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BaronDG
30-11-2011, 19:25
I seem to remember some fluff I read ages ago about warhound titans, that they are always deployed as a pair. I tried, without success, to find it again so I thought someone here might be able to help?

Faeslayer
30-11-2011, 19:29
I seem to remember some fluff I read ages ago about warhound titans, that they are always deployed as a pair. I tried, without success, to find it again so I thought someone here might be able to help?

Well, I found this:
http://warhammer40k.wikia.com/wiki/Titan

I remember that fluff too, but I don't remember the source (prob. one of the Epic books).

AndrewGPaul
30-11-2011, 19:35
Probably 2nd edition Epic Titan Legions Codex Titanicus. Either that or a White Dwarf around the time - say 175 - 185 or thereabouts. It was apparently as a response to the depredations of Deaths Heads traitor Warhound battlegroups during the Heresy.

Lord Damocles
30-11-2011, 19:36
Warhounds have commonly deployed in pairs since forever (and Reavers deploy in threes).

Apocalypse notes that, 'Warhounds often operate in pairs so that they can outmanoeuver and outflank larger titans they might encounter' (pg.12).

Finn
30-11-2011, 19:56
Uh oh. Don't make me make a second Warhound, please.

Cry of the Wind
30-11-2011, 20:27
Also think almost every BL story has them in pairs (until the hero Warlord steps on one or something...).

AndrewGPaul
30-11-2011, 20:53
Warhounds have commonly deployed in pairs since forever (and Reavers deploy in threes).

Apocalypse notes that, 'Warhounds often operate in pairs so that they can outmanoeuver and outflank larger titans they might encounter' (pg.12).

If by "since forever" you mean "since Titan Legions was released in the 90s", then yes. :) Battle Titans of both classes came in Battlegroups of three machines, or singly.

Big Ned
01-12-2011, 05:58
Probably due to the fact that the original blister pack came with two warhound titans.

Griefbringer
01-12-2011, 08:58
Ended up digging my oldest WD issues to see if they would provide some clarification. Their original introduction for Adeptus Titanicus does not mention anything about operating in pairs, as far as I can tell.

Their introduction to Space Marine 2nd edition in WD144 does not mention anything about operating in the pairs in the fluff, but the special card provided for them requires them to be bought in pairs.

Jonny_N
01-12-2011, 09:09
I think there is only one mentioned in the novel 'Soul Hunter'
And the Iron Warriors book, 'Storm Of Iron' describes a pair working together.

AndrewGPaul
01-12-2011, 09:32
Ended up digging my oldest WD issues to see if they would provide some clarification. Their original introduction for Adeptus Titanicus does not mention anything about operating in pairs, as far as I can tell.

Their introduction to Space Marine 2nd edition in WD144 does not mention anything about operating in the pairs in the fluff, but the special card provided for them requires them to be bought in pairs.

The battle report in WD136 has Andy Chambers using a pair of Warhounds, but my copy is damaged so it doesn't have Andy's pre-battle writeup; I don't know if he just had the points spare for two or if there was another reason.

The fluff reason came in 2nd edition Titan Legions, or a White Dwarf of the period, as I mentioned.

BaronDG
01-12-2011, 11:02
Thanks alot! Trying to motivate myself to finish the second warhound now. Then I have to figure out a good apocalypse formation for the pair...

MajorWesJanson
01-12-2011, 12:44
Scout titans are generally fielded as pairs, or occasionally as singles.

Battle titans tend to be singles or a battle group of 3.

Emperor titans are singletons, unless they are part of the Legio Ordo Sinister.

Sildani
01-12-2011, 13:08
Eldar Revenants are usually fielded in pairs piloted by twins.

In the novel Titanicus, the Legio Invicta Warhounds are deployed as two, but on opposite flanks, so in essence they're operating alone.

Inquisitor Kallus
01-12-2011, 13:11
Scout titans are generally fielded as pairs, or occasionally as singles.

Battle titans tend to be singles or a battle group of 3.

Emperor titans are singletons, unless they are part of the Legio Ordo Sinister.

When they are 12...........scary:eek:

Yeah, if youre gonna make the Hounds a formation, some kind of Flank March/Outflank/Scouting move before the game would suit them down to the ground.

Griefbringer
01-12-2011, 16:08
The battle report in WD136 has Andy Chambers using a pair of Warhounds, but my copy is damaged so it doesn't have Andy's pre-battle writeup; I don't know if he just had the points spare for two or if there was another reason.


My copy is undamaged - and no, there is no special reason given for taking a pair of them.

As for the concept of scout titans, that is something that puzzles me a bit. While the Warhounds are on the smaller end of the scale for titans, they are still the size of a house and not exactly stealthy.

prowla
01-12-2011, 20:01
As for the concept of scout titans, that is something that puzzles me a bit. While the Warhounds are on the smaller end of the scale for titans, they are still the size of a house and not exactly stealthy.

They're still easier to hide behind a burning steel mill than their big cousins.. Simply put, they are the smallest, lightest and fastest titans, so they have the scouting/flanking role. I would say they lead the titans into conflict areas when no recon is available, but then again, no-one seems to share any recon info in 40k anyway.

Which reminds me, there's a classic Amiga game called Walker, that's basically Warhound the Arcade Game!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzmEJWjcwms

Wishing
01-12-2011, 22:02
I also think it's simply because in the old epic rules you could only buy them as a pair, not individually. As the rules were, so became the fluff (or at least was influenced).

