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Forsworn
15-01-2012, 02:46
Outside of ret-conned armies (Squats aren't coming back, damn it), do you think there are any races that could be added into the game?

I honestly can't think of anything that even matches the Tau by itself. Maybe some kind of coalition of various xenos races? That actually doesn't seem like such a bad idea. The only small issue would be that some factions (Eldar, Orks, Kroot) sometimes work as mercenaries. It would be hard to justify not having these guys capable of working with them.


I *do* maintain that factions (Space Marine Chapters, Guard Regiments, Craftworlds) should not be added. Frankly, I'm of the opinion that we should stop adding new types of Space Marines and such (heck, even consolidate the more similar ones). More options is a good thing, no?

Abaraxas
15-01-2012, 04:12
Not that I play the current game, but Id go for NO because Gw in all honesty cant keep up with the armies they already have on the go.

madprophet
15-01-2012, 04:19
Rumor has it that the Tau will be getting some new alien allies - like expanded Squats... er... I mean Demiurg.

Worship
15-01-2012, 04:21
I do much more modeling than wargaming, so I don't know how it would affect the current game's state. I always welcome the idea of new race(s)

The idea of Hrud as a playable race that came up a while ago seemed really cool.

Inquisitor Aaron
15-01-2012, 04:31
I wouldn't be surprised that if down the line factions like the Admech or the Hrud were added.

linuvian
15-01-2012, 05:16
Admech is the most obvious, and fluff exists for Hrud, demiurg, plus a host of other races that could easily spout up in a 'hidden sector' of space (yu'vath, q'orl, nekulli, xenarchs, etc) - or suddenly start expanding their empire suddenly (a la when Tau first popped up).

Personally I don't think 40k will expand, they have been expanding enough into the space marine factions so that each faction is getting its own full army book to the point there are (IMO) too many armies for GW to keep up on consistently cycling through to update as needed. I don't think GW can handle any more armies based on their current SOP for rules updating.

Noobie2k7
15-01-2012, 05:27
It does upset me that GW wasted valuable army slots on just more SM armies when they could have brought back Squats like they did Necrons or introduced more unique races like the Tau.

Beppo1234
15-01-2012, 05:33
Not that I play the current game, but Id go for NO because Gw in all honesty cant keep up with the armies they already have on the go.

I'd disagree with this in a year or so. What's taken a long time, is for GW to flesh out their existing armies with solid plastic kits. Most armies, if not by now, in the near future will have plastic kits for most of their core units and FC for their others. After the 6th edition revolution of codex updates, I expect that all armies will have the new shiny kits for all their units (excluding those that are earmarked as conversion only concepts). The model updates on kits that we have seen over the course of 5th edition will have a long life. Once GW gets through the BT and Chaos updates, there will be no armies that require a full model make-over.

Model updates will be getting smaller in the near future for each subsequent codex release, probably just 1 or 2 units per codex, unless they introduce a lot of new units. So it opens up a lot of room for new factions to be introduced.

I think we could see a new army or two in the future

hazmiter
15-01-2012, 05:44
*starts converting eye of terror wulfen squads*
Hey the 13th company, now that's what I want, but didn't get, so I didn't go space wolves.
Did find the stats for them though.

A new playable race would be fun, or a faction.... Come on, how about something that preys on nids.....

Noobie2k7
15-01-2012, 06:41
Tbh if somehow GW could just make all FW lists legal for evereything then that would sort things out too. That would unlock a rather large load of new lists for people.

KarlPedder
15-01-2012, 06:54
People get far too caught up on rules. X army having to wait longer for an update is not going to be a factor in introducing a new army. Indeed Beppo is on the right track I'd argue that a point is fast approaching where an entirely new faction will actually be quite financially viable from GWs perspective. Remember it's all about the models and there is a point where an entirely new army with an entirely new model range has the potential to generate profits greater than redoing or adding models to an existing army.

An existing army has a built in customer base true but that built in customer base often the worst kind of customer who already have much of the existing range and we reach a point where every unit already has a plastic kit and the army is already bloated with units.

Also while it's possible to generate interest in an existing army through an update with folks who had no prior interest an entirely new force has the largest potential "new" customer base.

igwarlord
15-01-2012, 07:12
As much as people say they hate the more SM dexes the only problem is that they are money makers since they have to release only 2 or 3 boxes and a half dozen resin and its "HEY LOOK A NEW ARMY! JUST USE ALL OF THIS ARMIES STUFF FOR THESE UNITS AND TADA ITS NEW AND SHINY ______ MARINES!"

Although I admit I would love a new race or 2 the only problem is how do you NOT make them just like other armies? lots of good saves? well that's SM lots of assaulters? well that's Orks. lots of tanks? that's guard. Lots of monstrous creatures? that's NIds.

the problem is how do you make a new race that is still balanced and not a copy of the old ones?


After all that I still say

HELL YES I WANT MORE RACES! I want the laer (I think thats the spelling) they were fish people or admech or hurd or squats or even a mechanicus (both light side and dark side in 1 book please)

KarlPedder
15-01-2012, 07:18
Although I admit I would love a new race or 2 the only problem is how do you NOT make them just like other armies? lots of good saves? well that's SM lots of assaulters? well that's Orks. lots of tanks? that's guard. Lots of monstrous creatures? that's NIds.

the problem is how do you make a new race that is still balanced and not a copy of the old ones?

Considering of the what 16 existing armies 7 of them are some flavour of SM or another I really don't think a new army needs to be anything more than a little bit different from existing armies to qualify.

igwarlord
15-01-2012, 07:23
Considering of the what 16 existing armies 7 of them are some flavour of SM or another I really don't think a new army needs to be anything more than a little bit different from existing armies to qualify.


thats just it though. A new SM dex can still be the same and be "new" while being just like the old crap you already had. how do you enter a new army and not be like the others is the question there are only 5 sides of the dice that you can use to do any good with.

hazmiter
15-01-2012, 07:40
Make a race that comes out into its own field, maybe having poison attacks all round, and very few massive armoured things, make them tough to kill, but limited....
Oops, necrons last ed had that.....

KarlPedder
15-01-2012, 08:07
thats just it though. A new SM dex can still be the same and be "new" while being just like the old crap you already had. how do you enter a new army and not be like the others is the question there are only 5 sides of the dice that you can use to do any good with.

I don't know I think a Hrud high model count army that uses Stealth/Tau stealthsuit NF effects on nearly every unit could be made to play unique enough. It's not just about base profiles, but the profile of standard issue weapons and what weapon upgrades are available and how freely available they are, the mechanics of their vehicles, the ratio of CC to ranged effectiveness. There are a bunch of variables that can effect how an army plays just because X army already does Y doesn't mean you can't mix and match certain traits to get a different result.

Indeed I'd argue that at this stage the biggest impediment to more diverse armies is how plainly superior mech is to horde in the current rules set than all the profile combinations and themes being used already.

Vipoid
15-01-2012, 11:48
Outside of ret-conned armies (Squats aren't coming back, damn it), do you think there are any races that could be added into the game?

Honestly, no.

It's possible that they could think of another race to add, but the tricky part would be making it suitably different in rules and gameplay from all other races.

Even now, several of the armies are encroaching on the space of others, and GW's creativity department just comes up with "Yet more marines".

