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View Full Version : Skaven cheese!



Rusty_Necron
27-01-2012, 20:46
I'm interested in what you guys think the cheesiest 2000 pt skaven list is! Not really interested in hearing "why do you want to play a cheesy list blah blah blah" keep that to yourself.

I just want to hear some other people's opinions on the most competitive/ cheesy skaven list!

TheOneHawk
27-01-2012, 21:03
2 HPA, grey seer, BSB, 2x 70ish slaves, plague monks with furnace, bunch of engineers, fill to taste.

popisdead
27-01-2012, 22:26
Slaves. Everything else makes the army even more cheesy :S

lovedinplaster
27-01-2012, 23:14
2 HPA is all you need. Fill in with Pwm and plague furnaces, and engineers carrying rocket, death globe, and brass orb

meowser
27-01-2012, 23:53
dont forget the 2x5 gutter runners with poison and slings

Rusty_Necron
28-01-2012, 00:33
Anyone run a list with furnace and screaming bell?

Rosstifer
28-01-2012, 00:40
For real cheese you want double Greyseer and 30 Gutter Runners. It's bloody horrific.

lordfeint
28-01-2012, 09:11
Don't forget to throw in the Storm Banner.

karse88
29-01-2012, 00:49
damn hahaha 2 greyseers!... 2 hellpits!? i need to play with this tonight haha! - isn't there something about you can only bring one greyseer because greyseers never want to share power?

Rosstifer
29-01-2012, 08:18
No, you can have 2 Greyseers, usually one Naked and one with Skalm and the Power Scroll (For 13th on a 13+ to cast...) both take the Dreaded Thirteenth and cast it at every opportunity. I think 1 HPA, 1 PCC and 2 WLC is better than 2 HPA's though. Especially if you play Ogres, your 13th won't do anything, but WLC's do ungodly things to monstrous infantry.

TheOneHawk
29-01-2012, 08:51
13th won't do anything, but against MI, cracks call (which he'll have almost certainly with 2 GS's) will murder **** something fierce.

tmarichards
29-01-2012, 13:57
Double WLC and 45 Gutter Runners would be a good start... double Abomb is a lot less good than may be thought, with Fire magic, light magic and that 10pt banner being so prevalent just about every army will be able to turn Abombs into free points. Double Cannon, on the other hand, is much more brutal.

GodlessM
29-01-2012, 16:34
2 HPA is all you need. Fill in with Pwm and plague furnaces, and engineers carrying rocket, death globe, and brass orb

Pretty much this; 2 HPAs and a Seer and everything else doesn't matter so much.

brother_maynard
29-01-2012, 17:32
depends on your group- if they are all fluff gamers who are unaware of the storm of tool-baggery that you're unleashing, double HPA is the way to go. if they're seasoned tourney-going vets, double cannon is much better. as tmarichards said, HPA's (even 2) go down real easy to players that have the tools/know how to handle them.

Rusty_Necron
29-01-2012, 18:43
You guys are all talking grey seer on foot? Is the screaming bell not with it?

tmarichards
29-01-2012, 19:11
The Bell is pretty decent for points denial, but it does mean that against anyone with war machines it becomes a bit of a vulnerability

Trains_Get_Robbed
30-01-2012, 09:50
Unless your a pro roller and roll the result of everything T7 higher take X-wounds. Grant it, I wouldn't recommend this, but I've seen it happen before.

I disagree about 45 gutter runners, anything with light missile interdiction will make a mess of those free points.

W.L.C is required, however I wouldn't take a single HPA only due to the fact doubles forces target priority tests for your opponent, and the more they fail the more you win. Plus, the BoEF can't be in two places at once. Most Empire/Dwarf/Ogre players take more than one cannon, but if you shield correctly, you can most likely buy at least one turn for each HPA, and hopefully a turn 2/3 charge for the single one to survive and get into combat.

This all being said, this assuming you haven't taken a W.L.C which will be hard to squeeze that in at 2k-2.5k point values, and frankly, the W.L.C can exponentially earn their points back more easily than HPAs can.

Rosstifer
30-01-2012, 11:10
I disagree about 45 gutter runners, anything with light missile interdiction will make a mess of those free points.



Make a mess of 45 Skirmishers with a 6+ Ward that can sneak up on your army? How many armies could do that? The Gutter Runners would take out Warmachines easily, and with the exception of Shades, Skink's and other Gutter Runners there is very little ballistics shooting in 8th.

Coldblood666
31-01-2012, 05:56
So is taking the Vermin Lord just a handicap?

