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tib0lt
13-03-2012, 23:20
Hey guys, i'm currently getting back into 40k with three of my buddies. This time i'd like to get into leagues and tourney type play. So to start out i figured i'd try to throw a three day, non-consecutive, escalation tourney starting at 250 or 300 points. I'd like to find someone elses to get some ideas off of but havn't been able to find the same ball park i'm looking for. For example. I would like to have purchasable upgrades or support tiers. For ex. first 300 points would be 1 hq, 2 troops. then with VP you could potentially purchase elite, fast attack, or heavy support, or more troops / hq if you really wanted to. This would then go up to 500-600 then 750 -900. Any help would be awesome! thanks.

tib0lt
14-03-2012, 01:13
ok, figured i'd make my own. anythoughts? suggestions? help with the allowed organizational chart for day 1, 2, and 3 please :D


Warhammer 40k: Small Escalation Tourney

Duration: The Small Escalation Tourney will take place over the span of three, non-consecutive, days. Each day of the tourney, each player must allot enough time to play two games.
Games: Games are played on a 4 x 4 boards throughout the tourney. All games will be played using the standard missions from the rulebook.
Terrain: Players are expected to setup the tables themselves by alternately placing terrain. Each table must have 25% coverage of terrain, but may contain more (not less) by mutual player consent.
Opponents: During each day of the tourney, each participant will play two randomly chosen opponents, not to include successive opponents. You will be playing various enemies throughout the tourney.
Tier Structure: Throughout the tourney, the value of each participant’s army is limited to, and will begin at, a set point allotment of 250 points. However, over the next two playing days, the number of points allotted will increase by 250 points to a maximum of 750 points. As well, there will be no substituting points previously spent, on different selections. ie. a troop of Space Marines selected on day one may not be discarded and using those points along with the newly obtained 250 points to purchase something new. Only the 250 points may be used. Lastly there will be no use of special characters allowed.
Day one: The Scout
• 250 points maximum allotment and an army composition of:
 HQ x 1
 Troops x 3
 No vehicles may be taken; Apart from dedicated transports
Day Two: The Assault Marine
• 250 newly awarded points to a maximum of 750 points allotment and an army composition of:


Day Three: The Predator
• 250 newly awarded points to a maximum of 750 points allotment and an army composition of:


tib0lt
14-03-2012, 13:45
no thoughts?

Bunnahabhain
14-03-2012, 14:20
Few armies can mange an HQ and 2 troops for 250 pts, so I'd change that. Just use the normal 400-500pt combat patrol rules.

2 x 250 pt games in a day is very, very slow. With competent players, you could have 6+ in a day. At 400-500 pts, you could still happily do 4 in a day, with no hurrying

A three day tournament is odd, they're normally two, to fit a weekend...

Konovalev
14-03-2012, 19:00
Lastly there will be no use of special characters allowed.

You know this breaks some army lists right? If you're of the opinion that all SC are overpowered that's one thing, but if it's your intention to prevent purifier spam or necron board-wide lightning strikes why not just ban those individual SC explicitly?

teheuax
14-03-2012, 20:20
Special characters are not essential. You can get them but not take them in the tournament, so I don't see why it breaking some army lists is a problem.

Bunnahabhain
14-03-2012, 22:00
Special characters are not essential. You can get them but not take them in the tournament, so I don't see why it breaking some army lists is a problem.
You don't know that much about 40k lists then.

Dark angels, for example.
If you want to play Death wing or Raven wing, you MUST take a special character.

Grey knights.
You want to take a henchmen list- i.e you have 60 Inquisitorial storm troopers left from the last codex... you MUST take a named inquisitor.

Daemons.
Most lists are built round a named special character.

etc, etc, etc

teheuax
14-03-2012, 22:10
I know about all those lists, but thank you for insulting my intelligence. But as it stands, you can run a dark angels army without special characters. You wouldn't be able to make the build you want, but you can do that outside the escalation league. You can do so with grey knights also. As for daemons, those are tournament lists. I get along just fine with my generic lord of change.

Theocracity
14-03-2012, 22:29
I know about all those lists, but thank you for insulting my intelligence. But as it stands, you can run a dark angels army without special characters. You wouldn't be able to make the build you want, but you can do that outside the escalation league. You can do so with grey knights also. As for daemons, those are tournament lists. I get along just fine with my generic lord of change.

If this league is just for you and your buddies, and none of them like / want to use special characters, then it's okay.

But if this were a general tournament, you would be putting a large limitation on the lists that people could bring. Anyone who wants to field an army that needs an SC would be excluded, which would hamper the participation.

The fact is, many popular 40K lists rely on SCs, and by banning them you're potentially limiting participation. A more hyperbolic example would be banning vehicles because you don't like them. Sure any army could be fielded under that restriction and might even do alright; but you'd probably lose a lot of people who otherwise would participate.