Noobie2k7
15-01-2012, 11:53
Inb4ImperialFistCodex

althathir
15-01-2012, 16:47
I'm sure one could but I'm not sure if it would be good a ideal. 5th edition with its emphasis on troops really put a lot of the older dexes in really bad shape, and I think there would be a backlash if GW released something new before them.

the1stpip
15-01-2012, 17:23
As previously mentioned, Admech and Hrud are options, as are Harlequins, Exodites, Chaos expansions (LatD, Mutants, Chaos guard, Legions (already rumoured)). None of these are new races, having been in the background forever almost.

One of the interesting tidbits I heard (large quantities of salt) was that the Nids are not invading, but fleeing a bigger bad.

mdeceiver79
15-01-2012, 17:35
I would like smaller codices (such as the kroot merc lists)

Make them too expensive to field as a competative army (so balance and playtesting will take less time) but giving the option to flavour up a current army.

Maybe a full on codex mercenaries. All units are an elite choice you may add to another army, expensive but highly customisable. Mostly with 3 bs, str and toughness. Or stats to keep them up with the race they are from.

Noobie2k7
15-01-2012, 17:42
Kinda like the dogs of war book for WHFB?

mdeceiver79
15-01-2012, 18:41
Kinda like the dogs of war book for WHFB?

Yes, it would help add flavour to armies in friendly games. Also adding a wide range of conversion opportunities.

Veteran Sergeant
15-01-2012, 18:50
It does upset me that GW wasted valuable army slots on just more SM armies when they could have brought back Squats like they did Necrons or introduced more unique races like the Tau.
GW does more Space Marine armies because Space Marines sell the most models. /shrug. This is a symptom, not the disease.

Noobie2k7
15-01-2012, 18:54
I just remembered i actually designed a race for W40K for a school project way back when. Wish i still had all the papers, be cool to see it and update it. Was a race of really tiny creatures that used geomancy (like terrain manipulation) to help fight and stuff.

brightblade
15-01-2012, 19:01
I should think the only really obvious one is admech. Not really sure if they can bring an entirely new faction, one we have never heard of, out. Some kind of provenance in the 40k universe would be required to make it easy, accessable and sellable. Admech fits that. Just as traitor guard seems likely in a new chaos dex. It is more obvious they will expand each army with a couple of new cool vehicles/units each time they update a dex, to keep us hooked.

Having said that, SQUATS, for the greater good! :p

althathir
15-01-2012, 19:06
I should think the only really obvious one is admech. Not really sure if they can bring an entirely new faction, one we have never heard of, out. Some kind of provenance in the 40k universe would be required to make it easy, accessable and sellable. Admech fits that. Just as traitor guard seems likely in a new chaos dex. It is more obvious they will expand each army with a couple of new cool vehicles/units each time they update a dex, to keep us hooked.

Having said that, SQUATS, for the greater good! :p

What would be nice imo would be them making them more of an ally dex to imperial fractions so more of a small supplement, then making a merc book for xenos fractions.

mdeceiver79
15-01-2012, 19:12
I should think the only really obvious one is admech.

Admech might be doable via another list. If chaos legions includes any kind of cultists or non marine infantry then these could be "count as" skitarrii and defilers as some kind of admech walkers. Admech as be proxied for by a number of different armies.

New armies and new models also mean more space in stores needs to be taken to advertise these armies. So the a new army might inhibit the sales figures of another army.

For these reasons I don't think admech will be a new army.

It seems armies are made to target a certain market. The tau for example have been speculated to have been targetted at the asian market.
I can't think of any army which fills a niche which isnt already slightly occupied by another army. It is a huge investment by gamesworkshop to make a new army, sacrificing the sales of other models so they'll only do it if there is a void which can be exploited.

Disturbed Frog
15-01-2012, 19:13
I'de find it interesting to see if there really was a race chasing the nids and how bad ass it would be!

Vipoid
15-01-2012, 19:25
I'de find it interesting to see if there really was a race chasing the nids and how bad ass it would be!

It was generally assumed that nids were spreading out from somewhere - possibly one or more galaxies they'd already wiped clean of life.

It would be an interesting twist if they actually turned out to be *fleeing* something, rather than invading.

itcamefromthedeep
15-01-2012, 19:47
Outside of ret-conned armies (Squats aren't coming back, damn it), do you think there are any races that could be added into the game?
Absolutely. There's plenty of design space left.

Consider an army consisting entirely of Monstrous Creatures. Nothing smaller than a 60mm base.


It would be an interesting twist if they actually turned out to be *fleeing* something, rather than invading.
It was floated as a possibility in several Tyranid books now.

It's a shame they filled in the blank of the Ghoul Stars with Necrons. That could have been interesting.

The best candidates for books in humble opinion at this point are the Adeptus Mechanicus and the Lost and the Damned (mortal followers of Chaos who aren't Marines).

Genestealer Cults apparently don't have a place in the Tyranid codex, but it would be hard to turn them into real army in their own right. Theoretically Genestealer Cults could sit as an option in a Lost and the Damned codex. There are problems there, but perhaps not insurmountable ones.

Veteran Sergeant
15-01-2012, 19:54
Genestealer cult can easily be their own army if they are supported by Imperial Guard style troops and armor representing corrupted PDF. That was the way they were written in 2nd and 3rd Edition.

Blackhoof
15-01-2012, 23:47
I heartily support an admech codex. People underestimate how powerful they are. From titanicus, it is clear that the admech technically is not part of the imperium, but a closely allied faction that considers itself separate from the imperium. In concept, I would say that they would be a cross between marines and guard, with cybernetically and biologically enhanced infantry, backed up by crazy tech, the best tanks in the imperium, and Knights (mini-titans). However, they would not be as numerous as the guard of course.

Okuto
16-01-2012, 00:04
I can never see GW introducing a new race if it keeps up deciding every marine ought to get their own dex......

As long as we have these power armored loonies in line, I don't see room for any new army besides a new power armored one....

Brother Dimetrius
16-01-2012, 00:11
Fishmen.

Obviously.

Beppo1234
16-01-2012, 01:48
Admech might be doable via another list. If chaos legions includes any kind of cultists or non marine infantry then these could be "count as" skitarrii and defilers as some kind of admech walkers. Admech as be proxied for by a number of different armies.

New armies and new models also mean more space in stores needs to be taken to advertise these armies. So the a new army might inhibit the sales figures of another army.

For these reasons I don't think admech will be a new army.

It seems armies are made to target a certain market. The tau for example have been speculated to have been targetted at the asian market.
I can't think of any army which fills a niche which isnt already slightly occupied by another army. It is a huge investment by gamesworkshop to make a new army, sacrificing the sales of other models so they'll only do it if there is a void which can be exploited.

Not since the early 90s have I seen them fully utilize their wall space, so I disagree with the ' there isn't enough shelf space on the store' argument

ForgottenLore
16-01-2012, 01:55
Not since the early 90s have I seen them fully utilize their wall space, so I disagree with the ' there isn't enough shelf space on the store' argument
Really? Most game stores I have been in fight to display the product they have, and most don't even carry a full range of GW stuff.

