Wesser
04-11-2011, 13:45
Well unless you feel you need banners for Blood & Glory then take them as 1 or 2 detachments.

Although they dont count for minimum number of core units they dont cause panic either.

Remember that detachment dont have to move with their parent unit, so the above considerations about lack of command group and minimum core is the only reasons not to.

You then have the option of using 2 x 5-man units or 1 10-man.

The 2 units option have the advantage of also being useful as a throwaway unit as well as spreading your assets thus minimizing the impact of being outflanked etc.

They do panic easier though and does take up more space in your battleline though...soo ..a matter of taste

Charistoph
04-11-2011, 17:46
They may not HAVE to move with their parent unit, but in order to gain some of the advantages for being detachments, they have to stay somewhat close, I believe.

If you already have a unit of Handgunners, they may be better suited to detach off of them.

Lathrael
04-11-2011, 19:42
I would rather use crossbowmen as another unit. With some other warmachine, they are priceless to deny regen with flaming banner.

Quinzy
04-11-2011, 20:12
They can S&S if the Greatswords get charged, too.

catbarf
05-11-2011, 06:00
If you don't want to use many of them, a detachment can be useful, although I'd rather have Handgunners for that useful armor piercing. If you intend to have a lot of shooting, I'd say take a 20-man unit with a banner. Basically, if they're there for support, use them in a detachment. If they're an independent force in their own right, use them as a discrete unit.

Lord Solar Plexus
05-11-2011, 07:24
First of all, crossbows are better in every situation that doesn't involve Brets or CW having the first turn.

Secondly, I take crossbow detachments on their own merit. A unit of 10 that doesn't cause panic and can deal with small supporters, 5 Dark Riders or Bats, single Skaven weapon teams, this kind of stuff. Stand and shoot is a secondary consideration.

Korraz
05-11-2011, 08:03
Unless you specifically want HLRs (to take Champions out, so the Captasus can charge in, for example), use Crossbows, and Detachments most of the time.

chamelion 6
06-11-2011, 01:55
They may not HAVE to move with their parent unit, but in order to gain some of the advantages for being detachments, they have to stay somewhat close, I believe.

If you already have a unit of Handgunners, they may be better suited to detach off of them.

Beyond 3 inches of the parent unit a detachment becomes it's own unit, with all the benefits and negatives that implies.

Charistoph
06-11-2011, 06:44
Beyond 3 inches of the parent unit a detachment becomes it's own unit, with all the benefits and negatives that implies.

I thought so, so if you want a shooting unit that is going to be supporting a mobile unit, archers may be better.

That having been said, this is mostly about what to do with the Crossbowmen you already have, and not what you should get.

mozart
07-11-2011, 02:38
Thanks for the very helpful feedback, guys. It appears that I am ok using these guys as a detachment. I'm so obsessed with the idea of using them to S&S that it was difficult just to view them as a useful attachment otherwise. Correction noted. Thanks.

Daniel36
07-11-2011, 10:45
Why did I assemble my men as handgunners and now suddenly read that everyone favours crossbows?

WHY WHY WHY??
(I actually like the look of crossbows better)

freddieyu
07-11-2011, 11:18
Why did I assemble my men as handgunners and now suddenly read that everyone favours crossbows?

WHY WHY WHY??
(I actually like the look of crossbows better)

Make GW and/or your FLGS happy..

Buy crossbowmen....

Korraz
07-11-2011, 13:03
Why did I assemble my men as handgunners and now suddenly read that everyone favours crossbows?

WHY WHY WHY??
(I actually like the look of crossbows better)

The morale: Build what you like, not what the internet tells you to.

Charistoph
07-11-2011, 14:52
Why did I assemble my men as handgunners and now suddenly read that everyone favours crossbows?

WHY WHY WHY??
(I actually like the look of crossbows better)

Because Handguns are deadlier per shot against armored foes than Crossbows?

Because Handguns fit the theme of your army better than Crossbows?

You don't want to be associated with those dirty Dark Elves?

...

That's all I got.

Daniel36
07-11-2011, 15:54
The morale: Build what you like, not what the internet tells you to.
Oh so very, very true. I hope I can remedy my assemblage and turn them into crossbowmen. Not sure how that will work...
I want a competetive army though. I usually go for theme over competetiveness and wanted to do it differently this time.


Because Handguns are deadlier per shot against armored foes than Crossbows?
Because Handguns fit the theme of your army better than Crossbows?
You don't want to be associated with those dirty Dark Elves?

...

That's all I got.

Actually, crossbows fit my army's theme better, and I come across as many armoured foes as those without armour, and I don't really care to be associated with Elves.

So...

Back to the cutting board.

EDIT: Turns out it's not so hard to change them to crossbowmen... But... Now I am in doubt...

Help me out guys. I find theme more important than winning power. What should I do?
I have a Marienburg Mercenary army. Marienburg Mercs are usually pretty rich, so I suppose they can afford guns. On the other hand, crossbows seem more widespread, and for a mercenary army on the move easier to repair.

Which fits the theme best? Crossbows or handguns?

EDIT2: I suppose both fit the theme just fine and I could go for either or even both... Guhhh... Too many choices...

Crovax20
07-11-2011, 16:33
Marienburg, I picture Tilean crossbows... so crossbows

Charistoph
07-11-2011, 17:36
A couple thoughts:
It's easier to retrieve crossbow bolts than handgun slugs.
Gunpowder costs money per shot, pulling the crank costs only time.

Daniel36
07-11-2011, 17:51
Well... We ARE Marienburgers (Dutch), so... Crossbows it will most likely be...

Thanks for that! :)

Oogie boogie boss
08-11-2011, 16:27
As Marienburg is a port, i'd say they are more likely to use Crossbows, as sea water would rust handguns and turn blackpowder into sludge. That's if you are looking at it from a fluff perspective.....