But like I said, if it's just you and your buddies and you're all in agreement, then whatever.

teheuax
14-03-2012, 22:45
But we are just talking about the escalation league I think. People who try banning at them at real tournaments end up just making different imbalances. Personally I think special characters shouldn't be used in friendly games. But that is just me.

Theocracity
14-03-2012, 22:59
But we are just talking about the escalation league I think. People who try banning at them at real tournaments end up just making different imbalances. Personally I think special characters shouldn't be used in friendly games. But that is just me.

Yeah, that's why I qualified my statements. Between friends any random rule or stipulation is fine, as long as they agree on it. Objections can appear when you open those random stipulations up to environments where not everyone agrees, like an open tournament / league or an Internet forum :).

Gorbad Ironclaw
15-03-2012, 08:35
Personally I think special characters shouldn't be used in friendly games. But that is just me. Why not? There isn't anything terribly special about them. It seems to be one of these weird hang-ups that exist in GW-gaming. Especially for characters like the two mentioned Dark Angels ones who are really just generic options with a different name than Space Marine Captain. If the problem is the narrative then there are much bigger problems in a normal game of 40k, like why are there so many Space Marines and why are they always fighting each other.

DEADMARSH
15-03-2012, 14:13
ok, figured i'd make my own. anythoughts? suggestions? help with the allowed organizational chart for day 1, 2, and 3 please :D


Warhammer 40k: Small Escalation Tourney

Duration: The Small Escalation Tourney will take place over the span of three, non-consecutive, days. Each day of the tourney, each player must allot enough time to play two games.
Games: Games are played on a 4 x 4 boards throughout the tourney. All games will be played using the standard missions from the rulebook.
Terrain: Players are expected to setup the tables themselves by alternately placing terrain. Each table must have 25% coverage of terrain, but may contain more (not less) by mutual player consent.
Opponents: During each day of the tourney, each participant will play two randomly chosen opponents, not to include successive opponents. You will be playing various enemies throughout the tourney.
Tier Structure: Throughout the tourney, the value of each participant’s army is limited to, and will begin at, a set point allotment of 250 points. However, over the next two playing days, the number of points allotted will increase by 250 points to a maximum of 750 points. As well, there will be no substituting points previously spent, on different selections. ie. a troop of Space Marines selected on day one may not be discarded and using those points along with the newly obtained 250 points to purchase something new. Only the 250 points may be used. Lastly there will be no use of special characters allowed.
Day one: The Scout
• 250 points maximum allotment and an army composition of:
 HQ x 1
 Troops x 3
 No vehicles may be taken; Apart from dedicated transports
Day Two: The Assault Marine
• 250 newly awarded points to a maximum of 750 points allotment and an army composition of:


Day Three: The Predator
• 250 newly awarded points to a maximum of 750 points allotment and an army composition of:



I don't mean to sound like I'm asking you a leading question, but what are you going for here? The low points/ no vehicles kind of indicate a Combat Patrol-style of tournament, but you don't really come out and say that, and with Day 3 being called "The Predator", it's sort of confusing as to what you'd like to see on your tables.

The first thing that jumps out at me is the "No vehicles but dedicated transports." You seem to want players to focus on infantry, but allowing dedicated transports could get ugly as a player could conceivably add some terminators with their second 250 points, then a land raider with their third.

I like the idea of players not being able to go back and change their lists; only adding additional stuff with the extra points awarded on second and third days, but you might need to flesh that out a bit more. For example, let's say on the aforementioned Space Marine squad I have 5 marines with no special or heavy weapons. After I get my 250 points for day two, can I make that unit a 10-man and add special weapons and/ or heavy weapons or are day 1 selections completely set in stone at that point? Same deal of course for HQs, dedicated transports, etc.

Kind of in that same vein, do you want players to submit their day 1, 2, and 3 lists at the start of the tournament or is it just first 250 for day 1, then the second 250 for day 2, etc.? This may seem kind of insignificant, but after seeing who all shows up on day 1, some big time list tailoring could take place (not saying that's necessarily a bad thing, just wondering if you'd taken it into account).

Tell us a bit more about what ideally you'd like to see/ encourage/ whatever and maybe we can think up some ways to facilitate that. Like, "Ideally, I want players to use their core Troops/ HQ on Day 1, add some Elites/ FA/ Heavy on Day 2, then for Day 3 really go for it and add some big iconic centerpiece unit like a squad of Terminators or the Eldar Avatar or a vehicle along the lines of the Predator."

Konovalev
15-03-2012, 14:33
I know about all those lists, but thank you for insulting my intelligence. But as it stands, you can run a dark angels army without special characters. You wouldn't be able to make the build you want, but you can do that outside the escalation league. You can do so with grey knights also. As for daemons, those are tournament lists. I get along just fine with my generic lord of change.

So your rational is that: You can make a Codex <army> FOC legal list without special characters, therefore the variety they bring is negligable.

Why stop there? You can make an ork army without a warboss. And a space marine force without a librarian. That's hilarious.