Chem-Dog
16-01-2012, 02:45
Model updates will be getting smaller in the near future for each subsequent codex release, probably just 1 or 2 units per codex, unless they introduce a lot of new units.


This. Look at the number of new units Vanilla Marines got when their Codex was released. While none of them are utterly pointless, none of them were necessary.
There's never going to be a time that GW decides it doesn't need to expand upon an army's available troop types. If you can't think of anything brand new right at the moment you can plunder the archives for something that's been dropped beforehand or put different guns on an existing chassis.


As much as people say they hate the more SM dexes the only problem is that they are money makers since they have to release only 2 or 3 boxes and a half dozen resin

It's that way because it's been made that way. Even before there were different army lists for SM's they were popular, tacking on additional lists wasn't entirely necessary.
It's been argued over many times before but things like Ork Klans are AS valid for the separate Codex treatment as any particular colour scheme of Marines ever was and if they were used (in preference to Marines) THEY would be the most financially rewarding faction to produce for. Time was we had paint alone to decide what particular character we wanted our models to have.



Although I admit I would love a new race or 2 the only problem is how do you NOT make them just like other armies?

Look at what all the other races have in abundance and look at what all other races do well and go the other way....


HELL YES I WANT MORE RACES! I want the laer

Not gonna happen, Lord Fulgrim expunged that particular xenos blight from the cosmos ten thousand years hence. [/emperors children] :D



It's possible that they could think of another race to add, but the tricky part would be making it suitably different in rules and gameplay from all other races.

Even now, several of the armies are encroaching on the space of others, and GW's creativity department just comes up with "Yet more marines".

There's still plenty of life in the old dog yet. We've yet to see a race that uses swarms as it's basic unit (I think this'd be cool) and we don't yet have any kind of Ogre Kingdoms equivalent with everything on 40mm bases and sporting 3+wounds (yes there are a few particular builds that can approximate it, but nothing Stand-alone) and there's still plenty of wiggle room in the stats bar. Similarly we don't have an army that consists entirely (or mainly) of "Cavalry".



Consider an army consisting entirely of Monstrous Creatures. Nothing smaller than a 60mm base.

The Monstrous Creature rules would need tweaking a little to make an entire army of them anything other than broken but yes, this is an eminently plausible option. Perhaps some kind of symbiotic dual organism (they don't have to be meshed, it could simply be "Big thing + Rider"). The only real obstacle is exactly how much abstraction you're willing to accept.



Genestealer Cults apparently don't have a place in the Tyranid codex, but it would(n't?) be hard to turn them into real army in their own right. Theoretically Genestealer Cults could sit as an option in a Lost and the Damned codex. There are problems there, but perhaps not insurmountable ones.

As a long-time fan of the Genestealer infestation I can say the only real hurdle was GW's assertion that they wouldn't be making any "home ground" armies, everything had to be viable as both defender and attacker.
It's not hard to expand the limited background of Genestealer infestations to encompass the possibility of larger networks of Stealer infested worlds, after all, if the Genestealers are unaware of their underlying purpose and seek only to subjugate entire worlds, there's got to be a point when a world is entirely enthralled. Simply allow for Purestrains born from a cult to be sent out in search of new worlds to bring under their Patriarch's rule.

Oh and there's the sticky wicket as far as which species CAN actually be infested....:shifty:



+++++++++EDIT
Actually. Genestealer Infestation would do well if approached in a manner similar to FW's Siege of Vraks. Initial armies: Imperium Vs Genestealer influenced rebels. It moves up a notch to full-blown 'Stealer infestation Vs A more robust response from the Imperium and finally becomes Tyranid Invasion.

With lots of Stealer Hybrids in resin for addition to human plastics (like the Vraks traitors), Limousines, and an lovely big Patriarch sitting on a throne :D:D:D

GrimZAG
16-01-2012, 03:11
One of the interesting tidbits I heard (large quantities of salt) was that the Nids are not invading, but fleeing a bigger bad.

They're fleeing from Galacticus ;)

And new army could definitely be introduced but would it? I doubt it would be any time in the next 4 years.

I know it irritated the crap out of me that they released Tau without having all the other codices up to date with the latest edition.

hazmiter
16-01-2012, 04:04
Tyranids are fleeing something.... Is it galactus, is it apocalypse, noooooo they're fleeing space monkies.

KarlPedder
16-01-2012, 04:22
God we don't need another Imperial faction the Tau clearly proved you don't need large amounts of existing fluff to add a new faction the setting is a big place with lots of room for "oh they weren't an issue till now cause of that warpstorm". I'm a huge fan of the Hrud if only that the idea that a species that is encountered throughout the galaxy and largely dissmissed could based on their fluff just decide hey its the time of Qohs return lets get organized.

hazmiter
16-01-2012, 04:47
Sadly I must agree, no more imperial factions, unless its an eye of terror style addon. Is it asking too much to see the ulumethi get a place???? Because the inquisition have ulumethi plasma siphons.... It seems they would be interesting.

Chem-Dog
16-01-2012, 05:01
God we don't need another Imperial faction

This is an arbitrary value. Imperial/otherwise isn't a real issue the second you discount Astartes. Of all the factions that would be interesting to see on the Table, I have to say the Adeptus Mechanicus are by far the most compelling (closely followed by my own personal tastes by Genestealer "Cults" and Exodite Eldar, both of which are off-shoots of another existing species). Fluffwise the AM are only half allied with the Imperium even before considering the Dark Mechanicum.


the Tau clearly proved you don't need large amounts of existing fluff to add a new faction the setting is a big place with lots of room for "oh they weren't an issue till now cause of that warpstorm".

How many more times can that get done before it's tired and old?

Beppo1234
16-01-2012, 05:58
Really? Most game stores I have been in fight to display the product they have, and most don't even carry a full range of GW stuff.

I mean GW, not the independents... why would they care about independent shelf space? It's the shelf space at their own stores they worry about. And like I said, I haven't seen a GW store in, hey 20 years now that has been fully packed. I know at my local Toronto GW (when I'm home) has never used more than a 1/4 of it's wall space for product.

they could do a race from another galaxy that has fled the tyranids, and is looking for space to set up shop in the milky way (yes the 'nids are pushing their way into this galaxy, but there could be a number of reasons why this new faction ran here).

another way to introduce a new faction would be for a schism in the Tau empire, resulting in all the subservient races to split off into their own factions. I've always though a Kroot faction would be cool

itcamefromthedeep
16-01-2012, 06:10
Tyranids are fleeing something.... Is it galactus, is it apocalypse, noooooo they're fleeing space monkies.
Speaking of space monkeys and armies on large bases...
http://www.figouz.net/AT-43/img/karmans/karmans.jpg

The game didn't sell well, but I still take these guys to be adequate proof-of-concept that armies on medium+ bases can look good. Of course, that's only an issue if you pretend that Terminator armies haven't been happening all this time.


Of all the factions that would be interesting to see on the Table, I have to say the Adeptus Mechanicus are by far the most compelling (closely followed by my own personal tastes by Genestealer "Cults" and Exodite Eldar, both of which are off-shoots of another existing species).
I had forgotten about the Exodites as an army. Space-elves riding dinosaurs with guns could do well. It could bring a nice Dinotopia (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_vVC1Gsxek3s/TA5cbbJHMwI/AAAAAAAADUM/bZ4texbCmNw/s1600/dinotopia+005.jpg) twist to the game.

