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ehlijen
13-12-2011, 02:22
Hello,

Is there or has there ever been a Terminator model with a plasma weapon of some kind?

The only legal way for that to happen I can think of is a character with a combi plasma, but I don't recall such a model.

If there isn't, what would the background and game balance reason be, you think?

I'm thinking it might have something to do with terminators not wanting to throw plasma blasts all over their close quarter boarding actions (that they were originally intended for)?

I mean, terminators can carry bigger than normal missile launchers + other weapons, so why not a plasma cannon?

I was just curiously wondering, as I have a spare terminator and plasma cannon lying around and the mind screamed 'combine!' at me...

pun3d
13-12-2011, 02:50
I wouldn't want my terminator melting himself.

carldooley
13-12-2011, 02:58
obliterators?

the previous Space Marines Codex. Sergeant with Terminator Armor and plasma pistol?

ehlijen
13-12-2011, 03:04
True, forgot about obliterators. Thanks.

But in no SM codex I remember could you keep the plasma pistol if you bought termie armour (though you could keep all sorts of other nonsense such as sniper rifles (I have a model for that!)).

edit:

I wouldn't want my terminator melting himself.

But wasn't terminator armour developed from worker suits used to maintain active plasma reactors, ie would be almost plasma proof and thus the best possible deployment platform for plasma weapons?

Chem-Dog
13-12-2011, 03:21
The ultras had a 1st Captain who possessed a "Plasma Blastgun" or something equally silly. If plasmagun = boltgun, plasma blastgun = stormbolter. This was back in 2nd ed though. There was, I think, a wargear card for it published in WD (the UK copy at least).

I've always been puzzled why Terminators didn't heft Multimeltas about, considering their need to occasionally breach bulkheads and the like (the stated purpose for a Chain Fist) the Short range and heft of the weapon would be totally mitigated by the Terminator's field of expertise, boarding actions/tunnel fighting. Can't see many armies putting up a significant resistance againt that!

chromedog
13-12-2011, 03:58
THE WD version of Invictus was 3rd edition, not 2nd edition (weapon stats had an AP value, not a save modifier, that's the big difference) - one of the few WDs I still have from that era.
Ultramarines captain blow-hard with plasma blastgun (but it was a conversion using the metal Terminator captain model with two plasma pistol bits modifying his stormbolter).

There was never an official figure, just a conversion.

Didn't play SM in 2nd ed (or much of my eldar, either. Was too busy clubbing and partying).

Beppo1234
13-12-2011, 04:03
TermI librarian comes with a plasma if I remember correctly

insectum7
13-12-2011, 04:17
He was 3rd edition, not 2nd edition

Captain Invictus was in 2nd edition as well. I believe the "Plasma Blastgun" wargear card was printed in the UM codex too. I used the **** out of him. :)

Nowadays you can give a Captain Terminator Armor and a Combi-Plasma. Presumably that's available in most Marine codexes, including Chaos.

bam4k
13-12-2011, 06:50
TermI librarian comes with a plasma if I remember correctly

yes, a combi plasma

Chem-Dog
13-12-2011, 07:25
Captain Invictus was in 2nd edition as wellfirst.

There, I fixed that :cool:
:p

Vaktathi
13-12-2011, 08:00
CSM and SW Terminators can take combi-plasma guns, but that's about as widespread as you're likely to see it.

Honestly, there's no reason why terminators can't have more heavy weapons except that GW just hasn't given them the option or made the models, it'd be really cool to have terminator fire support units, they just haven't done it. The armor shouldn't have any troubles accommodating such weapons.

Beppo1234
13-12-2011, 08:29
CSM and SW Terminators can take combi-plasma guns, but that's about as widespread as you're likely to see it.

Honestly, there's no reason why terminators can't have more heavy weapons except that GW just hasn't given them the option or made the models, it'd be really cool to have terminator fire support units, they just haven't done it. The armor shouldn't have any troubles accommodating such weapons.

might have to do with game balance and mobile heavy weapons

Vaktathi
13-12-2011, 08:38
might have to do with game balance and mobile heavy weapons

Given what we've already got in the game currently, it's hard to see where it'd be a huge issue, especially considering they'd likely be 250-300something point units when we've already got 130pt vendettas, 140pt psyrifleman dreads, 50pt T6 2W/4+sv/BS4/no LoS/2 shot/S8 Hive Guard, heavily discounted BA Fast razorbacks sporting long range AT guns, etc.

It's hard to see where a squad of terminators that could take PC's or Lascannons would be too broken at an appropriate cost, especially as they'd likely still be paying for powerweapons/fists that they won't really be using. If you took a squad of 5 termi's with lascannons and powerweapons that cost 275pts, it's hard to see that being outrageously broken in the current metagame, especially if they were an HS choice.

