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Strategos
15-11-2011, 21:06
I'm relatively new to fantasy and decided to go with wood elves. I know they have issues but I have one what of question. What if wardancers and dryads could rank up effectively, would the army be considered better? How do you think it would change the army?

ftayl5
15-11-2011, 21:12
It'd help a bit I guess, enabling them to have a rank bonus and hence disrupt the enemies. But they would also lose the -1 to be shot and the 180 degree line of sight. So... it's kind of a win some lose some idea.

I think if they stayed Skirmishers it would better.

The Low King
15-11-2011, 21:21
A points drop, a few stat tweaks for a few units (wardancers, wild riders, glade riders), glade guard bows all round and the ability to kill those massive blocks of steadfast troops (template weapons?).

cyberspite
15-11-2011, 22:36
I wouldn't mind either way for dryads, but it wouldn't really help wardancers, to make the most of it the unit would have to be stupid expensive.

Strategos
15-11-2011, 22:45
As I said I'm still learning but I was just wondering what effect it would have on the army book as a whole. Thanks for the comments.

Korraz
15-11-2011, 22:47
The answer is No.
There are too many issues with that army. Ranking them up would currently probably worsen the situation...

the gribbly
15-11-2011, 23:30
What if wardancers and dryads could rank up effectively, would the army be considered better?
At the same points cost I imagine the army would be alot stronger, but better and stronger are not always the same thing. IMO the army would not be better.


How do you think it would change the army?
Wood elves are synonymous with skirmish. Their identity derives from guerilla warfare and hit & run tactics. Taking skirmish from these units would be the same as taking their identity. I am firmly against such a change.

Here is what I would, and have, proposed. It is a simple errata to the BRB skirmishers section:

Skirmishers and Charging
"If skirmishers declare a charge (or a charge reaction that does not involve fleeing)" ADD- they may immediately attempt a swift reform. Regardless of whether the unit reforms or not, they must then.."..immediately tighten their loose formation into a 'normal' formation.."

The same rule could also be applied to fast cavalry and goes far to represent the loose formations both unit types utilize. Basically the unit could attempt a ld test to do what the skirmishers of 7th edition did naturally, which is spread out up to 2 models wider than the enemy. This proposed version is subject to failed tests and doesnt effect steadfast, step up etc. but does make combat skirmish units hit hard enough to be respected.

theunwantedbeing
16-11-2011, 11:34
But they would also lose the -1 to be shot and the 180 degree line of sight.

Erm...the 180 degree line of sight rule is for a completely different gaming system. Skirmishers have the same line of sight rules as everyone else in warhammer.

TsukeFox
16-11-2011, 11:54
We just need to make an Indy WE book since an 8th edition book is not coming this year or the next

Strategos
16-11-2011, 13:50
That sounds good to me the gribbly but that is a rule book change. I wonder if it is something GW might consider adding as a wood elf universal special rule. As you said wood elves by nature are skirmishers so will they always be weaker in combat than other armies?

the gribbly
16-11-2011, 15:06
That WEs are weaker in cc than other armies is not entirely true. IMO the better WE lists involve heavy cc elements with shooting as a support role only.
In fact WE combat skirmishers were some of the scourges of past editions but to answer your question: it depends on the core rules. I can tell you this, nobody liked being owned by skirmishers in the cc phase. Before 8th edition WE skirmish units were highly feared/respected and even now they can still pull their weight, just not to the front of RnF, and not at all against combat specialists.
Its not the best time to be a WE player its true but this is mostly due to our book being 2editions old. WEs are forced to think outside the box and choose their battles carefully now more than ever, but you can still find success with skirmish heavy list.

popisdead
16-11-2011, 23:22
Dryads need Hatred or ASF and/or the Lore of Beasts on the BranchWraith. Then they are fine.

Initially I wanted them to be RnF but then,... it seems odd to do that. It would take away from the army feel and I'd rather them not start to mimic the other elves.

Wardancers shouldn't rank up. Not their style IMO.

I read a rumour in the contingents about WE getting a reform on the charge for Dryads and Wardancers. That would be pretty useful. Suddenly maximizing attacks on the charge with those? Lots of Init 6 S4 attacks at high WS is good.

Strategos
16-11-2011, 23:40
Dryads need Hatred or ASF and/or the Lore of Beasts on the BranchWraith. Then they are fine.

Initially I wanted them to be RnF but then,... it seems odd to do that. It would take away from the army feel and I'd rather them not start to mimic the other elves.

Wardancers shouldn't rank up. Not their style IMO.

I read a rumour in the contingents about WE getting a reform on the charge for Dryads and Wardancers. That would be pretty useful. Suddenly maximizing attacks on the charge with those? Lots of Init 6 S4 attacks at high WS is good.

I think I read that post too. I don't think it was a rumour though, I think it was a poster giving their opinion on what they think should happen. Really good idea though.

I'm just wracking my brain to try and figure out what the hell they would do with a new army book apart from look at the points cost and bang in some monstrous infantry / cavalry as Gw's current trend seems to involve. Most of the elf models are amazing so I can't see them dropping any of them. Maybe that is why it looks like Woodies are so far away from being redone, the models are too nice?

RanaldLoec
16-11-2011, 23:47
Keep skirmish throw in a we only really that some skirmishing units count ranks for disruption.

So no rank bonuses but an ability to remove the enemy rank bonus giving an incentive to flank and manoeuvre again.

peukestas
17-11-2011, 07:56
After the ''Let's wishlist:Wood Elves'',''New Treeman model'',''Wood elves are broken'' all the possibilities about WEs where thoroughly discussed.... I got bored (and I play WEs myself ) reading the same conversation again and again about wood elves,skirmishing or not etc. What is the point of this thread?

Strategos
21-11-2011, 11:28
Not interested..............dont read.

popisdead
22-11-2011, 20:31
What is the point of this thread?

On an internet forum? ... Really?