Noobie2k7
16-01-2012, 06:11
We did have that Kroot Mercs list. That was pretty damn cool, i still own it (in .pdf though) With some updating to 5th ed (or 6th) they could be rather good. I mean they're a good mutable faction as they evolve depending on who they eat.

hazmiter
16-01-2012, 06:21
@ itcamefromthedeep, that's too cool, suited space monkeys, is totally get some just to have hairy, suited up ogryns......

igwarlord
16-01-2012, 06:39
Speaking of space monkeys and armies on large bases...
http://www.figouz.net/AT-43/img/karmans/karmans.jpg

The game didn't sell well, but I still take these guys to be adequate proof-of-concept that armies on medium+ bases can look good. Of course, that's only an issue if you pretend that Terminator armies haven't been happening all this time.


I had forgotten about the Exodites as an army. Space-elves riding dinosaurs with guns could do well. It could bring a nice Dinotopia (http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_vVC1Gsxek3s/TA5cbbJHMwI/AAAAAAAADUM/bZ4texbCmNw/s1600/dinotopia+005.jpg) twist to the game.

LOL I use those models as my tau army. Lead by CAESAR! ALL HAIL CAESAR THE GOD CHIMP. IT IS HIS WILL WE END MANKIND!

ForgottenLore
16-01-2012, 06:39
We did have that Kroot Mercs list. That was pretty damn cool, i still own it (in .pdf though) With some updating to 5th ed (or 6th) they could be rather good. I mean they're a good mutable faction as they evolve depending on who they eat.
Already done

http://z8.invisionfree.com/KompletelyKroot/index.php?

Pretty good fandex update to the old Kroot list. Hasn't been getting a lot of traffic lately, but I expect that will pick up when Tau get redone.

Righthandedtwin
16-01-2012, 13:38
I admit it would be interesting to flesh out the Xenos factions who seem to suffer a little compared wth Chaos and Imperium factions...perhaps a 2nd "traitor" faction, some force representing Astartes who have turned "Xenos" and sided with Alies, sporting unique Xenos modified power armour as well as goading alien war beasts to battle ect. ect.

I once toyed with the idea by converting a marine chapter who were abandoned by the Imperium and so sided with the tau so they replaced power armoured helms with fire warrior helms, FW backpacks, the big FW Shoulder guard replaced the left hand shoulderguard of the power armour and they sported pulse carbine bolters.

It could well go a long way to developing the TE lore especially if they ever decide to make the official move from M41 (which seems to get a long and longer M41.999) and actually started the lore into M42 where the Imperium factionalises between independant states, chaotic empires and xenos empires :L

itcamefromthedeep
16-01-2012, 17:19
LOL I use those models as my tau army. Lead by CAESAR! ALL HAIL CAESAR THE GOD CHIMP. IT IS HIS WILL WE END MANKIND!
Some of them even have jump packs. They could make great Crisis suits, and there are others that are perfect Broadsides.

luchog
16-01-2012, 21:16
I don't think an entirely new race is needed; and doing so would probably not be feasible. It would simply be too hard to find a way to make them different enough from what already exists. There are pretty much only 3 army types currently (resiliant, horde, and specialist); and not much room left for variation within those three.

What W40K needs far more than new armies is decent support for existing armies; with more timely updates for non-SM (at least one a year) races. It's really annoying to see Yet Another Different-Coloured Space Marine Codex when there are so many Xeno races that are badly out of date with the current edition, let alone ready for the next edition.

That said, I would like to see them bring back some of the older ones that were dropped for 3rd Ed. In 2nd Ed., Eldar players could run an entire army of just Harlequins or Exodites. It would be nice to see one or both get their own codex. It would also be nice to see The Lost and the Damned get a decent codex (which wouldn't require much in the way of new models, unlike Exodites).

As an aside, regarding SM being GW's main focus, it's an oversimplification to say that they get more support because they're the biggest seller. It's more complex than that. They are GW's biggest seller because they're designed to be. They get the lion's share of promotion and resources; and are tailored specifically to be a "beginner's" army. They're far easier for new players to pick up and learn than any other, due to their resilience and simple playstyle. The lower learning curve also makes SMs the most "forgiving" army for inexperienced players; and reduces the chances that players will get frustrated by constant losses while learning how to play competitively, keeping them from giving up entirely.

The Different Coloured Marines are there to keep SM players from dropping out after they get bored with vanilla marines; since they provide a varied player experience without the massive re-investment in models, and steeper learning curve, that switching to a completely different army would require. That way GW can keep a solid base of casual players continually re-investing and providing a steady cashflow; while more experienced and intensive players move on to one of the more difficult-to-play armies.

mdeceiver79
16-01-2012, 21:25
The ad-mech are not a feasible force since the majority of their armies consists titans, ordinatus and other huge fighting machines. It is not in their doctrine to have a 500 point combat patrol with 2 groups of skitarrii and generic names character. The warhound titan requires a game of atleast 2.5k points armies need to be designed for all game sizes.

Mechanicus are about epic force. This is why I maintain they will not be a force in their own right, rather a force to be used in apocalypse giving allied titans and the likes.

I'm sorry but people who are deceiving themselves into believing an admech army is on its way, will only be let down. (shame how it is, i like them to)

And to people hoping the xeno species such as Ulumeathi will be included this has an even lower chance of inclusion. They might be bolted onto the tau as some auxillary force but I think this will be unlikely.

I seem very negative but releasing fluff based armies which have been mentioned in weapons or as allies in current armies just seems like it won't happen.

hazmiter
17-01-2012, 00:05
@ itcamefromthedeep.
What company made those space monkeys?
I want to get some for use in the inquisition as the little techno apes big bro.

ForgottenLore
17-01-2012, 00:40
@ itcamefromthedeep.
What company made those space monkeys?
I want to get some for use in the inquisition as the little techno apes big bro.
they are Karmans fromt he AT-43 game made by Rakham.

AT-43 never really got anywhere despite being a pretty good game so you can probably still find a fair amount of their stuff at half off if you look hard enough.

Noobie2k7
17-01-2012, 00:45
If you gave me like a day i could more than likely give some reasonably unique gameplay mechanics and overall themes for a new race so i don;t see why GW couldn't do it with a massive amount of staff and such resources they have available. I'd be happy with anything so long as it wasn't another SM codex.

igwarlord
17-01-2012, 00:46
The ad-mech are not a feasible force since the majority of their armies consists titans, ordinatus and other huge fighting machines. It is not in their doctrine to have a 500 point combat patrol with 2 groups of skitarrii and generic names character. The warhound titan requires a game of atleast 2.5k points armies need to be designed for all game sizes.

actually a ad mech force would be easy. there are alot of "titans" smaller than the warhound that would easily fit on the new oval base. 3 new dreadknight sized (or bigger) mechs a flyer or 2, 4 types of skitarii and some servitors and BANG! ad mech LIVES

hazmiter
17-01-2012, 01:24
At 43 huh.
The hobby store I frequent has them.... And a myriad of other game systems.....
Might see if I can nab a few, as well as get my resin j packs.

