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Ericsson Rotary Biscuit
11-12-2011, 21:03
Still new to the game and something came up last night whilst playing Skaven.

Since the doomwheel has to fire at the nearest unit during the shooting phase, do I fire at the nearest unit to it's base or the nearest unit in it's front arc?

My wheel pretty much won the game for me even though my friend and I took it to mean closest unit period which meant I ended up shooting my own units a bunch of times, but it just seems odd that it has to shoot at stuff that's behind it. Couldn't find anywhere in the rulebook or armybook that stated otherwise though.

Am I missing something?

Korraz
11-12-2011, 21:07
Use the base.

RealMikeBob
11-12-2011, 21:09
Yep, sounds like you were playing it right. It always targets the closest unit, regardless of direction.

Ericsson Rotary Biscuit
11-12-2011, 21:19
Cool. Thanks guys.

Malaphusis
11-12-2011, 22:29
This question is unrelated to the thread, but as a new forum member I cannot create a thread without two posts. My question is whether any unit with ballistic skill (of 1 or higher) can "shoot," or whether the unit's models must also be equipped with ranged weapons to shoot. Very basic question here but I'm completely new to the game and couldn't find an answer in my rulebook. Thanks!

linuvian
11-12-2011, 22:53
A unit can only shoot use a weapon that they are also equipped with in their profile, so if a unit doesn't have a longbow (or any other ranged weapon) they can't use it to shoot. The only weapon that all models in the game come equipped with and can always use are hand weapons for close combat.

Welcome to Warhammer fantasy though! Let us know if you have any other questions!

Malaphusis
11-12-2011, 23:04
A unit can only shoot use a weapon that they are also equipped with in their profile, so if a unit doesn't have a longbow (or any other ranged weapon) they can't use it to shoot. The only weapon that all models in the game come equipped with and can always use are hand weapons for close combat.

Welcome to Warhammer fantasy though! Let us know if you have any other questions!

Thanks for the response! That eliminates some confusion. Here's a follow-up question: I've purchased the "Island of Blood" starter set, which includes two units of Skaven Clanrats. Now, although this unit isn't equipped with ranged weaponry, it does have a ballistic skill value of 3. So I'm wondering whether a player has the option of attaching skaven arms equipped with, say, bows (if such a thing is even sold/available) to their models, thereby giving the unit the option of a ranged attack. If not, I'm curious as to why the unit would still have a BS value. Thanks!

Arnizipal
12-12-2011, 11:57
Thanks for the response! That eliminates some confusion. Here's a follow-up question: I've purchased the "Island of Blood" starter set, which includes two units of Skaven Clanrats. Now, although this unit isn't equipped with ranged weaponry, it does have a ballistic skill value of 3. So I'm wondering whether a player has the option of attaching skaven arms equipped with, say, bows (if such a thing is even sold/available) to their models, thereby giving the unit the option of a ranged attack. If not, I'm curious as to why the unit would still have a BS value. Thanks!
If you buy the Skaven army book, you'll be able to see what kind of equipment options each Skaven model has.

That said, the statline for clanrats represent a standard Skaven warrior. Even though its Ballistic Skill stat isn't used because it is armed with close combat weapons only, the stat is still displayed for completeness.

Metacarpi
12-12-2011, 12:15
What Arnizipal said.

Clan Rats don't have an option for being equipped with range weapons, so the BS listed in their statline is redundant, and only there for completeness.

Having said that, there are units within the Skaven army that have options for shooting. For example, Slaves can be equipped with Slings if I remember correctly (I don't have my Army Book with me, and never use Slaves).

T10
12-12-2011, 12:32
Yep, sounds like you were playing it right. It always targets the closest unit, regardless of direction.

Not that I agree or disagree, but what makes you say you ignore the normal shooting restrictions regarding the shooting model's front arc? I do not recall any specific exception.

-T10

Metacarpi
12-12-2011, 13:32
Not that I agree or disagree, but what makes you say you ignore the normal shooting restrictions regarding the shooting model's front arc? I do not recall any specific exception.

-T10

Army Book > BRB

And the Army Book states that the ZZZzzap! attack hits the nearest unit, and if that unit is wiped out by the first bolt, the next one strikes the second nearest unit etc.

No specification of within forward arc.

RealMikeBob
12-12-2011, 15:15
A specific exception that states explicitly it can shoot targets outside the forward arc? Doesn't seem to have one that spells it out as clearly as that. What it does say is that the Doomwheel "targets the nearest unit (friend or foe) regardless of terrain or line of sight".

Korraz
12-12-2011, 16:02
Not that I agree or disagree, but what makes you say you ignore the normal shooting restrictions regarding the shooting model's front arc? I do not recall any specific exception.

-T10

You aren't picking a target. It simply hits something, automatically.

T10
12-12-2011, 16:38
No specification of within forward arc.

Surely, leaving out mention of the standard rules for shooting should mean that APPLY, not that they are ignored! To override them you would need a statement to that effect, e.g.: "The target model need not be in the Doom Wheel's forward arc."

Remember that these days the line of sight shooting restriction (which the Zzzzap! rules specifically let us ignore) is separate from the forward arc restriction. Sure, if the forward arc restriction applies, then the Doom Wheel performs differently from how it used to, but the same can be said for a lot of units with special rules like Frenzy, Stupidity or Fear.

I'm still on the fence on this one since I can well remember how the Doom Wheel has worked since 4th edition, and forward-arc-only has never been an issue. But consider how a completely new player would see it. It seems to me that he'd apply all the shooting rules he can.

SteelTitan
14-12-2011, 08:39
Interesting point T10. Without any prior knowledge of Fantasy, that would actually be more logical.

Imagine that a normal unit of lets say Empire handgunners having the same rule (i.e. target closest unit, ignore terrain and LoS). Wouldn't you there too only take units in its front arc?

RealMikeBob
14-12-2011, 17:03
I can see your point T10. To be honest I feel that this can mostly be put down to not having a clear cut ruling, since we are trying to apply a rule written for 7th into the 8th ed framework. But the intention for it is clearly to shoot whatever is closest, in any direction. In the real world though (as real as it gets in a game of tiny plastic solders anyway) I doubt anyone would have a problem with playing it this way. Since 9 times out of 10 the closest unit is one of the skaven units in an arc other than the front! At least when I play anyway.