What about Warlords on Bonebreakers, would they do good in a horde of clanrats?

Rusty_Necron
31-01-2012, 06:05
I think the vermin lord is too costly to be with it.

Spinocus
31-01-2012, 17:18
In an 'all comers' list the Vermin Lord would be a MAJOR handicap... too much in fact. Yes, the Verminlord is overpriced... and to make matters worse you cannot use him as your general, thus making his inclusion in sub-3K games highly questionable. His biggest weakness is his survivability, T5 with no armor save and a 5++ Ward save will only get him so far. Extensive shooting and war machines will most likely focus fire on your VL until he's down... and for good reason; he's easier to bring down than an Abom sporting a 4++ Regen and will bag your opponent twice the points!!!

That being said the VL is still an excellent fighter and monster killer, he'll strike before most characters and monsters and when he does his five WS8/I10/S6 D3 Wound attacks will hurt... a lot. He's fearsome versus most rank & file troops (steer clear of ASF anything w/Great Weapons!) and, as with all monsters, gets D6 Thunderstomps versus little things that go squish.

Now if you can tailor your lists to your opponent then the VL should be ok versus non-shooty lists. Other Skaven players have reported good success with the VL versus VC.

Tanglewood
31-01-2012, 21:59
depends on your group- if they are all fluff gamers who are unaware of the storm of tool-baggery that you're unleashing, double HPA is the way to go. if they're seasoned tourney-going vets, double cannon is much better. as tmarichards said, HPA's (even 2) go down real easy to players that have the tools/know how to handle them.

I don't agree. Unless hit by a dwarven flaming cannon, the HPA is always useful.

If you want HPA to do some killing, go two. One will usually die, the other will make the point back.

With 2 abom, split them opposite flank if it's a melee army with high I (WoC/Elves). Else sit them together in centre and hit with both if they're melee army with low I (Orcs/Lizard) or if you suspect the army has no flaming. Not many units stand to double abom charge.

Beside beating face, abom is great at grabbing attention and divert troops away. Generally an opponent spend a lot more points than abom's point cost to deal with it so send it to the flank for the enemy to go on a little goose chase. Of course he can ignore this, but then he'll have abom from the flank.

If you can neutralise enemy's flaming missile, Abom can also take a lot of punishment for the team. This take a lot of heat off the rest of your army so they're useful even just as a punchbag.

Two cannons are nice but they are a lot more random than an abom. I've lost plenty of games where my double WLC misfire or hit nothing all game whilst double abom has never let me down. WLC isn't great against MSU or small units and their misfire table is horrific. Also point level play a factor. 2k or less, double abom. 2.4k and above, probably double WLC

Snowflake
31-01-2012, 22:58
Make a mess of 45 Skirmishers with a 6+ Ward that can sneak up on your army? How many armies could do that? The Gutter Runners would take out Warmachines easily, and with the exception of Shades, Skink's and other Gutter Runners there is very little ballistics shooting in 8th.

Maybe where you play. There's plenty of stuff that would murder them where I play. My own TK army just makes them disappear. Hit on 5's even against skirmishers? Yes plz.

tmarichards
31-01-2012, 23:38
That's certainly true, assuming that the Skaven player moves his unit which can go 10" in any direction to within 32" of the bow unit. A lot of things become less good when the controlling player plays badly.

dementian
01-02-2012, 04:18
That's certainly true, assuming that the Skaven player moves his unit which can go 10" in any direction to within 32" of the bow unit. A lot of things become less good when the controlling player plays badly.

12" actually :P

tmarichards
01-02-2012, 05:10
They're M6? Speedy rats...

Feefait
01-02-2012, 05:22
Why slings and not stick with stars on the Runners? They don't get double shot do they?

dementian
01-02-2012, 07:01
They do get multiple shots and 18" range.

Trains_Get_Robbed
01-02-2012, 08:05
Maybe where you play. There's plenty of stuff that would murder them where I play. My own TK army just makes them disappear. Hit on 5's even against skirmishers? Yes plz.

Agreed. Frankly, I don't know hoe your going to 'sneak' up on anything with 45 rats :lol:. This being said, you know your opponent has scouts, you deploy wide enough with missiles and other ranged weaponry within range, fire away. At the end of the day a -1/2 and a +6 Ward save isn't going to save anything thats T3, just ask my elves XD

A single good shooting phase/magical auto-death spell and their gone. Plus, they'll be in front of you, as your opponent can't deploy in your backfield and are just as easy if not more so to squish in combat.