Not gw jump packs, but they are resin, and cheap, and look like pre heresy ones.

laudarkul
17-01-2012, 14:30
Ad Mech/Dark Adeptus...Plenty of fluff and the possibility to cast Knight Titans for 40k games (a la Dreadknight). As for models just some different frames and with the bits various Mechanicum armies can be created (a heaven for hobbyists).

Johnnya10
17-01-2012, 14:58
There's always the possibility that FW will revive a long dead army for 40k, just as they have done with the Chaos Dwarves in WHFB. And now with Tamurkhan, they have their own list too. I wouldn't be at all surprised if FW brought back Genesteeler cults or some of the other older races (You could count Eldar Corsairs as this in a way). Whether they could pull off introducing one with no existing fluff at all... I doubt it.

GW will, in time, release new armies. All business models now regard doing the same thing as stagnation and therefore the opposite of growth (I know it isn't, but this is how that type of person thinks). A new faction/race/species/army represents new revenue because if they make the models cool enough, they will be bought. If they've done their market research, there'll be more than aware that most people don't have just a single army and don't restrict their purchases to a single section of the shelves. Build it, and they will buy it (and build it).

However GW need to show intelligence as to when they do this. One new race every addition of 40k - this may be too much. The balance is struck between maintaining interest by broadening the galaxy and ensuring that existing hobbyists don't feel they're being let down, or that the fluff is becoming watered down (watery fluff probably being 'slop'). I think they got it spot on with the Tau, but if I recall, when Sisters first came out, the response wasn't overwhelming. I don't know why, but there are times for these sort of things to happen, and time to let the galaxy maintain.

Who knows what will come next; space werewolves, robo-fish, beings composed purely of light (probably not the most interesting of paint jobs there), but it will happen. But if it's as good as the Tau, and if GW keep all the other factions up-to-date, well-catered for and interesting, I won't object.

Charistoph
17-01-2012, 22:26
Could there be a new one introduced? Of course.

SHOULD there be a new one introduced? Not if they keep their current, less effective, schedule.

And who forgot Street Sharks?! With Lasers on their ******* foreheads!

Chem-Dog
17-01-2012, 23:03
The ad-mech are not a feasible force since the majority of their armies consists titans, ordinatus and other huge fighting machines. It is not in their doctrine to have a 500 point combat patrol with 2 groups of skitarrii and generic names character.


Tish and pish. The Adeptus Mechanicus have loads of different types of troops already mentioned in various places, they even have a presence in several existing Codexes (anything that's got a Tech-Marine or Engineseer).
There's Magi, Praetorians, Skitarii (and or Tech-Gard) Electro-Priests and Servitors.
Besides, if these things didn't exist a Codex would be the place where these things come into being. Just like everything in the Grey Knights Codex that isn't a Terminator Squad armed with Nemesis Force Halberds.

itcamefromthedeep
17-01-2012, 23:08
And who forgot Street Sharks?! With Lasers on their ******* foreheads!
Games Workshop probably decided to leave those to Privateer Press, who are more than happy to do anthropomorphic comically overly-muscled animals and robots.

Biggy
18-01-2012, 11:51
Hrud for the win! Space rats!

hazmiter
18-01-2012, 23:12
Or biker mice from mars.......
The tech priests have been messing about witht the lab rats......

Charistoph
19-01-2012, 03:35
Games Workshop probably decided to leave those to Privateer Press, who are more than happy to do anthropomorphic comically overly-muscled animals and robots.

Like Mutant Ninja Turtles and Mousers? Or Otroms? Silverhawks? Tiger Sharks? Thundercats? SWAT Kats? Dinosaucers? Pound Puppies?

Okay, I think I'm dry on this line.

-----------

But yeah, plenty of options, really. After all, there are numerous sci-fi stories to glean from and make them Grim Dark times 40,000. In the end, though, they'd have to reduce the Marine codecies to 1 or 2 Loyalists and/or completely revamp their release schedule to handle such a heavy load, as they can't even handle what they have now properly.

Noobie2k7
19-01-2012, 14:20
I'm actually designing a new 40K race at the moment. Going to be plant people.

itcamefromthedeep
20-01-2012, 07:25
I'm actually designing a new 40K race at the moment. Going to be plant people.
If they photosynthesize when shot at by lasguns you will be my hero.

sean_scanlon2000
20-01-2012, 07:51
it is more then possible to introduce a new army to 40k in 6th ed. and is in fact probably more then likely that they will. as they did not introduce anything in 5th they surely will in 6th. there's quite alot of demand for a new army and if you think about it. fitting in a new army isnt that hard. so what if they do 4 or more marine codexes. each release is simply fluff and 1 or 2 model kits. as most of them are in plastic already. so at this point updating their ranges isnt all that difficult. if you look at what they did to the dark eldar its all possible. they just would have to select a race that they could build up and have some serious interest in.

Noobie2k7
21-01-2012, 10:04
Plant people dammit. In my fluff they invade planets not with ships but by sending spores into space that fly off to find another world then just grow more troops on the planet using the spores. Not like mycetic spores but like actual plant ones that hit ground bury underneath the ground then grow a plant man monster gribbly thing. I'm jst sort of slowly working on fluff and seeing how things come along. So far it's just looking like lots of very angry trees and various plants. Going to try and fit various carnivorous plants from real life into the army idea like venus fly traps and stuff. Lots of poison and stuff too.

Axel
21-01-2012, 11:28
The Sororitas certainly need a real codex that allows for armies of the Ecclesiarchy.
The AdMed (already well served with non-GW models) could offer something new.

Deviations of other races would include Grot rebels (kind of mass low level tech, as in tankettes, artillery and kanz, and real masses).

itcamefromthedeep
21-01-2012, 16:19
Plant people dammit. In my fluff they invade planets not with ships but by sending spores into space that fly off to find another world then just grow more troops on the planet using the spores. Not like mycetic spores but like actual plant ones that hit ground bury underneath the ground then grow a plant man monster gribbly thing.That sounds a bit too much like Tyranids to me. I think you'd do better with a mixture of Pod People and Treebeard in SPAAAAAACE.

Noobie2k7
21-01-2012, 16:47
That was the idea, kind of got my inspiration from the Dyrads and Treekin/Treemen from wood elves. Thinking that kinda thing in SPAAAAAAAACE! Give them a special rule for the army that allows you to put forests on the map as terrain. . . .Then spawn guys from it.

Spider-pope
21-01-2012, 17:15
The 40k setting is expansive enough to easily house another army or race, i think its really just a matter of when rather than if we will see another force added to the setting.


grow more troops on the planet using the spores. Not like mycetic spores but like actual plant ones that hit ground bury underneath the ground then grow a plant man monster gribbly thing. I

So, Orks then?

Noobie2k7
21-01-2012, 18:25
Damn, you have a point. Well it;s a work in progress. I'll work something out. Maybe they can only grow using other living creatures, kinda like symbiotes until they grow and eventually take over the host body. I want it to be something weird and grissly.

leonmallett
21-01-2012, 20:07
Re: if could the line sustain another army, I think the answer is yes - with the right investment (which could include bolstering the Design Studio staff presumably).

As to what it should be, then I think in terms of aesthetics, then OK-equivalent/40mm round base as standard makes the most sense to truly stand out, or all models on flying bases.