Askari
13-12-2011, 09:09
It would even make shooty-style Terminators a viable alternative to the Storm Shield variety, due to the lack of need to transport.

I'm all for Devastator-Terminators, it'd be awesome.

MajorWesJanson
13-12-2011, 09:19
It would even make shooty-style Terminators a viable alternative to the Storm Shield variety, due to the lack of need to transport.

I'm all for Devastator-Terminators, it'd be awesome.

I'd love a special character where your Termies could take 2 Heavy Weapons per 5 instead of 1.

The bearded one
13-12-2011, 10:21
Devastator terminators....
Devastinators!
Termistators!


It'd be funky though. I rarely see anyone use a regular unit of terminators with powerfists and stormbolters when the option for TH/SS terminators exists. Terminator suits were designed to work on the inside of plasma reactors in the first place, so it's kinda weird they're not toting a bag ful of plasma weapons.

NixonAsADaemonPrince
13-12-2011, 10:28
I know someone who has a unit of 5 converted Termies all with Assault Cannon and Storm Shield. They look completely badass and if it became a legal configuration it would be very nice indeed.

insectum7
13-12-2011, 10:31
It's hard to see where a squad of terminators that could take PC's or Lascannons would be too broken at an appropriate cost, especially as they'd likely still be paying for powerweapons/fists that they won't really be using. If you took a squad of 5 termi's with lascannons and powerweapons that cost 275pts, it's hard to see that being outrageously broken in the current metagame, especially if they were an HS choice.

No thank you. I prefer my Vanilla marines to stay vanilla. Besides that's the territory of Obliterators, and I'd rather they keep the characteristics of what makes them special to themselves.

They could boost the Assault Cannon again and all your Terminator problems would be solved. As it is I still think they are quite good. *

I'd rather see the Heavy Plasma Gun available on the Land Speeder for old-times sake.

Edit: *Or bring the Storm Shield back down to something reasonable.

destroyerlord
13-12-2011, 10:32
In the background dreadnoughts were used as a more stable test platform for weapons to mount on terminator suits, thus why chaos termies have reapers while loyalists have assault cannons. Perhaps the lack of technological development post heresy was the reason why they never developed melta/plasma mounts?
Of course the real reason is because it would have been mega cheese in 3rd edition and termies haven't been developed since then (except for continually improving the cyclone launcher to make it useful).

RunepriestRidcully
13-12-2011, 10:33
Perhaps have it as an option for chaos? ie at the time of the heresy they could not accomadate a plasma cannon/multie melta onto power armour (or at least that is the excuse given) and with the ad mech being more open then it was now, they could have started using them on terminators as they were brought in, as it became easier to use it with power armour the terminator mounted plasma cannons and multie meltas fell out of favour with the exception of the multie melta with the salamanders. Gives chaos some more long range puch whilst also being different from loyalists.

Khorneguy
13-12-2011, 10:39
wouldn't be surprised to see a devastator-style terminator unit in the new DA codex when they get round to it. It would give the DA back something unique, after every 5th ed book's been stealing their ideas

Bunnahabhain
13-12-2011, 10:43
My marine codex re-write give terminators up to 2 heavy weapons in a squad of 5. That, and cuts Storm shields down to a 4++, was my best guess to balance the two types...

The other reason that terminators don't have many heavy weapons is the armour itself isn't common, so not using it at its best, i.e. close range actions, is a bit of a waste.

I agree game balance wouldn't suffer too much if you allow them more or different heavy weapons, but I don' think there is any need to do it.

ODINM4
13-12-2011, 10:50
ive modelled two termie wolfguards with assault cannons and cyclones like dawn of war two

PatrikW
13-12-2011, 11:08
One (for me at least) reasonable background explanation might be..

Terminators primary use was for clearing space hulks, meaning narrow corridors, low visibility and often the possibility of ambush from genstealers or others. So suddenly one of your comrades could be fighting for his life, in such a situation you might not have time time to help him in hand to hand so you try to blast the thing that is attacking him. Now all weapons carried by the terminators give themselves a great chance of survival after getting hit by the weapons. But if you ad in plasma or multimeltas you would probably fry both the attacker and the terminator.

wxyz
13-12-2011, 15:25
The weapon of Captain Invictus isn't a Plasma Blaster.
Plasma Blastgun is a Titan-weapon.

self biased
13-12-2011, 16:09
wouldn't be surprised to see a devastator-style terminator unit in the new DA codex when they get round to it. It would give the DA back something unique, after every 5th ed book's been stealing their ideas

deathwing devastators. a capital idea, and one i've been screaming for for years.