AlphariusOmegon20
02-12-2011, 05:16
Also think almost every BL story has them in pairs (until the hero Warlord steps on one or something...).

Dan Abnett's Titanicus. ;)

AndrewGPaul
02-12-2011, 07:34
I also think it's simply because in the old epic rules you could only buy them as a pair, not individually. As the rules were, so became the fluff (or at least was influenced).

The question then becomes why 2nd edition Space Marineintroduced that rule? After all, Special Cards ranged from Space Marine commanders to Warlord titans. It's not like they had to include two Warhounds to keep the power levels even.

Did they come two to a blister in Adeptus Titanicus days?

Wishing
02-12-2011, 07:57
The question then becomes why 2nd edition Space Marineintroduced that rule? After all, Special Cards ranged from Space Marine commanders to Warlord titans. It's not like they had to include two Warhounds to keep the power levels even.

Did they come two to a blister in Adeptus Titanicus days?

Good point, and the Lord of Battles came as one model per card and was a similar model type to the warhound. Could you really field individual warhounds in AT?

MarcoSkoll
02-12-2011, 12:23
As for the concept of scout titans, that is something that puzzles me a bit.
Reconnaissance doesn't necessarily have to be stealthy. It's merely an attempt to explore beyond the main body of the friendly force to determine information about enemy forces or features of the environment.

I could see a large part of a Warhound's role simply being to investigate the terrain to work out what areas and routes the larger titans can safely traverse.

Lyonator
03-12-2011, 00:24
/Agree with Marco.

A scout titan is just that... a titanic scout.
By our normal skirmish standards, not sneaky.
Compared to something bigger? Oh boy, yeah.
Looking at it from an 'Epic' POV helps.

pyrosocial
03-12-2011, 23:56
I think it only applies to imperial titans. Back in the heresy, the dark mechanicus used a large group of warhounds to kill innocent civilians, and because of this it was ordered that they are never to be more then two to a group.

However, in titanicus, 3 chaos ones are on patrol in a dessert area.

KingDeath
04-12-2011, 00:07
Well, one reason why Warhounds might hunt in pairs is that they are ambush predators. One plays bait while the other patiently waits for the kill. Alternatively one drives the prey into the others guns.
This way one titan would always be able to outflank the pair's prey which allows both to deal with much larger engines than two individualy acting warhounds could bring down.

silentsmoke
04-12-2011, 13:37
Warhounds in pairs, hence why i have two for my army....

The Marshall
04-12-2011, 16:07
"Warhounds almost invariably operate in pairs so that they can outmanoeuvre or outgun almost any opponent..."

Pg 18 Codex Titanicus.

MajorWesJanson
05-12-2011, 06:45
Also remember that two Warhounds are four times as dangerous as one is

Kiarr
05-12-2011, 07:37
Warhounds are designed to operate in pairs just like packs of dogs one distracts the oppponent with speed making best use of the terrain whilst the other gets behind and gets the killing shot off whilst the larger titan isnt looking.

I would imagine that the pair would be the minimum amount to go out in a single group and that you would have packs of 4-5 out milling around single titans - for their size and expense to build I would imagine that you would get 3 warhounds for a single reaver (at least in build time as you could have all of them built at once)
on apoc scale battles (those that dont have entire legions of titans!) I would imagine that the purpose of a warhound pair would be to relay terrain/tactical info (would imagine automatically) and activly look for a way to get past any chink in the defence of the oposition then sprint through and blow any artillery and command and control to little pieces rather than sit there in a slogging match with tanks (although after the arty is taken care of I would imagine that they would take great glee in coming around behind the enemy at speed taking pot shots!)

As for actully answering the question - what the Marshall said :)

AndrewGPaul
05-12-2011, 08:30
"Warhounds almost invariably operate in pairs so that they can outmanoeuvre or outgun almost any opponent..."

Pg 18 Codex Titanicus.

Which one? The supplement for 1st edition Adeptus Titanicus or the book in 2nd edition Titan Legions?

Wishing, I'd need to check the rules, but I think you could field as many or as few titans as you wanted in Adeptus Titanicus. Even with the addition of infantry and vehicles in Space Marine and Codex Titanicus, the Titans were the "main force" in AT games, so you could simply field whichever ones you wanted. as Griefbringer points out (http://www.warseer.com/forums/showpost.php?p=5944562&postcount=16), the one 1st edition Epic battle report has two Warhounds fielded, but only because Andy Chambers had the points free for two.

If you think the idea of a Warhound being a scout titan is silly, Adeptus Titanicus originally included "recce" versions of the Warlord (subsequently retconned as being field expedients when Reavers or Warhounds weren't available) - fewer void shields, no carapace weapons and somewhat faster than "line of battle" Warlords.

laudarkul
05-12-2011, 08:30
In Titanicus i think it was a battle in which 3 Chaos Warhound crippled an Imperial Warlord. And after that, 3 Warlord and a Reaver hunted one of the beast (the other two were destroyed).

The Marshall
10-12-2011, 19:22
Which one? The supplement for 1st edition Adeptus Titanicus or the book in 2nd edition Titan Legions?



Titan Legions

MarcoSkoll
11-12-2011, 01:11
I would imagine that the pair would be the minimum amount to go out in a single group and that you would have packs of 4-5 out milling around single titans.
Not if they're Imperial titans. As Pyrosocial says, Imperial edict forbids the use of larger units of Warhounds ever since Horus released them in units of several to massacre civilians.