If going with a 40mm round bases as standard, then that leads to certain design considerations: swarm or big guys? That then starts to define the stat-line and suddenly a very distinctive army could emerge.

My wishlist choice to fill this kind of (perceived) gap? Zoats. Really.

Give them a stat-line to reflect their size etc, and make them a cavalry style army maybe. This would be an army that builds outwards from what has gone before in fluff, yet could look radically different from everything else (even Tyranids since the limb arrangement/morphotype is different - 2-legged vs. centauroid), and with a standard size on a 40 mm base would have a different feel from the get-go.

A small number of different plastic kits could probably do an army if approached as footsloggers with maybe a lander type vehicle.

Noobie2k7
21-01-2012, 21:06
I'd really be interested in an entire army of flyers. (really want to be able to use gargoyles as troops in nids)

Gaargod
21-01-2012, 23:10
Re: if could the line sustain another army, I think the answer is yes - with the right investment (which could include bolstering the Design Studio staff presumably).

As to what it should be, then I think in terms of aesthetics, then OK-equivalent/40mm round base as standard makes the most sense to truly stand out, or all models on flying bases.

If going with a 40mm round bases as standard, then that leads to certain design considerations: swarm or big guys? that then starts to define the tsat-line and suddenly a very distinctive army could emerge.

My wishlist choice to fill this kind of (perceived) gap? Zoats. Really.

Give them a stat-line to reflect their size etc, and make them a cavalry style army maybe. This would be an army that builds outwards from what has gone before in fluff, yet could look radically different from everything else (even Tyranids since the limb arrangement/morphotype is different - 2-legged vs. centauroid), and with a standard size on a 40 mm base would have a different feel from the get-go.

A small number of different plastic kits could probably do an army if approached as footsloggers with maybe a lander type vehicle.


You know, it's interesting, I was considering the suggestion someone made a while back of a mostly cavalry army as somewhat fanciful - just seemed a little "we're different for the sake of being different".
Zoats however, would actually work beautifully as cavalry. It even avoids the problem that would face a cavalry force in 40k - "why do we have transports that allow us to ride horses" (you know what I mean!)

DietDolphin
22-01-2012, 01:24
Damn, you have a point. Well it;s a work in progress. I'll work something out. Maybe they can only grow using other living creatures, kinda like symbiotes until they grow and eventually take over the host body. I want it to be something weird and grissly.

40k is really missing something thats weird and horrific, everything is just "something... IN SPAAAACE!"

I've been working on my own race that are slaves to their own machines that they built, controlled by a Sentient digital overlord/hivemind thing. Its goal is to simply understand everything so use its creatorrace as hosts (which are now grown in pods) to go to war, capture people, suck their brain juices for all knowledge, and then send the mindless-lobotomised human husks into the next battle as a meat shield for their own host slaves. The creatorhost race are basically gunna be about the same size as an ork, except with 4 tentacle arms, 6 eyes and mandibles and have a backpack that controls them with a computer program... Hope that made sense.

Charistoph
22-01-2012, 02:47
40k is really missing something thats weird and horrific, everything is just "something... IN SPAAAACE!"

I've been working on my own race that are slaves to their own machines that they built, controlled by a Sentient digital overlord/hivemind thing. Its goal is to simply understand everything so use its creatorrace as hosts (which are now grown in pods) to go to war, capture people, suck their brain juices for all knowledge, and then send the mindless-lobotomised human husks into the next battle as a meat shield for their own host slaves. The creatorhost race are basically gunna be about the same size as an ork, except with 4 tentacle arms, 6 eyes and mandibles and have a backpack that controls them with a computer program... Hope that made sense.

Sooo..... Matrix in Grim Dark SPAAAaaacce?!

Firaxin
22-01-2012, 04:09
Adeptus Mechanicus. In all honesty, I'd actually be willing to trade Imperial Guard for the ability to play the mechanicus (coming from an IG player). I mean, seriously. Can we think of a faction in 40k that's more unique/better represents the tone of the 41st Millennium?

But then again, I'm the one who wishes standard IG infantry squads came whole on a 60mm base... :angel:

DietDolphin
22-01-2012, 04:29
Sooo..... Matrix in Grim Dark SPAAAaaacce?!

hahaha, not quite :p the idea is that they use the host race simple as a means to kill and conquer. Not for energy. And theres no actual matrix, everyone under the machines control is simply lobotomised kinda. Why send in your own robots made out of precious elements when you can use squeshy biological races to catch bullets for you?

Think more "Robot leeches with one collective conscience......in SPAAAAAaacCe?!!1!"

Beppo1234
22-01-2012, 06:31
hahaha, not quite :p the idea is that they use the host race simple as a means to kill and conquer. Not for energy. And theres no actual matrix, everyone under the machines control is simply lobotomised kinda. Why send in your own robots made out of precious elements when you can use squeshy biological races to catch bullets for you?

Think more "Robot leeches with one collective conscience......in SPAAAAAaacCe?!!1!"


I kind of like this idea. Space Squid Possessors. Have it so each individual squid can control a fixed number of given squads, from any faction. Give some sort of special rule that allows for a little difference in these squads (be they guard, SMs, Eldar, Dark Eldar whatever, say an increase to initiative and/or leadership, the mental attributes rather than the physical, WSBSILD could all be taken from the squid). The weakness would be a chop off the head of the snake kind of thing... Kill a squid, and the squads under control are liberated, and either rejoin their ranks turning on the squidies, or act randomly as if coming out of a coma.

And it would only take the production of one box of squid overlords, the rest of the army could be made up of existing units

I really like this idea. It's just fun

DietDolphin
22-01-2012, 06:49
I really like this idea. It's just fun

Cheers, glad someone liked it!

-The idea of having the creator race was I wanted aleast one race that had been completely taken control of, which could help give the army a bit of a unified look.
-The reason I am thinking robot brainleeches is because there in absolutely no digital enemies currently. Even the necron are just souls trapped in metal bodies. I thought the idea of a cool, soulless digital daemon/god/program/entity could create an interesting dynamic with Mars and the admech.

Beppo1234
22-01-2012, 08:55
Cheers, glad someone liked it!

-The idea of having the creator race was I wanted aleast one race that had been completely taken control of, which could help give the army a bit of a unified look.
-The reason I am thinking robot brainleeches is because there in absolutely no digital enemies currently. Even the necron are just souls trapped in metal bodies. I thought the idea of a cool, soulless digital daemon/god/program/entity could create an interesting dynamic with Mars and the admech.

things after a little while to let it marinate that I like, but would also adapt:

1)don't make them robots, organic is always more fun and allows for something other than something mechanical that will be compared to necrons which are your robots for 40k. Fluff is fluff, if you want them to be 'bots, then they are bots. If they are souls trapped in robot bodies, they are so. Fluff in the end is kind of irrelevant as far as the game is concerned. Paints a pretty picture, but nothing really more than that.
2)all this talk about a race that the tyranids are either running from, or a race that is running away from the tyranids. This would fit nicely into that. A race nearly wiped out by the tyranids, but that has also studied the hive mind, and found a way to create its own drones, without sacrificing its own kind.
3)I like the idea of an army based on a mix of units from all the other codicies. From GW's point of view, it would be used to boost sales of all factions, books and models.
4)I like the idea of space squids more, mostly because they seem vulnerable, but intelligent. Hence why they use other races as fodder and drones. Plus floating alien squids, with fish bowl helmets just screams class old school sci fi to me.
5)I think the fun of the army would be the lack of unified look. But if that's what you want, then you could say that the squidies arrived in this area of the galaxy, and contact was lost with 'this' chapter of SMs... later to be revealed that they had fallen prey to the squidies, and were now the initial back bone of the drone/fodder force.
5b) would be fun if they played the same release game as they did way back when they introduced the necrons for the very first time, but obviously different details and excecution (ie. the imperial excavation unearthing something terribly dangerous, contact loss, new army emerges)

DietDolphin
22-01-2012, 09:41
things after a little while to let it marinate that I like, but would also adapt:

1)don't make them robots, organic is always more fun and allows for something other than something mechanical that will be compared to necrons which are your robots for 40k. Fluff is fluff, if you want them to be 'bots, then they are bots. If they are souls trapped in robot bodies, they are so. Fluff in the end is kind of irrelevant as far as the game is concerned. Paints a pretty picture, but nothing really more than that.
2)all this talk about a race that the tyranids are either running from, or a race that is running away from the tyranids. This would fit nicely into that. A race nearly wiped out by the tyranids, but that has also studied the hive mind, and found a way to create its own drones, without sacrificing its own kind.
3)I like the idea of an army based on a mix of units from all the other codicies. From GW's point of view, it would be used to boost sales of all factions, books and models.
4)I like the idea of space squids more, mostly because they seem vulnerable, but intelligent. Hence why they use other races as fodder and drones. Plus floating alien squids, with fish bowl helmets just screams class old school sci fi to me.
5)I think the fun of the army would be the lack of unified look. But if that's what you want, then you could say that the squidies arrived in this area of the galaxy, and contact was lost with 'this' chapter of SMs... later to be revealed that they had fallen prey to the squidies, and were now the initial back bone of the drone/fodder force.
5b) would be fun if they played the same release game as they did way back when they introduced the necrons for the very first time, but obviously different details and excecution (ie. the imperial excavation unearthing something terribly dangerous, contact loss, new army emerges)

Believe me, I have been thinking over organic vs robotic for a while. On one hand, like I said, 40k lacks something purely mechanical, a computer program turned virus on the lose with no regard to life. On the other hand, making them organic in my opinion makes them more terrifying to think about, which i think ultimately will win me over when I start modelling the army up.

-The more I think about it the more, the more I think It will look better visually being oragnic.
-The Host race is just to give the army a core to build and form around (both from a modelling and fluff point of view) Also the parasite race new someway to get around, I figured this would look more interesting.
-I'll use the ork codex (for games where I can't use my own rules) with masses of 'grots' being mind-controlled humans/eldar meatshield (remember most will be civilians, not soldiers) and 'Nobs' being the Core host race. I2 accounts for them all being mindless.
-This is still a work in progress but I have a basic concept.

Basically I feel 40k could do with 1 more race, but the release schedule couldn't handle it the way it is currently.

Beppo1234
22-01-2012, 10:04
Believe me, I have been thinking over organic vs robotic for a while. On one hand, like I said, 40k lacks something purely mechanical, a computer program turned virus on the lose with no regard to life. On the other hand, making them organic in my opinion makes them more terrifying to think about, which i think ultimately will win me over when I start modelling the army up.

-The more I think about it the more, the more I think It will look better visually being oragnic.
-The Host race is just to give the army a core to build and form around (both from a modelling and fluff point of view) Also the parasite race new someway to get around, I figured this would look more interesting.
-I'll use the ork codex (for games where I can't use my own rules) with masses of 'grots' being mind-controlled humans/eldar meatshield (remember most will be civilians, not soldiers) and 'Nobs' being the Core host race. I2 accounts for them all being mindless.
-This is still a work in progress but I have a basic concept.

Basically I feel 40k could do with 1 more race, but the release schedule couldn't handle it the way it is currently.

I think it would be interesting, if the command race was controlling the drones, and those drones would benefit from the control, rather than dumbing them down. Rather than being mindless zombies. Just fluff the command race up to be super intelligent. Borg queens of 40k. Maybe the host race could be something we know in the 40k-verse already. You could also introduce a concept of tolerance/immunity. Certain races being more ceceptible to control

DietDolphin
22-01-2012, 10:45
The problem with making the drone benefit from being controlled is that it then it loses some of its fear factor. The idea that the controlling parasite slowly sucks the knowledge, lifeforce and energy from the host while the host is consciously aware, yet unable to do anything, having that slow killing effect on the host is what makes them so terrifying. Also I like the idea that while the controlling race is super intelligent, they are absolute cowards without a host. As for certain races being more tolerance/more susceptible, I don't really know if/how they could control Tyranids or Necrons, maybe they have little interest in Orks due to lack of anything to gain mentally or just being hard to control.

EDIT: Perhaps the core host race could benefit from being controlled, which is why they ARE the Core host race, making them unique.

hazmiter
22-01-2012, 11:32
Controlling tyranids would benifit them due to sheer numbers of hosts, and the brutality of them.
Orks, they are wild violent and crazy, so tollerance there.
Marines indoctrination would also allow tolerance.
Imperial guard, plenty of, and are human, have fears, low tolerance.
Eldar, imo highly psychic, so uncontrollable.
Dark eldar are a different case of beer, they can be controlled.
Find out the how's and why's of the race, and what they prey on, what are the weaknesses of that race, tailor accordingly.

+1 cos its a good idea and I like the idea of space Borg, squidbillies from hell.

Beppo1234
22-01-2012, 12:36
I think the idea could work really well in production too. You'd only need 1 box set. It would include 5 squiddies, 4 generic, 1 leader, and a large bunch of squiddy bits (i'm thinking like leechy starfish) that could be added to enslaved units.

KingDeath
22-01-2012, 14:20
The Rak'Gol would be an interesting addition. http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Rak%27Gol#.Txwa2PliaVV
Much less comical than orks but at least equaly savage, eight legged horrors from beyond imperial space.

hazmiter
23-01-2012, 02:34
Rak gol look interesting. 40mm bases as standard too.

Firaxin
23-01-2012, 22:50
Rak'gol look great! Hell I really wanna have those ships of theirs in BFG now.

I feel like that's a term I heard from Star Gate before, though....

DietDolphin
24-01-2012, 06:24
Rak'gol look and sound great, and even after all these years they could quite easily be brought in by GW since nothing has really tampered with their background fluff.

They are sort of a mix of tyranid, ork and kroot.
-Insect looking and from unknown space like tyranids,
-Hunters like kroot yet...
-Brutal, don't ally with anyone and like to fight with crude weapons like orks

Firaxin
24-01-2012, 16:57
Their ship design/main "Roarer Beam" weaponry remind me of the Mass Effect Collectors.

Inquisitor Kallus
24-01-2012, 20:13
The Rak'Gol look awesome. Ive also briefly looked at their ship designs in RT and they are quite unique in style. A cool race

Von Breitholz
26-01-2012, 13:37
Most 40k armies have their counterparts in WHFB (Eldar-High Elfs, Orks well yes Orks and so on) but I would like to se some powertech freaks like Scavengers (a race looking a little bit like Skaven and have the same mindset). It could be fun to see what nastyness and outright stupidness GW could do with this army. Its just my humble thought.

Narf
26-01-2012, 14:31
i'd like to see expansions to current races.

Take guard for example, why not mix a LOTD list into it, allow you to take marines as characters etc, even in normal guard it would work.

You could then also had ad mech.

even genestealer cult, though of course adding stealers etc instead.

The thing i miss is still the ability to take allies in normal games.

make them take up two slots in there group, IE guard take a squad of tactical marines, it takes 2 troops slots, a squad of devs, takes 2 heavy slots etc.

This would also work that marines could take a russ (or squadron) and it takes up 2 heavy slots.

even orks could do it!

theres just a lack of variance compared to what i would like, and i'm bored of fighting my marines against someone else grey/red/silver/black marines.

leonmallett
27-01-2012, 14:37
Part of the problem with mixing and matching units is such as allies or any inducted mechanism (brain leeches whatever), I believe (but I could be mistaken!) that Marines stuff excepted (since they sell in large quantities), GW are wary since it is harder to track what is driving the sales of those kits. Which is why I think those hybrid-style armies from EoT went away.

Noobie2k7
27-01-2012, 14:59
Be easy enough. Games Workshop are stores in which more than just selling stuff occurs right? So it surely wouldn;t be hard for them to actually communicate with players in store. I mean GW stores have staff >.> hell, my local GW had a questionnaire thing where they asked loads of people what they would like to see more of in store (like tourneys, themed battles, that kinda thing) It surely wouldn't be hard for that to be implemented on a larger scale to find out what the players want from their game.

Von Breitholz
02-02-2012, 08:11
Another thing I would like to see for IG is different codexes la SM. Could be interesting, includeing a dex for Traitor IG.

Firaxin
03-02-2012, 01:02
Most 40k armies have their counterparts in WHFB (Eldar-High Elfs, Orks well yes Orks and so on) but I would like to se some powertech freaks like Scavengers (a race looking a little bit like Skaven and have the same mindset). It could be fun to see what nastyness and outright stupidness GW could do with this army. Its just my humble thought.
I think Adeptus Mechanicus would be a better fit for that rather than making up a whole new race. Just take a Skitarii-horde list.


i'd like to see expansions to current races.

Take guard for example, why not mix a LOTD list into it, allow you to take marines as characters etc, even in normal guard it would work.

You could then also had ad mech.

even genestealer cult, though of course adding stealers etc instead.
So you're suggesting taking the IG 'dex--which has the most options of any codex--and mixing in all the possible Lost & the Damned (not Legion of the Damned), Adeptus Mechanicus, and Genestealer Cult options on top of that? Plus options for space marine leaders and elite support units? All in the same book? Sorry, that would be a fail.

I do, however, believe an argument can be made for at the very least creating a Codex: Imperium and Codex: Chaos, one with IG, SM, =I=, SoB, GK, & AM, and the other with LatD, CSM, Daemons, DM, and possibly chaos-worshiping xenos as well. This would allow for combined armies, but only with a core of the most common guys (IG/LatD--thus making the supporting units truly "elite") and doctrines/special characters that allow you to have a heavier emphasis on one of the others but with inherent restrictions.

Putting it all in one place would ensure balance across armies is taken into account and GW could even extort extra money from people by charging $60+ per book when most people would probably only be focusing on one army type ($$$ being GW's only motivating factor, of course).

I'm not sure such a super-codex could be made for the other armies, however. They don't cooperate as commonly as the various armies of the Imperium and Chaos...
However, this extra complexity of those two and the further reduction in start-up costs for xenos armies might actually encourage one of them to become the new populist "noob" army.


The thing i miss is still the ability to take allies in normal games.
A reason this option was taken out (and the reason I think it should still be taken out--unless things really were smushed together into a "Codex: Imperium") was because it was impossible to balance. IG with Grey Knight Terminators, SM with Russ MBTs, etc... it effectively allowed the 4 Imperial armies to ignore their inherent weaknesses.


theres just a lack of variance compared to what i would like, and i'm bored of fighting my marines against someone else grey/red/silver/black marines.
Splitting Codex: Imperial Guard into 4-5 mini-dexes with reduced options isn't going to result in more IG players, or even more variety among IG army lists. What you're complaining about is a combination of player psychology and GW advertising. In WHFB there's more army variety because no army is dramatically pushed by GW at the expense of the others (not that that means competitive players don't all pick the handful of best power-lists). In 40k, however, Space Marines are the poster boys above all else--and on to back that up, they have the most support and most frequent updates from GW. This, combined with their inherent "Jack of All Trades" game mechanics means that the army is simply very appealing to a plurality of gamers. Not because other armies 'just don't have enough variety.' Because as you implicitly note when complaining about red/purple/blue/etc chapters, marines are actually fairly vanilla-bland.


Be easy enough. Games Workshop are stores in which more than just selling stuff occurs right? So it surely wouldn;t be hard for them to actually communicate with players in store. I mean GW stores have staff >.> hell, my local GW had a questionnaire thing where they asked loads of people what they would like to see more of in store (like tourneys, themed battles, that kinda thing) It surely wouldn't be hard for that to be implemented on a larger scale to find out what the players want from their game.
Well the issue with that theory is I think most people buy GW products off the website or from Rogue Traders--especially since so many American-GWs have closed down in the last few years.


Another thing I would like to see for IG is different codexes la SM.
This would be a horrible mistake, imnsho. The IG codex is already chock-full of choices--except for the fact that Doctrines were taken out, it has incredible variety and you can make pretty much any IG-list imaginable. Splitting the IG-dex into multiple copies would only divide and spread those options around, making each individual codex all the weaker and more pigeon-holed for it.

MasterValrik
10-02-2012, 10:08
Yea GW needs to bring back the Squats, miss the lil buggers...

dangerboyjim
10-02-2012, 13:31
Most of these armies could be done with existing codexes and a bit of imagination.

LATD - use the IG codex, conscripts for mutants, ogryns for big mutants, you've got two different psykers to play with.

Genestealers cults - IG allied with Tyranids (OK you need to allies) but consripts for the civvies, penal legion for the hybrids, broodlord and purestrain stealers from the tyranid codex (OK you will need your opponents permission)

AdMech - Let me think... IG codex! Vets for the Skitarri, Sentinels for mobile weapons platforms, Enginseers and servitors already in there. Maybe Ogryns as big combat servitors.

If you want a choas cavalry army led by the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse, you can kind of do that.

I'd prefer to see GW to make new stuff 'around the edges' rules for stuff to add to your army to give it some new options, like the option to add an Admech knight or Exodites, rogue trader (seriously exotic kit), Death Watch kill team, ork madboyz, chaos cultists, rerelease Wulven models etc.

I remember once seeing a WD article where one guy had a sisters army, and with one converted unit, a deamon prince and some deamons he had a chaos army of corrupted sisters, it's that kind kind of low investment to existing army to give it a refreshing option that I would like to see. I like to play narrative based campaigns, so it would be fun weaving some new options into your lists.

x-esiv-4c
10-02-2012, 13:43
The question is, would it be profitable for GW to release and support a new army?